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Popeye arm injury?

concreteguy

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I went to the Ortho and he told me I tore the long head out of a tunnel that goes into my shoulder. He said it's a common injury in sports and MOST guys never get it fixed. He said it's called the "popeye arm injury" because of what it makes the bi look like. I'm going for an MRI next week and to meet with his partner who handles the sports injurys side of the practice.
At the moment my bi never looked so good. It doesn't hurt to bad either. I asked him if this will atrophy away and start to look like hell if I don't get it fixed? He kinda answered me like "Peter paying Paul" over time and I will keep the size.
I have no plans on backing off with the workouts. I will just not be doing any pulling/curling type sets until I find out what to do.

Who knows about this kind of injury and can share some info? Anyone have any pics of BB with this? Did Branch rip out the top or bottoms of his bis? I know Vinny Gallanti has a bi injury, not sure how it broke.

The one good thing the Dr said was the inner short head almost never lets go. Even after having the outer long head failure.

Any way....any info on this would prolly help me sleep a little better at this point.
 

The Dude

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I had the exact injury. Distal bicep tendon tear. Whoever told you that the other head will make up for it is an idiot. I tore mine at the same time as another guy. I got mine repaired by a guy who specializes in fixing these in pro baseball players. It was a horrendous recovery and my arm turned into a sloppy noodle along with a massive knot in my back. That being said he built me a new tendon using alloy and then pulled it through a hole in my humerus and then used alloy thread to secure it on the other side. It's now stronger and better than it ever was. The other guy has a fucked up half bicep arm that hinders him in nearly every aspect of training.
 

concreteguy

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I had the exact injury. Distal bicep tendon tear. Whoever told you that the other head will make up for it is an idiot. I tore mine at the same time as another guy. I got mine repaired by a guy who specializes in fixing these in pro baseball players. It was a horrendous recovery and my arm turned into a sloppy noodle along with a massive knot in my back. That being said he built me a new tendon using alloy and then pulled it through a hole in my humerus and then used alloy thread to secure it on the other side. It's now stronger and better than it ever was. The other guy has a fucked up half bicep arm that hinders him in nearly every aspect of training.
OMFG!:eek: Not what I wanted to hear. Why a knot in your back?

My arm is working and can do curls. I can't imagine it turning into a floppy noodle. I'm not doughting you. I just can't imagine this is where I'm going with this. It would hurt. But if I had to do a arm workout today, I could.
 

The Dude

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OMFG!:eek: Not what I wanted to hear. Why a knot in your back?

My arm is working and can do curls. I can't imagine it turning into a floppy noodle. I'm not doughting you. I just can't imagine this is where I'm going with this. It would hurt. But if I had to do a arm workout today, I could.
My arm turned into a sloppy noodle while it was immobilized after the surgery. I'm pretty big and have a very well developed back. Due to the arm being immobilized my back just knotted up on that side. I would go through it all over again. I compete and I'm not going to be less than 100% if I can help it. If you do not get it repaired your development will suffer as will your training. The long head of the bicep will eventually atrophy to nothing. If you are cool with that than leave it. It sounds great until you see someone who didn't get it fixed. Shit looks gross
 

muscle96ss

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I had the exact injury. Distal bicep tendon tear. Whoever told you that the other head will make up for it is an idiot. I tore mine at the same time as another guy. I got mine repaired by a guy who specializes in fixing these in pro baseball players. It was a horrendous recovery and my arm turned into a sloppy noodle along with a massive knot in my back. That being said he built me a new tendon using alloy and then pulled it through a hole in my humerus and then used alloy thread to secure it on the other side. It's now stronger and better than it ever was. The other guy has a fucked up half bicep arm that hinders him in nearly every aspect of training.
Actually what he has is a proximal tear(at shoulder), not a distal tear which is very different.

Concreteguy: I believe this is the same injury that Lee Priest suffered a couple years ago and tried to go without the surgery but finally gave in. Its an injury that doesn't need to be fixed but obviously is going to effect your training so it is kind of a personal decision on how it feels and whether it is worh it or not to be 100%.
 

The Dude

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Actually what he has is a proximal tear(at shoulder), not a distal tear which is very different.

Concreteguy: I believe this is the same injury that Lee Priest suffered a couple years ago and tried to go without the surgery but finally gave in. Its an injury that doesn't need to be fixed but obviously is going to effect your training so it is kind of a personal decision on how it feels and whether it is worh it or not to be 100%.
Damn it! Distal = distant. Proximal = proximity... I made a mistake in identifying it. Mine was proximal as well hence the hole in the top of my humerus to reattach.
 

The Dude

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I had 3 incisions. 1 at the top of the bicep that left a pretty good 2' scar (I frayed the tendon so they had to build one) 1 in the shoulder between the anterior and medial (about 1 1/2') and 1 in the rear delt that you can't see
 

keepushin770

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i saw that happen to a guy in the gym one time. his arm was almost instantly black!!! so bad it made me ease up on the bi's for a while...
 

concreteguy

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Actually what he has is a proximal tear(at shoulder), not a distal tear which is very different.

Concreteguy: I believe this is the same injury that Lee Priest suffered a couple years ago and tried to go without the surgery but finally gave in. Its an injury that doesn't need to be fixed but obviously is going to effect your training so it is kind of a personal decision on how it feels and whether it is worth it or not to be 100%.
The Ortho told me that most guys don't ever opt for the surgery and that it may be an issue for me because of my BB and aesthetics's of symmetry. He said the odds of me noticing a strength difference later is next to none. This is the Ortho telling me this.

I would love to tell ya this happened doing something mocha at the gym(NOT). I went for a physical and the dumb ass started off putting a blood pressure sleeve on me that was to small and then she put on a much longer one and wrapped it up under my arm pit. As the machine pressurized the cuff I started to tell her she had it to high when I realized what was going on (I could feel it was pulling down on my arm instead of putting pressure in the middle of my arm). Me my wife and the girl all heard a snap that sounded like a fucking chicken bone snap. I felt a worm burning feeling the moment it happened that later turned into pain.
 

UMD73

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I had a distal tear in May, and as with you it wasn't anything good. I tripped walking down the stairs into work & caught myself but apparently hyper-extended my arm. Well 5 months and a surgery later, I'm back to work and stronger than ever, so I think it's well worth doing it. Thankfully in my case it was covered under workmans comp!!

I know a couple guys in my gym that had proximal tears & are competitive amateurs and they had them fixed, average recovery time was 4-6 months.
 

fade

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The Ortho told me that most guys don't ever opt for the surgery and that it may be an issue for me because of my BB and aesthetics's of symmetry. He said the odds of me noticing a strength difference later is next to none. This is the Ortho telling me this.

I would love to tell ya this happened doing something mocha at the gym(NOT). I went for a physical and the dumb ass started off putting a blood pressure sleeve on me that was to small and then she put on a much longer one and wrapped it up under my arm pit. As the machine pressurized the cuff I started to tell her she had it to high when I realized what was going on (I could feel it was pulling down on my arm instead of putting pressure in the middle of my arm). Me my wife and the girl all heard a snap that sounded like a fucking chicken bone snap. I felt a worm burning feeling the moment it happened that later turned into pain.
Fucking a the Dr's insurance should pay for 100% of the repair. Get that shit fixed better than before on the Dr's dime.
 

thebrick

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Damn!!! I hate this Concrete. So are you saying that it was a complete rupture? I am assuming by everyone hearing a "pop" that it was a total, not partial tear? I think I would think seriously about having that repaired if it was a complete rupture. If it was a total rupture, it seems inevitable that you would have atrophy of the long head. I would also think about making that incompetent moron pay for all of it.
 
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Emery

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WTF???

I would definitely hit the doctor's office up on this one Concrete...

Every nurse gets specific training on proper blood pressure reading/application of right sized cuff, etc. You have a case in that actual harm occurred to you due to their negligence and lack of training. You should take advantage of that as the injury occurred because of their actions...

On another note, I have a friend that had a similar injury, didn't get it repaired and now his bicep looks like half a bicep! Very deformed looking!
 

sinfulimages

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Yeah I agree they need to pay for this surgery man.
 

maldorf

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From what concrete guy is saying, it sounds like he just tore the connective tissue sheath that surrounds the tendon up by the shoulder joint and not the actual long head bicep tendon! At least thats what I get from his description and that would explain what the ortho doc is saying. To me too, thats not something thats going to be too serious except that arm is going to look different than the other one. Maybe you can go and tear the other one so they will be even! This is just a tear of the fascial bundle around that tendon and not the tendon itself, if I understand what his doc said.
 

The Dude

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From what concrete guy is saying, it sounds like he just tore the connective tissue sheath that surrounds the tendon up by the shoulder joint and not the actual long head bicep tendon! At least thats what I get from his description and that would explain what the ortho doc is saying. To me too, thats not something thats going to be too serious except that arm is going to look different than the other one. Maybe you can go and tear the other one so they will be even! This is just a tear of the fascial bundle around that tendon and not the tendon itself, if I understand what his doc said.
No. The proximal bicep tendon from the long head travels through a groove in the humerus. When it tears, the long head bunches up causing a crazy peak especially on the outside of the arm. The tendon is torn or worse frayed (like mine) this is not something that someone interested in their physical appearance wants. You need to get it fixed. And as far as the Dr. Saying you will get 100% strength back... bullshit. Half your bicep will atrophy to nothing! Do you think that somehow your inner head will double in strength to make up for it?! Are you going to feel comfortable doing shrugs and deadliest knowing you only have 1 little tendon holding your bicep on?
 

maldorf

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No. The proximal bicep tendon from the long head travels through a groove in the humerus. When it tears, the long head bunches up causing a crazy peak especially on the outside of the arm. The tendon is torn or worse frayed (like mine) this is not something that someone interested in their physical appearance wants. You need to get it fixed. And as far as the Dr. Saying you will get 100% strength back... bullshit. Half your bicep will atrophy to nothing! Do you think that somehow your inner head will double in strength to make up for it?! Are you going to feel comfortable doing shrugs and deadliest knowing you only have 1 little tendon holding your bicep on?
I went to the Ortho and he told me I tore the long head out of a tunnel that goes into my shoulder.
From this it sounds like he did not tear the actual long head bicep tedon, but rather tore the transverse ligament of the humerus that spans the intertubercular groove that the tendon runs through. If that tears, then the tendon could ride up out of the groove and that would make the muscle pop up more than it normally would. the transverse ligament looks like its an extension of the fibers of the attachement from the subscapularis muscle. Im now looking at my manual from gross anatomy when I took that course at the medical school. I doubt his orthopedic surgeon would make the statements that he did if concrete had indeed torn the long head bicpes tendon.
 

concreteguy

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totally confused

From this it sounds like he did not tear the actual long head bicep tendon, but rather tore the transverse ligament of the humerus that spans the intertubercular groove that the tendon runs through. If that tears, then the tendon could ride up out of the groove and that would make the muscle pop up more than it normally would. the transverse ligament looks like its an extension of the fibers of the attachement from the subscapularis muscle. Im now looking at my manual from gross anatomy when I took that course at the medical school. I doubt his orthopedic surgeon would make the statements that he did if concrete had indeed torn the long head biceps tendon.
After reading all this I can't believe the Dr would tell me "most of the time this is left untreated". I'm waiting for my Dr office to send me an approval number for the MRI. I feel full time shoulder pain and my bi is definitely fuller in the middle.

The kicker is "everything still works". Twisting wrist,curls palm up and down, lifting arm up and out. But for the record, he said "you have pulled the long head of the bicep out of the shoulder tunnel" This is exactly what he said.

Mean while I have ZERO bruising. I feel like I could go to the gym and train. Just feels like a bad crick in my shoulder that would workout if warned up properly. I'm not going to do this! But thats what it feels like. You guys are saying if it's not fixed it will end up looking like shit ha?
 

maldorf

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After reading all this I can't believe the Dr would tell me "most of the time this is left untreated". I'm waiting for my Dr office to send me an approval number for the MRI. I feel full time shoulder pain and my bi is definitely fuller in the middle.

The kicker is "everything still works". Twisting wrist,curls palm up and down, lifting arm up and out. But for the record, he said "you have pulled the long head of the bicep out of the shoulder tunnel" This is exactly what he said.

Mean while I have ZERO bruising. I feel like I could go to the gym and train. Just feels like a bad crick in my shoulder that would workout if warned up properly. I'm not going to do this! But thats what it feels like. You guys are saying if it's not fixed it will end up looking like shit ha?
I think the doc is right, and most on this thread are misunderstanding the actual injury. It sounds like your doc never said that you tore the long head bicep tendon. All you did is tear some of the fascia/connective tissue that forms the bridge over the biceptal grove of your humerus. To me what he said sounds true. You should lose no strength or function at all! If you actually tore the long head of the bicep youd be at the least experiencing quite a bit of pain and loss of function. If it complete tore off the scapula it would roll up like a blind.
What I am wondering is how did he make the diagnosis? To me the only way to know for sure would be to have a catscan or MRI done.
 

Kaladryn

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I think the doc is right, and most on this thread are misunderstanding the actual injury. It sounds like your doc never said that you tore the long head bicep tendon. All you did is tear some of the fascia/connective tissue that forms the bridge over the biceptal grove of your humerus. To me what he said sounds true. You should lose no strength or function at all! If you actually tore the long head of the bicep youd be at the least experiencing quite a bit of pain and loss of function. If it complete tore off the scapula it would roll up like a blind.
What I am wondering is how did he make the diagnosis? To me the only way to know for sure would be to have a catscan or MRI done.
I'm pretty sure he is talking about a full detachment of the biceps tendon from the bone. On the proximal side, there are two attachments, the muscle looks pretty much the same because the other side is attached and there is enough fascia to hold the long head to the short head. It is VERY common for doctors to NOT recommend surgery for this, I know this sounds amazing, but it's true.

The problem is that rehab is full year, and because the other side is solid, people VERY commonly detach it again after having it fixed.

There are two ways to fix it, the older way is to drill a hole in the bone and pull the tendon into the hole, securing it on the other side of the bone (this method is retarded, and still being used by some doctors!). The new method is to 'anchor' the tendon down to the bone, and let the tendon grow into the bone by itself, this is the only reasonable method to use, all decent ortho's are up to date on this.

The "drill a hole" method was so bad that the recommendation to just do nothing came about, with the new methods, you should DEFINITELY have it fixed.

I had a similar experience, I detached my biceps at the elbow, where there is only a single tendon attachment. BUT, there is a ligament that comes off the tendon that stayed attached, thus no "roll up like a blind" effect. I didn't even know I detached it, I thought it was just a minor muscle tear. Months later I realized something wasn't right, curling anything over 15lbs dumbbells felt "strange" and the muscle was slightly different shaped.

Rereading this I realized it's a little negative, so I'll add: 2 years after the surgery my injured arm was bigger than it has ever been before.
 
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