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creatinine/BUN and eGFR

xman280

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Question for other long time lifters and juicers here - what differences have u noticed in your kidney blood tests results. I never stopped training for 19 years and my creatinine , and bun were always high - creatinine specifically in the 1.6 range, which would aslo give me a bit lower gfr but it s been steady thorugh the years. ( they base eGFR on the cratinine results). Last 6 months was dieting to cut weight on the usual cycle stacks and just notice an an increase of my creatinine of 1.9. Will retest in a month but curious to see what you ve experienced....
 

goal245

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My createnine stays in range except for when on tren, even 350mg/week will raise it slightly out of range in just a few weeks, returns to normal right after I stop it.

no other variable seems to affect createnine.

no tren = 1.35 createnine
tren = 1.55

On tren I'm usually dieting with a much better diet and lower cals/protein overall
 

xman280

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My createnine stays in range except for when on tren, even 350mg/week will raise it slightly out of range in just a few weeks, returns to normal right after I stop it.

no other variable seems to affect createnine.

no tren = 1.35 createnine
tren = 1.55

On tren I'm usually dieting with a much better diet and lower cals/protein overall

ah, so tren is the key for you, but it s just so damn good, nothing dries me out as good as tren when on high doses of other stuff...lol
 

goal245

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ah, so tren is the key for you, but it s just so damn good, nothing dries me out as good as tren when on high doses of other stuff...lol

Yea after seeing how much it affects blood work Ill save it for last 6-8 weeks precontest only, I don't feel comfortable with anything out of range even if it's "normal" for bodybuilders
 

jpkoepse

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Once you carry a certain amount of muscle.. isn't it normal to be out of range? That's what I've heard... and as long as egfr is in range you should be good... at least that's what I have heard. I have never had either in range ever. Egfr is always good tho. Doctor who I'm honest with didn't seem concerned either.
 

Flex500

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Question for other long time lifters and juicers here - what differences have u noticed in your kidney blood tests results. I never stopped training for 19 years and my creatinine , and bun were always high - creatinine specifically in the 1.6 range, which would aslo give me a bit lower gfr but it s been steady thorugh the years. ( they base eGFR on the cratinine results). Last 6 months was dieting to cut weight on the usual cycle stacks and just notice an an increase of my creatinine of 1.9. Will retest in a month but curious to see what you ve experienced....

While it is nothing to sneeze at a lot of things can impact creatinine. Although I must say it's generally more stable than BUN. Here are a few things I'd say (I'm no experts like the others but have an advanced degree and sold diabetic supplies for years)....

1. Look at creatinine over the course of time. Ex: I have been 1.45-1.55 for 15 years. That is not as concerning as someone who has been 1.0 for 10 years and suddenly is at 1.75.

2. Are you taking medications? I take an ace inhibitor/diuretic combo for blood pressure and that will raise creatinine 10-20%.

3. How is the totality of your bloodwork and health? Meaning when we look at someone whose bloodwork is normal up and down the line I'm talking lipids, liver values, uranalysis (if you got that), blood pressure and all other blood markers it is likely there is not a major kidney issue. I guess what I mean is I've seen a shit load of patients in kidney failure and their bloodwork, even in early stages most of them have a lot of jacked up numbers.

4. Training, diet and hydration: This does have an affect on your readings although not to the extent many act like it does. I will say if I don't fast, eat an assload of meat, train very hard and don't drink enough while still taking my ace inhibitor/diuretic I can make my BUN go sky high and my creatinine go up another 10-15%. In the other hand we often act like waking a mile will be the reasoning our alt and ast are 150 and not the 150mgs of anadrol we just took :p

Not a bad idea to do a urinalysis or 24 hour urine screen.

I know how this goes hell when I was 20 yrs old a doc sent me to the ER and they were sending me to a person to get on the di or list as my creatinine was 1.58. Went to a kidney specialist and they are and were 100% healthy.

15 years later and I am still 1.45-1.55.
 

xman280

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647
While it is nothing to sneeze at a lot of things can impact creatinine. Although I must say it's generally more stable than BUN. Here are a few things I'd say (I'm no experts like the others but have an advanced degree and sold diabetic supplies for years)....

1. Look at creatinine over the course of time. Ex: I have been 1.45-1.55 for 15 years. That is not as concerning as someone who has been 1.0 for 10 years and suddenly is at 1.75.

2. Are you taking medications? I take an ace inhibitor/diuretic combo for blood pressure and that will raise creatinine 10-20%.

3. How is the totality of your bloodwork and health? Meaning when we look at someone whose bloodwork is normal up and down the line I'm talking lipids, liver values, uranalysis (if you got that), blood pressure and all other blood markers it is likely there is not a major kidney issue. I guess what I mean is I've seen a shit load of patients in kidney failure and their bloodwork, even in early stages most of them have a lot of jacked up numbers.

4. Training, diet and hydration: This does have an affect on your readings although not to the extent many act like it does. I will say if I don't fast, eat an assload of meat, train very hard and don't drink enough while still taking my ace inhibitor/diuretic I can make my BUN go sky high and my creatinine go up another 10-15%. In the other hand we often act like waking a mile will be the reasoning our alt and ast are 150 and not the 150mgs of anadrol we just took :p

Not a bad idea to do a urinalysis or 24 hour urine screen.

I know how this goes hell when I was 20 yrs old a doc sent me to the ER and they were sending me to a person to get on the di or list as my creatinine was 1.58. Went to a kidney specialist and they are and were 100% healthy.

15 years later and I am still 1.45-1.55.


I do use ACE inhibotrs, but creatinine s been stable at 1.6 for years...but at 1.6 and elevated BUN - that puts my eGFR below 60, and the higher that creatinin goes , the lower the eGFR will show, which is the scariest part. Fro 1.6 to 1.93 creatinin my eGFR went down by 10 points...WHOA....in general my blood work is normal with an exception of slight elevated liver enzymes when taking orals, on doses of 3-5 g a week of gear very slightly elevated platelets...even my hematocrit and RBC are in range
 

XstarchildX

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My BUN and BUN/creatinine ratio always come back high. A sports doc said it's normal for people who train hard and carry an above average level of muscle mass to have them test high. I look at the trend over time. It's always about the same and eGFR are always in range, so not too worried :).
 

muscle96ss

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I am currently on dialysis and in need of a kidney transplant(and possibly a heart as well due to complications). I don't mean to scare you but while the 1.6 could be normal; the 1.9 would start to worry me. What is your Bun?

Keep a close eye on it and make sure it doesn't creep any higher. See a nephrologist and have him run some further tests. I thought that doing yearly blood work would be ok and was symptom free when I found out my GFR had dropped to 15; which was too late by that point.
 

suppdude

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How much protein are you eating?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

xman280

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I am currently on dialysis and in need of a kidney transplant(and possibly a heart as well due to complications). I don't mean to scare you but while the 1.6 could be normal; the 1.9 would start to worry me. What is your Bun?

Keep a close eye on it and make sure it doesn't creep any higher. See a nephrologist and have him run some further tests. I thought that doing yearly blood work would be ok and was symptom free when I found out my GFR had dropped to 15; which was too late by that point.

Ouch...
1.6 wasn't normal, it s still high, had proteinurea and they did a 24hrs urinalysis, collecting every sample....and said - eeh should be fine - this was here in a US Army base hospital when I was getting med discharge. Later I went by myself (in fact in europe) and had and ultrasound done, they found no blockages, but a small cyst, creatinine and BUN elevated as usual but ratio was normal, ratio was always normal.
Just this last 6 moths while cutting I happened to feel some unpleasant feeling in the kidney area once and in a while throughout the whole period, and just now did the blood work. BUN is 34, ratio is 17 (normal).
I was always worried about the GFR only , till today when i researched that eGFR is calculated based on creatinine.
 
Last edited:

needthepump

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Question for other long time lifters and juicers here - what differences have u noticed in your kidney blood tests results. I never stopped training for 19 years and my creatinine , and bun were always high - creatinine specifically in the 1.6 range, which would aslo give me a bit lower gfr but it s been steady thorugh the years. ( they base eGFR on the cratinine results). Last 6 months was dieting to cut weight on the usual cycle stacks and just notice an an increase of my creatinine of 1.9. Will retest in a month but curious to see what you ve experienced....

What is your egfr? You are progressing through the stages of kidney disease and are headed towards dyalysis at this rate. I work in a dyalysis clinic and we are seeing more and more steroid abusers coming in who destroy thier kidneys and have to be hooked up to a machine multiple times a week at 4 hours a visit for the rest of their lives. Might want to consider getting off the drugs before you push it too far. Creatinine of 1.9 is scary high. Cut down. on the protein as well.
 
Last edited:

needthepump

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My createnine stays in range except for when on tren, even 350mg/week will raise it slightly out of range in just a few weeks, returns to normal right after I stop it.

no other variable seems to affect createnine.

no tren = 1.35 createnine
tren = 1.55

On tren I'm usually dieting with a much better diet and lower cals/protein overall

Most labs creatinine normal range goes to 1.30, so actually you are out of range and your kidneys are damaged. You could benefit from a high carb, low protein, Vegan diet.
 

needthepump

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Once you carry a certain amount of muscle.. isn't it normal to be out of range? That's what I've heard... and as long as egfr is in range you should be good... at least that's what I have heard. I have never had either in range ever. Egfr is always good tho. Doctor who I'm honest with didn't seem concerned either.

That rumor needs to die. Study's show athletes had an average creatinine of 1.0- 1.3 .....which is still within normal limits. Too many roid abusers think they can get away with high creatinine but didn't ready the study average amounts.
 

needthepump

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While it is nothing to sneeze at a lot of things can impact creatinine. Although I must say it's generally more stable than BUN. Here are a few things I'd say (I'm no experts like the others but have an advanced degree and sold diabetic supplies for years)....

1. Look at creatinine over the course of time. Ex: I have been 1.45-1.55 for 15 years. That is not as concerning as someone who has been 1.0 for 10 years and suddenly is at 1.75.

2. Are you taking medications? I take an ace inhibitor/diuretic combo for blood pressure and that will raise creatinine 10-20%.

3. How is the totality of your bloodwork and health? Meaning when we look at someone whose bloodwork is normal up and down the line I'm talking lipids, liver values, uranalysis (if you got that), blood pressure and all other blood markers it is likely there is not a major kidney issue. I guess what I mean is I've seen a shit load of patients in kidney failure and their bloodwork, even in early stages most of them have a lot of jacked up numbers.

4. Training, diet and hydration: This does have an affect on your readings although not to the extent many act like it does. I will say if I don't fast, eat an assload of meat, train very hard and don't drink enough while still taking my ace inhibitor/diuretic I can make my BUN go sky high and my creatinine go up another 10-15%. In the other hand we often act like waking a mile will be the reasoning our alt and ast are 150 and not the 150mgs of anadrol we just took :p

Not a bad idea to do a urinalysis or 24 hour urine screen.

I know how this goes hell when I was 20 yrs old a doc sent me to the ER and they were sending me to a person to get on the di or list as my creatinine was 1.58. Went to a kidney specialist and they are and were 100% healthy.

15 years later and I am still 1.45-1.55.

Blames everything but the drug use.
 

needthepump

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Before I get asked to leave, i am here because I am tired of seeing young men throw their life away to get swole. Kids lose their dads, wife's lose their husbands so someone can live out their vain fantasy through chemical warfare on their own body.

I work with kidney doctors, specialists in their field. Kidneys are different from the liver, it doesn't bounce back. The scaring is permanent damage. Think about what you are doing to yourselves. You take steroids which thicken your blood which stress the kidneys as they have to work extra hard. These steroids raise your blood pressure which again, damages the filtration system of the kidneys. It's playing with fire and more and more people are being burned, badly. Between the diabetics and steroid abusers, more and more dyalysis clinics will need to be built. I am here because I care.
 
Last edited:

goal245

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Best thing you can do is get a real GFR test not eGFR which is just an estimate.

GFR (Glomerular Filtration Rate) will tell you exactly where your kidney function is at, anything lower or close to 60 and I would hang up bodybuilding unless you are already a top Olympia competitor, then maybe it's worth the risk
 

xman280

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Messages
647
Best thing you can do is get a real GFR test not eGFR which is just an estimate.

GFR (Glomerular Filtration Rate) will tell you exactly where your kidney function is at, anything lower or close to 60 and I would hang up bodybuilding unless you are already a top Olympia competitor, then maybe it's worth the risk

It s never worth the risk if u know u ll end up on dialysis ...fuc that....the thing is that that eGFR changes from month to month and year to year because ur creatinine changes as well due to many factors, as one of the guys mentioned his changes when he uses tren, infections can change it, a guy from another forum had a situation where his creatinine was 2500 - unknown cause, eventually later cleared and is back to normal, a friend of mine had a eGFR of 15 due to a kidney infection (bacteria) and he wasnt even an athlete, back to normal now at age 49....there are many many factors.....and listen to a doctor who doesnt know anything about test results in bodybuilders is the worst. A cpl of years ago they wanted to admit me in a hospital because my ASL, ALT and GGT were mid 3 digits - his exact words were - you are in avery poor health and have toxic hapatitits. all I did was stopped the dbal and the statins for two weeks, took essentiale forte and trasmetil 500 and exactly 2 weeks later went to another doctor with liver enzymes just a few points higher than normal, she looked at both results and said - YOU ARE JUST FINE, whatever it was causing it is gone...
 

little slice

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It s never worth the risk if u know u ll end up on dialysis ...fuc that....the thing is that that eGFR changes from month to month and year to year because ur creatinine changes as well due to many factors, as one of the guys mentioned his changes when he uses tren, infections can change it, a guy from another forum had a situation where his creatinine was 2500 - unknown cause, eventually later cleared and is back to normal, a friend of mine had a eGFR of 15 due to a kidney infection (bacteria) and he wasnt even an athlete, back to normal now at age 49....there are many many factors.....and listen to a doctor who doesnt know anything about test results in bodybuilders is the worst. A cpl of years ago they wanted to admit me in a hospital because my ASL, ALT and GGT were mid 3 digits - his exact words were - you are in avery poor health and have toxic hapatitits. all I did was stopped the dbal and the statins for two weeks, took essentiale forte and trasmetil 500 and exactly 2 weeks later went to another doctor with liver enzymes just a few points higher than normal, she looked at both results and said - YOU ARE JUST FINE, whatever it was causing it is gone...


i hope you mean CPK
 

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