Luki Offseason - blow up arms at 3" with SYNTHEROL(road do 320lbs)

[SherlockFoam]

probably yes

I'm definitely going back to the high test, I will ramp up to 2.5 or maybe even 3g and the rest only as a small addition. The test will be the main driver of growth

How did you like the high dose EQ in hind sight?

 

[luki7788]

How did you like the high dose EQ in hind sight?

the look is good, I also have no side effects from the EQ but e.g. my strength is 25% lower than on the high test

 

[psychor]

the look is good, I also have no side effects from the EQ but e.g. my strength is 25% lower than on the high test

Were you "fuller" looking with the EQ? Also, what do you think the decrease in strength is due to with EQ? Thanks!

 

[luki7788]

Were you "fuller" looking with the EQ? Also, what do you think the decrease in strength is due to with EQ? Thanks!

the decrease in strength is due to a lower test, i.e. less androgenicity

and I wasn't fuller, I'm evidently more full on the high test than on the high EQ

 

[jaxino]

So you will run something like:
1,7-3g Test
400+ Tren for nutrient partitioning, igf1 etc
Some Deca for joints
HGH + Insulin

I remember that on gh15 a guy from Portugal posted a similar cycle from a 212 ifbb amateur fighting for the procard.
The cycle was around that but with:
high Test
low deca
low eq
HGH
Lantus first thing am ed
R insulin prewo
Humalog postwo


I can post the whole protocol if interested....

 

[Picture]

So you will run something like:
1,7-3g Test
400+ Tren for nutrient partitioning, igf1 etc
Some Deca for joints
HGH + Insulin

I remember that on gh15 a guy from Portugal posted a similar cycle from a 212 ifbb amateur fighting for the procard.
The cycle was around that but with:
high Test
low deca
low eq
HGH
Lantus first thing am ed
R insulin prewo
Humalog postwo


I can post the whole protocol if interested....

Yes please write it

 

[thedorkyd1]

Yes please write it

If you've been training seriously and using peds for 4-5 years I would've expected a larger and or leaner physique. We are the same height and I was 225 after my first cycle and I'd only been training a year before that. Now my doses have definitely increased since then but I think there might be something wrong in the nutrition/training department on your end

 

[TheRoid]

the look is good, I also have no side effects from the EQ but e.g. my strength is 25% lower than on the high test

A 25% drop is immense, like going from benching 280 to 210. Was It really THAT bad?

 

[Picture]

If you've been training seriously and using peds for 4-5 years I would've expected a larger and or leaner physique. We are the same height and I was 225 after my first cycle and I'd only been training a year before that. Now my doses have definitely increased since then but I think there might be something wrong in the nutrition/training department on your end

You are correct, I have my vices, physical limitations etc. I’m always trying to be better, but I have certainly missed meals and held back during training.

My max doses prior to what I’ve toted here recently are 1.2-5g. If I could actually do the programs and protocols I write itd be a different story haha

 

[thedorkyd1]

You are correct, I have my vices, physical limitations etc. I’m always trying to be better, but I have certainly missed meals and held back during training.

My max doses prior to what I’ve toted here recently are 1.2-5g. If I could actually do the programs and protocols I write itd be a different story haha

It would be...I don't know if I'd bother introducing more gear if you can't eat/train properly. My biggest struggle at the moment is eating but I'm at a minimum of 7k calories a day so it's a little different.

If you arent eating/training properly more gear will be disappointing...apart from maybe the introduction of hgh because that will change for the better no matter what

 

[Picture]

It would be...I don't know if I'd bother introducing more gear if you can't eat/train properly. My biggest struggle at the moment is eating but I'm at a minimum of 7k calories a day so it's a little different.

If you arent eating/training properly more gear will be disappointing...apart from maybe the introduction of hgh because that will change for the better no matter what

I use gh when I can buy it, in 6-10iu range

Eating is 100% my weakest link

I’ve seen you come up before pertaining high doses on another platform

 

[Wonton]

A 25% drop is immense, like going from benching 280 to 210. Was Itork really THAT bad?

Idk my thing is if your losing strength because of muscle loss
Increase back up

Or you lost strength but muscle mass remains -
Then fuck it work muscle hard and get bigger and try to get strength up

But I believe luki and few others think higher strength --- better chance to build more muscle

But imo long as mass remains, rest is all ego - build at lower strength - your gonna work hard anyway

 

[jaxino]

OFFSEASON FOR INTERMEDIATE 212lbs
1750mg TestE
600mg EQ
600mg Deca
Ai as needed
Kept Clen eod year round.. this season was 20-30mcg. Cardio was kept eod too alongside Clen - fasted Cardio.
cardio is built during last 12 weeks of prep reaching 45-60min ed on peak.
he may spice things up with orals or not depending on mood..

Carb Cycle year round - 1 day High / 1 days low,
some times change the Carb Cycle Structure like 3high/1 low or 3 low / 1 high.
He does not go insane with carbs.. it also do not go insane with insulin...

Proteins are Cycled But kept High Year Round at 350-450gr.

Fats are kept low most of the time..

After a While Test is reduced to 1500mg and kept here for longer..even close to prep..

This Strategy are more and more used with High Level Competitors but they also rely more on Ai.
this time Letrozol 2.5mg eod.

Now while Test is kept at 1500mg

at 12 weeks out Test is Reduced to 1250mg multiple Esters.

Deca and EQ Ratio starts to change
700mg EQ
500mg Deca
..
800mg EQ
400mg Deca
...
900mg EQ
300mg Deca
...
1000mg EQ
200mg Deca
last pin is 6 weeks out with both
at 6 weeks out, when Deca and Eq are pulled out

at 5 weeks out
Trenbolone Ace was introduced at 800mg/wk - peak week was 1050mg.
Masteron Prop was 1050mg during this 6 weeks.
Test is now Test Prop or Phenyl Prop only but still dosed at 1050mg/wk!
4 weeks out Test P or PP is now 700mg
3 weeks out 350mg
2 weeks out 200mg and kept till 5-4 days out!
sometimes higher Test..

but Letrozol was 2.5mg/ed last 6 weeks.
and last week 1mg Anastrozol was added.
Cabergoline was 0.5mg 2 times a week year round..

50-75mcg T4 is used almost year round too - some times T3 introduced but not sure about doses on this.

Winstrol Tabs were Introduced at 100mg/ed last 4 weeks - last week peaked at 150mg/ed.

2 weeks Out Halotestin was Introduced at 50mg/daily.

Usually Genotropin is the Hgh used,
but when getting very near show usually switch for Norditropins that seems to enhance skeletor look..
Doses are 8iu almost year round and are kept till 4days out.

Insulin is Lantus 25iu on Awake
Regular 15iu Pre Workout
Log 15iu Post workout

when getting close to the show stick with Humalog only - 10-15iu Pre Workout.
Insulin is cycled 4 weeks On / 4 weeks Off.

Testosterone its not cycled..is tappered from offseason slowly but mostly High till very nlear show, changing esters only.

Oxymetholone was Introduced on Carb Up only for 3 days at 150mg/ed.

ECA is used ed from week 10 to week 2
not sure about doses..

here is dropped and clen goes from eod 20-30mcg to ed 60-120mcg

sodium is kept 3-4gr year round till 1 day out.
Show day is 1-2gr..

Dyazide is introduced last 3 days on awake at
1 tab - 1/2 tab - 1/4tab
water is +5liters year round and kept till 1 day out where is reduced and reduced again on peak day but is there.
water and sodium are used by mirror on show day.

Depletion is 4-5days - carb up usually 3 days

Depletion is mainly Veggies+fish and Eggwhites

Carb Up is usually
Sweet Potato/Banana/Rice
Humalog was there at 3-5iu per meal

some red meat and whole eggs on peak day,
may get some nuts and pinneaple!

 

[dany23x]

OFFSEASON FOR INTERMEDIATE 212lbs
1750mg TestE
600mg EQ
600mg Deca
Ai as needed
Kept Clen eod year round.. this season was 20-30mcg. Cardio was kept eod too alongside Clen - fasted Cardio.
cardio is built during last 12 weeks of prep reaching 45-60min ed on peak.
he may spice things up with orals or not depending on mood..

Carb Cycle year round - 1 day High / 1 days low,
some times change the Carb Cycle Structure like 3high/1 low or 3 low / 1 high.
He does not go insane with carbs.. it also do not go insane with insulin...

Proteins are Cycled But kept High Year Round at 350-450gr.

Fats are kept low most of the time..

After a While Test is reduced to 1500mg and kept here for longer..even close to prep..

This Strategy are more and more used with High Level Competitors but they also rely more on Ai.
this time Letrozol 2.5mg eod.

Now while Test is kept at 1500mg

at 12 weeks out Test is Reduced to 1250mg multiple Esters.

Deca and EQ Ratio starts to change
700mg EQ
500mg Deca
..
800mg EQ
400mg Deca
...
900mg EQ
300mg Deca
...
1000mg EQ
200mg Deca
last pin is 6 weeks out with both
at 6 weeks out, when Deca and Eq are pulled out

at 5 weeks out
Trenbolone Ace was introduced at 800mg/wk - peak week was 1050mg.
Masteron Prop was 1050mg during this 6 weeks.
Test is now Test Prop or Phenyl Prop only but still dosed at 1050mg/wk!
4 weeks out Test P or PP is now 700mg
3 weeks out 350mg
2 weeks out 200mg and kept till 5-4 days out!
sometimes higher Test..

but Letrozol was 2.5mg/ed last 6 weeks.
and last week 1mg Anastrozol was added.
Cabergoline was 0.5mg 2 times a week year round..

50-75mcg T4 is used almost year round too - some times T3 introduced but not sure about doses on this.

Winstrol Tabs were Introduced at 100mg/ed last 4 weeks - last week peaked at 150mg/ed.

2 weeks Out Halotestin was Introduced at 50mg/daily.

Usually Genotropin is the Hgh used,
but when getting very near show usually switch for Norditropins that seems to enhance skeletor look..
Doses are 8iu almost year round and are kept till 4days out.

Insulin is Lantus 25iu on Awake
Regular 15iu Pre Workout
Log 15iu Post workout

when getting close to the show stick with Humalog only - 10-15iu Pre Workout.
Insulin is cycled 4 weeks On / 4 weeks Off.

Testosterone its not cycled..is tappered from offseason slowly but mostly High till very nlear show, changing esters only.

Oxymetholone was Introduced on Carb Up only for 3 days at 150mg/ed.

ECA is used ed from week 10 to week 2
not sure about doses..

here is dropped and clen goes from eod 20-30mcg to ed 60-120mcg

sodium is kept 3-4gr year round till 1 day out.
Show day is 1-2gr..

Dyazide is introduced last 3 days on awake at
1 tab - 1/2 tab - 1/4tab
water is +5liters year round and kept till 1 day out where is reduced and reduced again on peak day but is there.
water and sodium are used by mirror on show day.

Depletion is 4-5days - carb up usually 3 days

Depletion is mainly Veggies+fish and Eggwhites

Carb Up is usually
Sweet Potato/Banana/Rice
Humalog was there at 3-5iu per meal

some red meat and whole eggs on peak day,
may get some nuts and pinneaple!

I have seen something similar on an Italian 212

to always stay within the weight and not go too far, cardio 45/60 min all year round, cycling stimulants; the only difference is that his coach makes him use Trenbolone all year round

 

[luki7788]

A 25% drop is immense, like going from benching 280 to 210. Was It really THAT bad?

Yes, in the past, my standard dose for offseason test was about 2-2.2g week, for almost 2 years I had been holding the test for about 1500mg and higher anabolics and, for example, earlier bench press incline 8x180kg now 10-8x140kg so the decrease in strength is significant but my muscle mass is oddly bigger than ever before

Idk my thing is if your losing strength because of muscle loss
Increase back up

Or you lost strength but muscle mass remains -
Then fuck it work muscle hard and get bigger and try to get strength up

But I believe luki and few others think higher strength --- better chance to build more muscle

But imo long as mass remains, rest is all ego - build at lower strength - your gonna work hard anyway

that's exactly what i believe - more strength = more muscle

So my thinking is that if I have more muscle mass than before but less strength then if I return to my old strength my mass will increase even more

 

[luki7788]

So you will run something like:
1,7-3g Test
400+ Tren for nutrient partitioning, igf1 etc
Some Deca for joints
HGH + Insulin

I remember that on gh15 a guy from Portugal posted a similar cycle from a 212 ifbb amateur fighting for the procard.
The cycle was around that but with:
high Test
low deca
low eq
HGH
Lantus first thing am ed
R insulin prewo
Humalog postwo


I can post the whole protocol if interested....

Something like that, maybe a little higher with trenbolone or nandrolone, I don't know yet. Maybe I'll push the test even higher as long as it controls aromatization. I am 34 years old (I finish in December) so in fact until I am around 40 I still have time to push things forward, so there is nothing to wait for - then I will only try to keep a relatively large size and low% bf

 

[luki7788]

OFFSEASON FOR INTERMEDIATE 212lbs
1750mg TestE
600mg EQ
600mg Deca
Ai as needed
Kept Clen eod year round.. this season was 20-30mcg. Cardio was kept eod too alongside Clen - fasted Cardio.
cardio is built during last 12 weeks of prep reaching 45-60min ed on peak.
he may spice things up with orals or not depending on mood..

Carb Cycle year round - 1 day High / 1 days low,
some times change the Carb Cycle Structure like 3high/1 low or 3 low / 1 high.
He does not go insane with carbs.. it also do not go insane with insulin...

Proteins are Cycled But kept High Year Round at 350-450gr.

Fats are kept low most of the time..

After a While Test is reduced to 1500mg and kept here for longer..even close to prep..

This Strategy are more and more used with High Level Competitors but they also rely more on Ai.
this time Letrozol 2.5mg eod.

Now while Test is kept at 1500mg

at 12 weeks out Test is Reduced to 1250mg multiple Esters.

Deca and EQ Ratio starts to change
700mg EQ
500mg Deca
..
800mg EQ
400mg Deca
...
900mg EQ
300mg Deca
...
1000mg EQ
200mg Deca
last pin is 6 weeks out with both
at 6 weeks out, when Deca and Eq are pulled out

at 5 weeks out
Trenbolone Ace was introduced at 800mg/wk - peak week was 1050mg.
Masteron Prop was 1050mg during this 6 weeks.
Test is now Test Prop or Phenyl Prop only but still dosed at 1050mg/wk!
4 weeks out Test P or PP is now 700mg
3 weeks out 350mg
2 weeks out 200mg and kept till 5-4 days out!
sometimes higher Test..

but Letrozol was 2.5mg/ed last 6 weeks.
and last week 1mg Anastrozol was added.
Cabergoline was 0.5mg 2 times a week year round..

50-75mcg T4 is used almost year round too - some times T3 introduced but not sure about doses on this.

Winstrol Tabs were Introduced at 100mg/ed last 4 weeks - last week peaked at 150mg/ed.

2 weeks Out Halotestin was Introduced at 50mg/daily.

Usually Genotropin is the Hgh used,
but when getting very near show usually switch for Norditropins that seems to enhance skeletor look..
Doses are 8iu almost year round and are kept till 4days out.

Insulin is Lantus 25iu on Awake
Regular 15iu Pre Workout
Log 15iu Post workout

when getting close to the show stick with Humalog only - 10-15iu Pre Workout.
Insulin is cycled 4 weeks On / 4 weeks Off.

Testosterone its not cycled..is tappered from offseason slowly but mostly High till very nlear show, changing esters only.

Oxymetholone was Introduced on Carb Up only for 3 days at 150mg/ed.

ECA is used ed from week 10 to week 2
not sure about doses..

here is dropped and clen goes from eod 20-30mcg to ed 60-120mcg

sodium is kept 3-4gr year round till 1 day out.
Show day is 1-2gr..

Dyazide is introduced last 3 days on awake at
1 tab - 1/2 tab - 1/4tab
water is +5liters year round and kept till 1 day out where is reduced and reduced again on peak day but is there.
water and sodium are used by mirror on show day.

Depletion is 4-5days - carb up usually 3 days

Depletion is mainly Veggies+fish and Eggwhites

Carb Up is usually
Sweet Potato/Banana/Rice
Humalog was there at 3-5iu per meal

some red meat and whole eggs on peak day,
may get some nuts and pinneaple!

quite standard protocol for the heavyweight category (i.e. up to 102 kg)

 

[jaxino]

quite standard protocol for the heavyweight category (i.e. up to 102 kg)

1) But for a 115kg gentlemen how much gear do you think it will be needed? Maybe 3,5g total?

2) Also what do you think of the insulin protocol?

25iu Lantus is sort of HRT and i know that many people use it like that, but some before bed like type 2 diabetics (on Lantus website it's suggested to use like that).
The R insulin with prewo meal then Log with postwo meal seems interesting too.
Maybe in the end, it's like splitting the hair in two.... just a bit of over complication, when you can just use Log after meals.

 

[luki7788]

1) But for a 115kg gentlemen how much gear do you think it will be needed? Maybe 3,5g total?

2) Also what do you think of the insulin protocol?

25iu Lantus is sort of HRT and i know that many people use it like that, but some before bed like type 2 diabetics (on Lantus website it's suggested to use like that).
The R insulin with prewo meal then Log with postwo meal seems interesting too.
Maybe in the end, it's like splitting the hair in two.... just a bit of over complication, when you can just use Log after meals.

you need so much to grow - neither more nor less, but no one will tell you how much it is, because everyone is different.

Simple - if the conditions such as diet and hard training are met, insulin sensitivity is at a good level and you still do not grow despite adding kcal or changes in training, it means that the dose of hormones you take is sufficient to maintain what you have but too small to continue increase in size - so increase gear

Regarding the insulin protocol it is as good as any other, although personally I don't like giving lantus every day - although here I can see that insulin is used 4 weeks on 4 weeks off so it would make sense in that case - a bit like the Matt Porter protocol only with lower doses of lantus

 

[Elvia1023]

1) But for a 115kg gentlemen how much gear do you think it will be needed? Maybe 3,5g total?

2) Also what do you think of the insulin protocol?

25iu Lantus is sort of HRT and i know that many people use it like that, but some before bed like type 2 diabetics (on Lantus website it's suggested to use like that).
The R insulin with prewo meal then Log with postwo meal seems interesting too.
Maybe in the end, it's like splitting the hair in two.... just a bit of over complication, when you can just use Log after meals.

I am not Luki but I want to comment because it's something I have noticed on here from your posts over the last few months. Firstly, drugs are everything and essential for gains so this is not about using high, medium or low doses. I am all for you using high doses and going for it and trying to be a freak so it's nothing to do with that. It's just you WAY overcomplicate the drug aspect of things. I see you ask drug question after drug question like there is some magic drug formula that will unlock incredible gains. All your thoughts seem to be about drugs and not the things that will actually unlock your most potential. Plus trust me I am not one of those bullshitters who act like if you train and diet well drugs don't matter because they 100% can dictate your overall success especially if they are missing from the equation.

I am all for optimizing all areas including drugs and being detailed as well but using your 1st question as an example that thinking is just flawed imo. Weight can be one factor but you don't just pick a drug total because someone weighs x amount. There are 101 other factors that should be involved. Everyone needs different doses. As a result you also shouldn't just randomly copy some drug cycle you saw online because 1 pro used that. It's plenty of drugs so it's going to work regardless what you weigh unless you have recently been using much more than that.

The reason Luki gets great results from his drug changes is because he trains and eats like a beast. Yes the drugs are just as important but you shouldn't just pick a drug cycle based of your weight. You should try and gain off lower amounts and when they are not enough up the dose and repeat as many times as you want. I am all for pushing things and doing what you want but many guys on here are copying Luki's cycles or random high dosed cycles they saw online and they aren't even consistent with their eating and training and many of them are struggling to break 90-100kg.

I hate preaching posts and I don't want this to be like that and please don't take offense I am just trying to help. You should post a log with updated pics and all your training, nutrition and drug info and that will be better for your overall gains than if you use 25iu or 40iu lantus or go with regular or rapid slin pre workout.