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Tbol vs Anavar for Women

Funinthesun

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I've taken both of these in separate cycles. The tbol gave me massive strength and muscle gains that slowly, over several months, diminished. The Anavar had a much more natural and subtle overall strength/mass gain, but appears to have been maintained. Is combining them together in the same cycle appropriate for women? And, if so, would the cycle be similar to a men's cycle or does the natural higher estrogen levels require something in addition to compensate? Thanks in advance!
 

johnjuanb1

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I prefer women to only run one or the other at 10mg a day for 30 days. They both work very well. There is no need to simultaneously use an estrogen lowering compound like nolvadex. Although, the final month precontest nolvadex is beneficial to get that dry look.
 
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Gravel

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I've taken both of these in separate cycles. The tbol gave me massive strength and muscle gains that slowly, over several months, diminished. The Anavar had a much more natural and subtle overall strength/mass gain, but appears to have been maintained. Is combining them together in the same cycle appropriate for women? And, if so, would the cycle be similar to a men's cycle or does the natural higher estrogen levels require something in addition to compensate? Thanks in advance!

T-bol has long half life so just taking them on work out days for women lowers the risks ....I would never advise a woman to use two separate compounds at one time. Nothing in addition would be needed with either one....if your asking about a AI. Germans designed T-bol for women athletes in the 60's I believe....that's why they kicked our butts in the Olympics back then.
 
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trencook

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[lang=pt]i suppose var is better,know alot of girls that used it and had a really good result[/lang]
 

control

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I've taken both of these in separate cycles. The tbol gave me massive strength and muscle gains that slowly, over several months, diminished. The Anavar had a much more natural and subtle overall strength/mass gain, but appears to have been maintained. Is combining them together in the same cycle appropriate for women? And, if so, would the cycle be similar to a men's cycle or does the natural higher estrogen levels require something in addition to compensate? Thanks in advance!

Sounds like anavar is the winner to me
 

little slice

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I prefer women to only run one or the other at 10mg a day for 30 days. They both work very well. There is no need to simultaneously use an estrogen lowering compound like nolvadex. Although, the final month precontest nolvadex is beneficial to get that dry look.




nolvadex raises estrogen, but alright
 

buck1973

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nolvadex raises estrogen, but alright

Nolva raises estro? It what world does it do that?

Male Breast Cancer

NOLVADEX (tamoxifen citrate) is well tolerated in males with breast cancer. Reports from the literature and case reports suggest that the safety profile of NOLVADEX (tamoxifen citrate) in males is similar to that seen in women. Loss of libido and impotence have resulted in discontinuation of tamoxifen therapy in male patients. Also, in oligospermic males treated with tamoxifen, LH, FSH, testosterone and estrogen levels were elevated. No significant clinical changes were reported.



This is in males as ya can see...
This is the whole study
Side Effects of Nolvadex (Tamoxifen Citrate) Drug Center - RxList
 

Mike Arnold

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Var and T-bol are two of the mildest (androgenically speaking) steroids available. Technically, T-bol has a weaker androgenic rating, but androgenic ratings mean little, as they are not necessarily a reliable predictor of overall androgenic potency in all tissues.

Still, experience has shown both to be very mild, but keep in mind that even drugs with a very low androgenic rating can produce significant masculinizing side effects, especially when used over a prolonged period of time and even when used at low doses.

Records from East Germany's doping program, which detailed doses and timetables for use for all athletes, were obtained decades ago by the U.S government. All of the women were provided with T-bol, which was produced specifically because of its weak androgenic component. Doses were much lower than what some of you might think. While I can't remember exact dosages off the top of my head, I did see the dosing regimens for women in every sport (doses varied not by weight, age, or experience, but by sport), and from my remembrance, none of the women received more than 15 mg/day, and most were considerably below that. Oddly, the sports one would think required the highest doses--strength sports, such as shot putters--did not receive the highest doses, but I am getting off track.

The point is that even when using doses between 5-15 mg/day, MOST of the women suffered very noticeable and in some cases severe masculinization. Of course, many of these women used T-bol for many years, and while they did not use it year-round, the combined effects of years of use caused very significant masculinization.

Regardless, the effect AAS will have on women can vary substantially, with personal response playing a big role in how quickly a woman will experience androgenic side effects at a given dose.

With that said, whether or not she should use one or both is a personal decision. However, she should know how she responds to each before combining them, as she will not know what drug is doing what without prior experience.

The belief that women should not use more than one drug at a time is ill-founded, as the number of drugs employed is not an accurate indicator of how likely one is to experience androgenic side effects. What does matter is the total androgenic payload. If a woman responds to 2 drugs similarly in terms of androgenic side effects, what difference does it make if she uses 10 mg of both drugs or 20 mg of just one?

Just like men, who often prefer using moderate doses of multiple steroids, rather than just one at a large dose, women may also prefer to do likewise. So long as the combined androgenic payload does not exceed her comfort level, that is all that matters.
 

RamboStallone

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We aren't talking about low sperm males here. In the general sense Nolvadex reduces estrogen, mainly in breast tissue. This is common knowledge and is in the link you provided. It's even labeled as an antiestrogen by the FDA. Let's not reinvent the wheel here.

I mean am I wrong here? I'm sorry if I am coming off in some arrogant way.
 

Mike Arnold

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We aren't talking about low sperm males here. In the general sense Nolvadex reduces estrogen, mainly in breast tissue. This is common knowledge and is in the link you provided. It's even labeled as an antiestrogen by the FDA. Let's not reinvent the wheel here.

I mean am I wrong here? I'm sorry if I am coming off in some arrogant way.

Yes, it is an "anti-estrogen" in the sense that it prevents estrogen from attaching to estrogen receptor sites. Technically, systematic estrogen levels remain unaffected, but it does lower estrogen concentrations within certain tissues, which is precisely why it is used in breast cancer cases or as a PCT drug in males.
 

Mike Arnold

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We aren't talking about low sperm males here. In the general sense Nolvadex reduces estrogen, mainly in breast tissue. This is common knowledge and is in the link you provided. It's even labeled as an antiestrogen by the FDA. Let's not reinvent the wheel here.

I mean am I wrong here? I'm sorry if I am coming off in some arrogant way.

Yes, it is an "anti-estrogen" in the sense that it prevents estrogen from attaching to estrogen receptor sites. Technically, systematic estrogen levels remain unaffected, but it does lower estrogen concentrations in estrogen dependent tissues, which is precisely why it is used in breast cancer cases or as a PCT drug in males.
 

little slice

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We aren't talking about low sperm males here. In the general sense Nolvadex reduces estrogen, mainly in breast tissue. This is common knowledge and is in the link you provided. It's even labeled as an antiestrogen by the FDA. Let's not reinvent the wheel here.



qbq78.jpg
 

little slice

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Var and T-bol are two of the mildest (androgenically speaking) steroids available. Technically, T-bol has a weaker androgenic rating, but androgenic ratings mean little, as they are not necessarily a reliable predictor of overall androgenic potency in all tissues.

Still, experience has shown both to be very mild, but keep in mind that even drugs with a very low androgenic rating can produce significant masculinizing side effects, especially when used over a prolonged period of time and even when used at low doses.

Records from East Germany's doping program, which detailed doses and timetables for use for all athletes, were obtained decades ago by the U.S government. All of the women were provided with T-bol, which was produced specifically because of its weak androgenic component. Doses were much lower than what some of you might think. While I can't remember exact dosages off the top of my head, I did see the dosing regimens for women in every sport (doses varied not by weight, age, or experience, but by sport), and from my remembrance, none of the women received more than 15 mg/day, and most were considerably below that. Oddly, the sports one would think required the highest doses--strength sports, such as shot putters--did not receive the highest doses, but I am getting off track.

The point is that even when using doses between 5-15 mg/day, MOST of the women suffered very noticeable and in some cases severe masculinization. Of course, many of these women used T-bol for many years, and while they did not use it year-round, the combined effects of years of use caused very significant masculinization.

Regardless, the effect AAS will have on women can vary substantially, with personal response playing a big role in how quickly a woman will experience androgenic side effects at a given dose.

With that said, whether or not she should use one or both is a personal decision. However, she should know how she responds to each before combining them, as she will not know what drug is doing what without prior experience.

The belief that women should not use more than one drug at a time is ill-founded, as the number of drugs employed is not an accurate indicator of how likely one is to experience androgenic side effects. What does matter is the total androgenic payload. If a woman responds to 2 drugs similarly in terms of androgenic side effects, what difference does it make if she uses 10 mg of both drugs or 20 mg of just one?

Just like men, who often prefer using moderate doses of multiple steroids, rather than just one at a large dose, women may also prefer to do likewise. So long as the combined androgenic payload does not exceed her comfort level, that is all that matters.



I recall you being something of an advocate for superdrol use in female athletes. Do you still feel this way?


IIRC, anabolic/androgenic ratio of 400/20
 

Mike Arnold

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I recall you being something of an advocate for superdrol use in female athletes. Do you still feel this way?


IIRC, anabolic/androgenic ratio of 400/20

Yes--because it is an excellent drug for females wishing to gain muscle mass & strength. Remember, not only does SD have an androgenic rating equivalent to Anavar, but it's real-world effects reflect that rating, with SD having minimal androgenic activity in tissues such as the scalp, skin, etc. Basically, SD has a very mild effect in every tissue that would be responsible for visible, audible masculinization.

Unfortunately, because SD has gotten a rep as a "harsh" steroid, many people misinterpret this as meaning harsh in every way, when it reality it is only harsh in terms of its effect on hepatic and lipid health. However, hepatic strain is easily managed, especially when used at female appropriate doses, and I always recommend taking steps to mitigate negative fluctuations in lipids.

With that said, SD is a better choice than Anavar when it comes to minimizing masculinizing side effects in women. Although their androgenic potency in the above mentioned areas may be similar, SD is much more potent from a myotropic standpoint, providing the desired myotropic effect at a much lower dosage than Anavar. In all likelihood, SD could probably do at 2 mg/day what Anavar could do at 15-20 mg/day, in terms of muscle growth. Therefore, androgenic activity will be much lower, placing the woman at lower overall risk for masculinizing side effects.

Most women will experience profound muscle growth at only 5 mg/day--much greater than what they would experience when using 20 mg of Var. Due to the effective dosing amount being much lower than Var, the potential for androgenic side effects is reduced.
 

Denis Srtazjak

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[lang=uk]I am persanal trainer for more than 10 years/ 80% of my clients are woman and they show more results whith oxandrolone than whith tbol, ofcourse if oxandrolone is thrue not fake one. I buy good powders in landmark-nutraceuticals:eek:[/lang]
 

bbg420

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T-bol has long half life so just taking them on work out days for women lowers the risks ....I would never advise a woman to use two separate compounds at one time. Nothing in addition would be needed with either one....if your asking about a AI. Germans designed T-bol for women athletes in the 60's I believe....that's why they kicked our butts in the Olympics back then.

I would avoid tbol if I was a women, stick with var, just make sure its real, right ,east germens took tbol and did you see what those drugs did to those east germen women, a shame, manliest women ive ever seen, I would avoid tbol, go to youtube and watch pbs doping for gold , like I said, dam shame what gdr did to those girls, look up name hedi kreiger, or now ,aka andreaus kreiger
 
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