Terry Schiavo...I need ot get this off my chest

[PHIL HERNON]

What about this then.

when she does not have the biological capacity to suffer. Suffering is a feeling, like pain, or from pain. The suffering she is going through is from starvation and dehydration. But she cannot tell, how does one know whether or not she is? N one actaully knows that she is suffering except for what is left of her. If the part of her brain cannot tell whether she is feeling pain, suffering or other then how can she be suffering? Her body or what is left of it at a very primal level is whats left holding onto this world. There is no more brain compacity to function and live. One has to differentiate this from what the media is giving, this has been hyped to consume the public. WHy is the husband an asshole, maybe he is granting her wish, her own words, does anyone not understand that this may have been her decision long ago regardless of a living will. No one knows except the people that are there. This is and was her life, this could possibly be her decision on what she wanted, no one knows, and he is granting it for her.
gooey

What is the most important sense? When we lose our ability to feel, then it is time to execute? How about sight? If we go blind, then hang us? Hearing, yes, when we go deaf it is time for lethal injection. When we cannot smell anymore, it is time for the firing squad? Can a blind person function without therapy? A deaf person? A downs syndrome child, can they function on their own? A quad or para, can they? Should we have drown Christopher Reeves? We are not talking about racehorses here. These people serve a purpose to their families, to their friends. My point is, we are here to make each others lives better, I believe.Maybe this is why there is so much disagreement. Many people just want to make their lives better, not others. It is my strong opinion that if the parents of this girl want her alive and can afford it, and helping her move and talking to her brings them joy and hope, why cant we just let it be? This so called husband has moved on long ago. Give he back to her parents, the ones who created her, and let them decide if it is time to destroy her. If anyone here says that they believe in God and still say to pull the plug, I think it is time to break out that Bible and look up the miracles section. It is in there, I am pretty sure of it.

 

[G.E.R.M]

My point is, we are here to make each others lives better, I believe.Maybe this is why there is so much disagreement. Many people just want to make their lives better, not others. It is my strong opinion that if the parents of this girl want her alive and can afford it, and helping her move and talking to her brings them joy and hope, why cant we just let it be?

well maybe the parent keeping her alive to talk to her only makes their lives better not hers..

what if her life cannot be made any better due to the fact that she cant tell either way..for worse or better?

the only thing this argument about terry should be about is wether you believe the husband when he says she wouldnt want to live like that...
-he has nothing to gain

its all about the wishes of the sick person...isnt it ? or am i wrong ?

the parents on the other hand, we know it makes the feel better to have terry alive...but hey, the parents are healthy and shit so really who cares how they feel...and if their quality of life is improved...? nobody should...

 

[DOGMA]

Two Words. "LIVING WILL"

 

[doug1]

Phil's right

phil's comments a few threads above really sums things up. are we going to start taking people out back and shooting them when they no longer serve US in the way that WE feel is best? whether she feels pain or not is irrelevant. she is a human being.it's my understanding also that she "lights up" when her parents enter the room. i am a Christian myself and live about 8-10 miles away and feel like crap for not doing something or trying to do something, even though it would result in being arrested, i still feel pathetic. i enjoyed a nice meal today and a few minute drive from me a woman hasn't eaten in over a week...i'm ashamed of myself and my country concerning this "thing"
doug

 

[success]

First off, let me say I am a Catholic....i know many will say i can't be because of how i feel about this case....go ahead and cast your stones....i know it's hard for alot of people to really know whats going on...there are so many drugs, machines, therapies that are at our disposal that we can keep patients "alive" indefinitly...i have seen liver failure patients skin fall off, their tongues turn necrotic and there is nothing i can do...they cannot speak for themselves because they are intubated or trached or their ammonia levels are so high they don't have the mental capacity function correctly...their families want everything done till there's nothing left but a corpse with a heart beat and breath sounds...what for? because they can't let go...if you spent a week with me and see the shit i see, you might feel different or look at it from another perspective....i always look at situations from the perspective of the patients...what will their quality of life be if they recover? i am always straight-forward with their families...i sugarcoat nothing like most doctors and nurses do...i try my best to help every patient i take care of to recover to the best they can...nothing gives me more pleasure than seeing them walk out the ICU...i am also realistic knowing that sometimes there is nothing i can do...in terry's case, she could continue on indefinitly with no quality of life but her parents could be happy.

 

[Ivan]

Gooey, reload, success...

You guys see shit for what it is...on the other hand FELLAS -- time to realize wtf is going on here!

Her time was up 15 yrs ago when she had the heart attack, and now she IS dead, TERRY is DEAD, YES SHE IS. She is suffering however.....suffering in a sense to let GOD (as you guys call it) finish the job. Phil, there is a difference between blind, deaf, and whatever else people, this lady had a damn heart attack, and her brain is dead....D.E.A.D. Biologically her body is being supported, but Terry is long gone. Right now her soul is prolly in between somewhere, unsettled, ACHING for liberation from the damn machine that is TOTALLY and COMPLETELY inhuman. Sorry guys but when your time is up, your fucking time is up. Nothing wrong with that. The parents are being SELFISH as all hell, it is time to look at the big picture here, stop focusing on the shallow aspects of life --- sometimes reality bites, but think about the journey ahead, think for Terry' sake... Death is not bad, it is a normal part of life and something I do not fear. Death as a word should not be thought of as an ending, rather a beginning. I feel for her soul. Her body is merely a shell guys, remember that. A shell. Time to end this thing.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

I never said death is bad

You guys see shit for what it is...on the other hand FELLAS -- time to realize wtf is going on here!

Her time was up 15 yrs ago when she had the heart attack, and now she IS dead, TERRY is DEAD, YES SHE IS. She is suffering however.....suffering in a sense to let GOD (as you guys call it) finish the job. Phil, there is a difference between blind, deaf, and whatever else people, this lady had a damn heart attack, and her brain is dead....D.E.A.D. Biologically her body is being supported, but Terry is long gone. Right now her soul is prolly in between somewhere, unsettled, ACHING for liberation from the damn machine that is TOTALLY and COMPLETELY inhuman. Sorry guys but when your time is up, your fucking time is up. Nothing wrong with that. The parents are being SELFISH as all hell, it is time to look at the big picture here, stop focusing on the shallow aspects of life --- sometimes reality bites, but think about the journey ahead, think for Terry' sake... Death is not bad, it is a normal part of life and something I do not fear. Death as a word should not be thought of as an ending, rather a beginning. I feel for her soul. Her body is merely a shell guys, remember that. A shell. Time to end this thing.

Death is not bad. Murder is bad. Im not sure what her soul wants, I can only go on what her husband tells us 12 years after the fact.

 

[Crowler]

"Terri suffered massive brain injury when she collapsed under unexplained circumstances in the couple's apartment in February 1990, at the age of 26. Oxygen to her brain was cut off for several minutes, leaving her severely brain-disabled, incapacitated, and dependent upon a feeding tube for sustenance."

BUT her 'husband' waits over 4 years after the feeding tube was inserted before claiming that he was watching a movie about someone in a coma and Terry said she wouldn't want to like like that. hmmmmmmmmmmm


2 years ago even after Clearwater Police cleared Terry's parents of any wrong doing when 4 'prick' marks showed up on Terry's arm, he denied them ANY access to Terry for 2 more weeks and attempted to have them PERMANANTLY banned from seeing her.

This guy is just bad news.

What about the 2 children he has who can not even use his last name. Maybe he will be up for worst dad of the year award for intentionally screwing over his kids.

He actually tried to get his relationship with his current girlfriend declared a commonlaw marrage ahhhh that was until he was made aware of the fact that he would then be guilty of biggamy DUH

Whether you believe the feeding tube should be in or not this guy is an ASSHOLE plain and simple.

 

[Homer]

DISGUSTED!

I am so disgusted with this whole ordeal.
This is an incredibly private matter that has been throw out to the media and hijacked by politicians and other people promotting their own personal agendas. The LAW is clear on this matter: in these types of situations the spouse is the one that makes the choice to end artificial measures to keep someone alive. NO ONE else.
Who knows you best other than the person you lay next to in bed every night?
Regardless of all of our opinions--it's not up to us to decide!
This has been going on for 15 years! The woman deserves to rest and meet her God. It is so easy for people to make the husband out to be the devil. What would you do if the person you loved was in this position and she had told you previously of her wishes to not want to live in this manner? Would you just buckle under the pressure and let her parents keep her alive because she "keeps them happy" like some kind of doll.Or would you fight honnor her wishes and end her life with some dignity? No one knows whether she actually wanted this but, AGAIN, it's not up to anyone other than the spouse.
It is shame that she has to be starved instead of just eased into death with simple injection but this is the way things are unfortunatley.
The whole drama has motivated me and members of my family to make our living wills as I hope it does your families also.

 

[Nssca]

The legal issue is; her husband is the DPOA(durable power of attorney)That gives him 100% power to decide what care she is given or nt given. You say, you cant understand why they are taking her off her feeding tub? Her husband feels her quality of life is poor and she would want him to not let them keep her alive.
The real issue in this post is : is it morally right to let her pass on?
Is it morally right to end your life if your terminaly ill and going to die any way? If you had aids would you want to hang on to the bitter end when your body is so emaciated that your family crys at the very sight of you, or would you wish to end it before the suffering and have a sense of dignity?
Morality is the factor that causes sooo many problems in our society.
What is right today, was a sin 200 years ago. Ask yourself if it was you... would you want to live a life where you cant move on your own, feed yourself, cant hold your love ones. Life is going on without you and your trapped in a body that no longer serves you. Id welcome death every time.

 

[doug1]

i agree that i would not want to live like that either, but like you said, it's a question of morality. and although you point out what was wrong 200 years ago is "right" today, that may be true in the eyes of man, but who ultimately gives us our morality, is it not the God who created us and gives us life? God holds life sacred which is why He clearly tells us in the Old Testament that "if man sheds another man's blood, then man shall shed his blood" in other words if someone murders someone else God gives man(government) the authority for capital punishment. this was only in cases of murder and not for accidents. this strong consequence shows God's view on the sacredness of life. i don't have the authority to take my own life(suicide), but i clearly would not want a machine to breath for me either, but that's not the same thing as having a tube go into my stomach that i can recieve nutrients. at least i don't view it the same, some of these issues are not easily answered at all, i won't sit here and claim to have all the answers. it's my understanding that the government in these cases wants to come down on the side of life.
don't we have enough death going on in our society with abortions and murders and kids shooting up their schools. i try not to watch the news too much, or even many of the tv shows, so much is centered on death, and often times brutal deaths...

 

[Nssca]

So If Im terminally ill, Im going to die anyway and I just want to decide when and how... that is going to make GOD send me to hell?
The moral aspect of this situation is the heated side of the case. The legal power of a "power of attorney" is binding and was up help by every judge which reviewed the case. If you have a wish to die verses live like a veg. then this case has granted those wishes will still be upheld if your time is at hand.
The right to chose. Terry "GAVE" her husband that right. I would give the right to anyone but the government in deciding my fate.
As far as your statement "blood for blood" didnt Jesus say "turn the other cheek"
If the court ruled cases based on the Bible's laws, we'd all be executed. And let me just add, this case (about TERRY) has been in various courts for the better part of 3 years its just now being made a media fest.

 

[G.E.R.M]

Death is not bad. Murder is bad. Im not sure what her soul wants, I can only go on what her husband tells us 12 years after the fact.

the husband has been saying this for 12yrs...

the case just became public....its been in court the whole time

this is an ongoing fight and the husband has always maintained the same story with no waivering unlike every one in the opposition camp who's stories has changed multiple times...

 

[BigBoyJ]

If her husband wants to remain married to her, yet he has another girlfriend and kids, why isn't someone pushing the fact that he is committing adultery? It seems there should be some way to take away the husbands rights because of that fact alone.

 

[DOCTREMBLAY]

Tough issue

tough issue either way, the living will is a neccessity bottom line, i say if the parents want to keep her alive then theymust do what tehcourt says though i dont like that, if there was a will ten the situation woukld not be

Inhumane to let her go with no food or water at all if they do keep it that the tube is removed IMO

on th issue of them messing with B-Ball and this case, you are very right, it is not going to end there and it is damn scary, pricay and freedom is no more

 

[Skip]

Cool, I am back to being a proud republican. : )

Success:

I only disagree with you. I absolutely respect your opinion and I understand that it is based on your experiences and your career and what you have seen. I MAY see it differently if I were in your shoes, you are correct. However, you admitted yourself that you might have become desensitized to this type of thing due to your work. I like a good debate and you make some very good points. I simply disagree because I sympathize from one main perspective and that is as a parent. The thought of that being my daughter and the husband having all of the control would make me homicidal. He is truly a piece of shit. He denies access of the parents to see Terri; he denied access for communion for Christ's Sake until the last minute; to say he has nothing to gain by her death is laughable. Christ, he won't have to pretend to give a shit anymore and can focus on his life with his kids and his other wife, now. I am sure that he will get SOME sort of life insurance out of Terri, as well, even if it isn't a lot. Mark my words, too: He WILL strike a book deal - COUNT ON IT.

One more thing: If she doesn't feel pain, why the morphine? No one has explained this yet.

Skip

 

[brachialis]

The VALUE of life....

.....at times the values of life can't necessarily be seen in the one we are living. Every life is of GREAT worth in my opinion whether fully awake and vibrant or in a slumber catatonic state. Sometimes the life we live isn't necessarily for ourselves... There is a REASON... Think of the values that we learn by selflessly "serving" those in need. Think of the patience, kindness, and other great attributes that we learn from those less fortunate.
I mean in Terry's case think of those lives that have been greatly enhanced because they have "served" or "helped" her throughout the years.
If we didn't have less fortunate folks to assist how could we ever think to learn charity, empathy, kindness, thoughtfullness or the desire to give/share? At times these difficult situations are more for us then the person going through it....

Think about it?

 

[Vander_V]

Terri herself didnt mention pulling the plug , so who has the fucking right to end LIFE , i dont care if shes brain DEAD shes alive i dont care if she cant comprehend a single thing she still breaths , her soul will have plenty of time to rest when the Lord embraces her ,,,so let her live and breath she is still a child of GOD and only he should make such decisions.

 

[success]

Hey Skip, I respect your opinion also...I think people misconstrue whose side I'm on....I'm not denying the husband is prob a huge piece of shit and is prob looking out for himself...but I alos think the parents are looking out for themselves and the protestors are looking out for their agendas....I am looking at this from Terri's perspective....This whole time not one perosn on here or in the news has said they want to be kept "alive" in the state she is in....why not? because her quality of life as defined by the social and medical socities is 0.


I don't really understand why they are giving her morphine...maybe because it's procedural...we also don't know if she has been receiving it for years...now is a good time for the media to bring up she is getting morphine.

 

[Homer]

MORALITY?

So this is a "morality " issue? What a joke. Our incredibly corrupt society decides suddenly to intervene in this man's wishes to end his wife's live with siome dignity and suddenly everyone finds the time to comment on the "morality "of the situation. If this situatuion wasn't so serious it wuld be a joke. Whose morals? Yours? Gods? congress? Other soceity drops every thing to the lowest possible demonitor and all the sudden people bring up morality at this time! Is it moral to execute people on death row? Is it moral to deny the homeless food and shelter? What does the bible say about helping the needy? I am sure most religous conveniently forget about what Jesus said abouttaking care of those in need. Today we throw out insurance for children of the poor, do away with subsides to help the needy, rountinely allow people to die due to lack of access to timely healthcare, hand out weapons to warring countries etc. Where is the cry about "morality " on these issuses? Once again everyone wants to comment on a person matter that is NOT their business but no one is willing to step up and talk about the ture moral decay in our society and Scavios' death is the least of our worries on those lines.