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Heavy or light first

Nothing should be light. You should be using a weight appropriate for the rep range. I do sets of 20 for back but they are still heavy as I can go where I fail between 17-18 reps and can still get a few more out

Never focus on a pump, use the weight to stress the muscle but you can use higher rep ranges but your goal isn’t the pump

👏
 
Not that one is better than the other, but the bigger stronger guys I know end up moving toward this "activation" type work FIRST as a way to avoid injury. A good few sets of flies BEFORE you do your heaviest pressing will basically guarantee you are fully warmed up and ready to roll. When i was young and dumb, i would go right into the heavy shit. Now i make sure the blood is flowing and I feel very warm. YES, the load might decrease a bit because of this but i'm saving myself from stupid injuries for sure.
Makes perfect sense and aligns with the videos I've watched from John. More to prevent injury than "better" than compound/heavy/lower reps first.
 
I thought it was calisthenics? Or did he switch to “higher volume”? I forget
Calesthenics rotated with boxing with a pinky twist kickback, pink dumbbell, as a finisher. Followed by 2.6g creatinine and 1 oz each of beef, chicken, liver, ham, + 3 mushrooms post workout in a shake.
 
Calesthenics rotated with boxing with a pinky twist kickback, pink dumbbell, as a finisher. Followed by 2.6g creatinine and 1 oz each of beef, chicken, liver, ham, + 3 mushrooms post workout in a shake.
nice

Can you list out your current training you are doing over the week as well as your current goals?
 
It's all been covered by OTT. As need4tren posted it's not about getting a pump as such. A great pump is a byproduct of a good set. All systems work. Some don't believe in "activation" and I understand that but I do some of that at times mainly due to injury prevention. Forgetting about that though I think nearly everyone starts with lighter sets because we all warm up to our heavy sets. Some take longer than others and have many different approaches. Although you shouldn't be looking at just getting a pump. Those earlier sets should be to failure (or close to) regardless if the rep range is higher. Any training is better than none but don't waste your time in the gym doing countless "pump" sets not going anywhere near failure. Now if those "pump" sets are fucking hard and intense then you are gtg but the way you refer to things it doesn't sound like that's the case.

I do many different rep ranges pretty much every workout. There are a variety of reasons why I do that and some things are just better suited to certain rep ranges and that could be due to genetic response, results, injuries, feeling, enjoyment etc. I would never go straight into some heavy 4-6 rep work on my 1st exercise (even after warm ups). If I were to do a push day I would never start with bench press and low reps (even after warm ups). I would always start with a lateral raise before pressing for example. For chest I would do a pec deck and/or machine press first before doing any 4-8 rep presses.

For me there is no set way even if my training split hasn't changed for years I still rotate approaches according to different variables. Although in relation to your question I tend to do higher rep work leading into lower rep work then finishing off with higher rep work again my answer is both approaches in the 1 session with the low rep stuff being in the middle. I often don't go to complete failure in the first 15 mins of a session because I have always been careful in warming up my mind/body because unlike probably 90% of people my failure really is failure and I would be stupid doing that when cold and not warmed up.
 
As need4tren posted it's not about getting a pump as such. A great pump is a byproduct of a good set. All systems work. Some don't believe in "activation" and I understand that but I do some of that at times mainly due to injury prevention.
Agreed, pump is more about hydration status and water retention than anything… but fuck it does make the session way more fun! It’s easier to push hard when you’re getting a great pump in my opinion
 
Agreed, pump is more about hydration status and water retention than anything… but fuck it does make the session way more fun! It’s easier to push hard when you’re getting a great pump in my opinion

Of course. A pump is extremely important and feels great. It tells a lot as well so if someone isn't getting good muscle pumps that's a sign something is off.
 
Of course. A pump is extremely important and feels great. It tells a lot as well so if someone isn't getting good muscle pumps that's a sign something is off.
Agreed, a solid indicator whether you are targeting the muscle correctly.

Advantageous too because once you get that pump going, it’s going to be much easier to target that muscle in the coming sets as you can feel it way more.
 
I do light first then heavy. When i say light i mean i prepare myself for the last set , first almost to failure , second to failure with partial reps when cant do any more reps with controlled form. I am also lower on volume - around 10 sets per week.
 
Until i won't reach 300lbs (so never in my life) i will train low volume high intensity, with a TOP SET (call it working set whatever) and BACK OFF (-20% weight from the TOP SET):

• Chest, Shoulders, Back, Hamstrings & Glutes; 6-10 Reps
• Biceps, Triceps, Adductors; 8-12 Reps
• Quads, Calves & Abs; 10-15 Reps

Reps also depend on the exercise i do, 6-10 reps of lateral raises, in my opinion won't do much, more 10-15 reps, and you can apply that to other exercises.


I don't understand why all people want to add rest pause, dropsets, etc, to their workouts, when most of them don't even move a decent amount of weight for every exercise....
I think that once you are strong enough, you can raise your volume, drop intensity a bit and continue growing, but this won't happen when you are 200lbs on a good day.
 
nice

Can you list out your current training you are doing over the week as well as your current goals?
Goal, just be healthy, maintain weight/bf, get 8+ hours sleep a night (new years resolution), keep gym time to less than 1hr day, try new stuff

Essentially...I realized I was spending too much time in the gym doing high volume..combined with work lack of sleep was feeling burnt out...liked the results but not sustainable...so wanted to try something new

Every day 2 sets of chinups, dips, squats, abs
Then after the main movement hit 1-2 accessory exercises..bis/Tris/delts/traps, whatever needs work
150 minutes liss per week (hiking, elliptical etc)
 
It's all been covered by OTT. As need4tren posted it's not about getting a pump as such. A great pump is a byproduct of a good set. All systems work. Some don't believe in "activation" and I understand that but I do some of that at times mainly due to injury prevention. Forgetting about that though I think nearly everyone starts with lighter sets because we all warm up to our heavy sets. Some take longer than others and have many different approaches. Although you shouldn't be looking at just getting a pump. Those earlier sets should be to failure (or close to) regardless if the rep range is higher. Any training is better than none but don't waste your time in the gym doing countless "pump" sets not going anywhere near failure. Now if those "pump" sets are fucking hard and intense then you are gtg but the way you refer to things it doesn't sound like that's the case.

I do many different rep ranges pretty much every workout. There are a variety of reasons why I do that and some things are just better suited to certain rep ranges and that could be due to genetic response, results, injuries, feeling, enjoyment etc. I would never go straight into some heavy 4-6 rep work on my 1st exercise (even after warm ups). If I were to do a push day I would never start with bench press and low reps (even after warm ups). I would always start with a lateral raise before pressing for example. For chest I would do a pec deck and/or machine press first before doing any 4-8 rep presses.

For me there is no set way even if my training split hasn't changed for years I still rotate approaches according to different variables. Although in relation to your question I tend to do higher rep work leading into lower rep work then finishing off with higher rep work again my answer is both approaches in the 1 session with the low rep stuff being in the middle. I often don't go to complete failure in the first 15 mins of a session because I have always been careful in warming up my mind/body because unlike probably 90% of people my failure really is failure and I would be stupid doing that when cold and not warmed up.
Thank you I know you love training talk and value your input! Yeah whenever I say pump or lighter work I basically mean higher reps, maybe faster contractions or short rest intervals.but still taken to failure. Never liked rir...I think I tried it once and hated it. To me I need a definite signal to end the set it would drive me crazy thinking "ok I think I'm 2 short of failure, or maybe 3, so let's stop.". Obviously deads squats are a different animal than arm or shoulder exercises. I actually like to take them beyond failure (drop sets, myo reps, seth sets) as I've never been worried about overtaining small parts
 
Man with all due respect your overthinking is a disease...

You write yourself that you only want to maintain it, so what's the problem with experimenting? If you just want to maintain it, you can do something different during each training session because you don't need to track your progress and in fact you don't even need to do anything else.
 
Man with all due respect your overthinking is a disease...

You write yourself that you only want to maintain it, so what's the problem with experimenting? If you just want to maintain it, you can do something different during each training session because you don't need to track your progress and in fact you don't even need to do anything else.
Exactly, I'm just trying new things. This thread wasn't to get permission to do a certain way or ask if switching will cause me to lose all my gains or get closer or further from "optimal" just to get others thoughts on two ways to structure training.
 
To maintain 180 lbs and be "lean" you can do literally anything and it will work. It's not hard to be average as fuck. I have never even understood why you use steroids at all honestly.

I think he also uses slin

Many people use drugs because they like to use drugs, regardless of whether or not they are maximizing their protocols to the max or whether or not they need to use drugs to reach their goals.

And like means, I like to be euphoric and feel invincible... or I just like to skirt the laws of my country or I like to take risky things.

I think these incentives are much more important than people might think.
 
Wondering what people prefer if your someone that does heavy, lower reps, try and increase weight... combined with higher rep pump work in the same session.

Seems like heavy followed by light is the most common approach and what I always did. But after reading up on alot of John Meadows techniques and how he sequences exercises I switched up and get a better pump by doing higher reps then a heavy finisher.

What approach do you prefer
Greatly overthinking this. Do one way for a bit get stale then do the other way. Analysis paralysis. In the end after a while wont make any noticeable difference. Does a pro basketball player obssess over how many jumpers from the right side vs left is about ...whther to take 10 shots or 12 shots from each spot or ...really makes no freaking difference. Recoverable volume, good tension and control, not getting hurt, etc alot more important than heavy first etc or 6 reps or 8 reps. Not like you can do the same thing all the time anyways.
 
I am still nursing my shoulder so I just do light stuff.. Slow.and.controlled.on the.eccentric part of the movement and about twice the.speed on the.concentric part. Full range of motion like ill go ass.to.floor.on squats and my knees.feel great. I would not be surprised if.I use less weight than anyone on this site. My shoulder is.feeling a.ton better and I can do a little more with a little less pain every time I train them. Still can't do any incline chest stuff as I get more pain than I am comfortable with and not feeling like I am making it worse. Can't do any flies.either. I am also 45 so I gotta take a little better care of myself then when i was young and invincible.
 
Today's back workout

Deadlift, all sets with the same weight, 10-8-7 reps. Before the first set I will have done 5 or 6 warm-up sets increasing the weight. I don't know if anyone on the planet takes these light series into account, but I don't understand why they would.

Barbell Rowing, 3 sets of 9 reps, in this case I reduce a couple of pounds in each set to keep the reps range where I want it to be.

Then I've done trapeze and biceps.

So, I don't know what qbkilla means about training heavy first heavy or light. 🤪
 

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