this might b a stupid ? 2 ask!

[Big DV]

if u have 5000ius of hcg and mix it with 2mil of sterille water what would 500ius b on a slin pin? thanks guys

 

[GeeNo]

Depends on the volume of the syringe.

5000 IU / 2mL = 2500 IU/mL

Therefore, x = 500 IU / 2500 IU (concentration of solution per mL) = 0.2 mL.

 

[Flex4777]

You using 1cc slin pins or 1/2 cc slin pins?

 

[finny]

Depends on the volume of the syringe.

5000 IU / 2mL = 2500 IU/mL

Therefore, x = 500 IU / 2500 IU (concentration of solution per mL) = 0.2 mL.

To continue:

0.2ml or 20IUs

So, it will we 20 units on a slin pin regardless of size.

 

[Flex4777]

To continue:

0.2ml or 20IUs

So, it will we 20 units on a slin pin regardless of size.

true dat!

 

[GeeNo]

To continue:

0.2ml or 20IUs

So, it will we 20 units on a slin pin regardless of size.

IU is not a measurement of volume. Volume in this case is measured by mL, so you should be using the measurement in mL and NOT in IU for such cases, as the number of IU per set volume can varying dependant on the type of insulin syringe that you are using,

 

[finny]

IU is not a measurement of volume. Volume in this case is measured by mL, so you should be using the measurement in mL and NOT in IU for such cases, as the number of IU per set volume can varying dependant on the type of insulin syringe that you are using,

You're kidding right? I don't think you know what you're talking about. No need to complicate things with this volume bs.

Not sure what you mean by the 'type' of slin syringe.

Insuling syringes are based on IU-100. Maybe you should read a bit about it.

 

[GeeNo]

LOL. Well, I'm not going to result to calling you stupid or telling you to read, but believe me when I say I DO know exactly what I am talking about. There is more then one type of insulin syringe, IU-100 is just one. Therefore telling someone to use a certain amount of IU can be both innacurate and dangerous. In a 100 IU syringes, yes 20 IU would be 0.2 mL. Mind you, you mostly see the other sizes in veterinary medicine. Hence why I give measurements in volume because it is a STANDARD worldwide.

So no, I am not kidding.

 

[MacMan]

A little off topic, but I would use BAC water instead of sterile water to reconstitute the HCG if your planned dosage is 500iu a week.

Sterile water is sometimes supplied with HCG as the solvent, as the prescribed use of HCG would be to use the reconstituted solution very quickly. If you are planning on running 500iu a week, then the reconstituted solution of the 5000iu vial, will last 10 weeks. Unless you use BAC water (small amount of benzyl alcohol added) then you have an increased chance for bacteria growth in the solution over the 10 week period.

 

[finny]

LOL. Well, I'm not going to result to calling you stupid or telling you to read, but believe me when I say I DO know exactly what I am talking about. There is more then one type of insulin syringe, IU-100 is just one. Therefore telling someone to use a certain amount of IU can be both innacurate and dangerous. In a 100 IU syringes, yes 20 IU would be 0.2 mL. Mind you, you mostly see the other sizes in veterinary medicine. Hence why I give measurements in volume because it is a STANDARD worldwide.

So no, I am not kidding.

Sorry, mods. I think that you are stupid though. U100 is the standard for insulin syringes. All it means that 20IUs is 20IUs whether you move from 1cc U100 syringe (1ml or 100IUs) to U-40. As you guessed, 20IUs is 0.20ml - and no, ml is not a standard for slin syringes - U100 is.

In a nutshell it's one and the same and all I was saying is that for slin syringes it is easier to know that it is 20IUs on the dial as that is how it is marked and not in ml. No need to get your panty in a twist.

Not all people are as smart as you and it will be easier to draw 20IUs than 0.2ml.

 

[GeeNo]

Once again I am not going to result to name calling. I wasn't arguing with you. And this will be my last post directed to you, as obviously YOU'RE the one that doesn't know what he's talking about.

U-100 is the standard, yes. I have acknowledged that. But like I said, there are other sized insulin syringes, such as U-40 and U-60. Again, they are not that common and used mostly in veterinary medicine. 20 IU's in a 40-IU syringe is a different VOLUME then 20-IU in a 100-IU syringe. Are you not understanding that? Which is why I am never comfortable giving someone a measurement in IU. U-100 syringes are 1 mL, which should also be marked on the syringe. So in this case, it just so happens that 0.2 mL (in a one 100-IU 1 mL insulin syringe) is also 20 IU.

It really isn't a big deal, so please lets end it at that. His question has been answered so there is no need to continue. If you're still confused your welcomed to PM me.

 

[finny]

Sorry, disagreeing again.

20IUs is still 20IUs whether the syringe is U40, U100. First, I don't think there are U40 syringes. I think there are U100, U50, and U33/35.

I think you're confusing insulin concentrations U40 means concentration of 40IU in one ml and that's where you have to make adjustments between U100 syringes and U50 - you have to adjust for the concentration of slin.

Please read a bit about it before you make an argument.

If anyone else wants to chime in, they are welcomed. I would like to be proven wrong, but at the same time I don't like when people argue and they don't know one thing from another....

 

[GeeNo]

Alright now you're just annoying me. Let me explain something to you. I have worked in a veterinary hospital as a veterinary technician for three years now. I am in University working towards my DVM. I give insulin on regular basis to patients. So please YOU do the reading as you have made yourself out to be a fool trying to insult me.

Here is a picture of a U-40 insulin syringe. This particular syringe is made by Terumo. Note that the total volume of the syringe is 3/10th of a CC. That's 0.3 mL. In 20 units of this syringe there are 0.3 mL. Get it?

**broken link removed**

And there are infact U-40 syringes, as well as U-60 which you don't really see that often anymore.

**Edited to remove arguing, no need to stoop to that level.

 

[OuchThatHurts]

I don't know who this helps or hurts but IU's are a measure of an amount of a substance and has nothing to do with volume which is always measured in ml's.

Syringes are standardized to help the user maintain accuracy but concentration is always measured in IU's/ml.

0.1 ml could be 20, 40, or 100IU (or anything really) depending on whatever the concentration of the liquid (in this case) is. It could also be, for example, say 20IU's per mg of a solid. Just as an example.

 

[GeeNo]

I don't know who this helps or hurts but IU's are a measure of an amount of a substance and has nothing to do with volume which is always measured in ml's.

Syringes are standardized to help the user maintain accuracy but concentration is always measured in IU's/ml.

0.1 ml could be 20, 40, or 100IU (or anything really) depending on whatever the concentration of the liquid (in this case) is. It could also be, for example, say 20IU's per mg of a solid. Just as an example.

Thank you! That is what I was trying to say. The volume per IU on every syringe can vary, as it is a measure of the amount of units for that particular product by which the syringe was made for. With that said, for every type of syringe there is a certain volume associated with the number of IU.

 

[OuchThatHurts]

Thank you! That is what I was trying to say. The volume per IU on every syringe can vary, as it is a measure of the amount of units for that particular product by which the syringe was made for. With that said, for every type of syringe there is a certain volume associated with the number of IU.

Exactly. Because an "IU" is not a specific amount based on a common measurement. For instance, 20IU's of B12 in pure form would be a different amount than say 20IU's of crystallized insulin.

 

[finny]

Ok, first, I'll agree with you to a some degree.

Back to the original poster and humans for that matter. We all are using U100 concentrations of insulin. This means, 20IUs of insulin will always be 20IUs in either 1cc, 1/2cc, or 1/3 U100 syringe. As a result, 20IUs will always be 0.2ml in volume. That is what I was refering to.

The posters original question was to find out how would he know 500IUs at a given concentration - remember, we are dealing here with U100 insuling(where as 100IUs or insulin will be at 1ml or 1IUs at 0.01ml or 1 tick on U100 syringe - as opposed to U40 insuling where a concentration is different as 40IUs will be at 1ml or 1IU at 0.025ml). This will always be 20IUs whether this is 1cc, 1/2cc, or 1/3cc U100 insulin syringe. How in the hell is he going to know what 0.20ml is on the syringe if the unif of measurement is IUs?

It's nice that you are trying to apply knowledge learned in class. But, perhaps you should stick to pet forums as your knowledge applies there. Who the hell wants to use U40 insulin syringes in 1cc, 1/2cc, or 1/3cc for U100 insulin???

Do you understand the difference between U40 and U100 insulin? It has different concentrations per ml. We are obviously dealing here with U100 insulin and applicable syringes, so I'm not sure why you bring this vet crap in here - just to confuse things?

Second, the pic that you have posted is 20IUs or 1/2cc. You're confusing a lot of things here. I'm not sure I would be comfortable bringing my pet to you. This is meant to correspond with U40 insulin concentration at 1ml - so, for some that are not as strong at math, you come to mind, putting 10IUs of U40 insulin will always be 10IUs in a U40 insulin syringe regardless of size (1cc, 1/2cc, etc). For that matter, 1cc will be 40IUs 1/2cc will be 20IUs, etc.

To add, this whole thing was invented as some people/animals need different concentrations of insulin. I don't know about U40 insulin enough, but I think human use it too. It is just a different concentration and it is useful for people that only need 1IUs of insulin - it is easier to measure. But then there are insulin pens that will do this for you. That's another discussion altogether.

Get it?

Sorry, to the original poster.

To answer your question again, you will take 20units/markings on the U100 (human) insuling syringe.

 

[finny]

Thank you! That is what I was trying to say. The volume per IU on every syringe can vary, as it is a measure of the amount of units for that particular product by which the syringe was made for. With that said, for every type of syringe there is a certain volume associated with the number of IU.

Nope, the volume on U40 insulin syringe per IU will be different than the volume of U100 insulin syringe per IU. When dealing with U100 insuling syringes, as we all are, the volume per IU will always be the same - 10IUs will always be 10IUs whether the syringe size is 1cc, 1/2cc, or 1/3cc and this will always be 0.1ml (0.2ml - 20IUs, 0.5ml - 50IUs, 0.8ml - 80IUs). That's why it is easier to deal with U100 insulin syringes, especially when one is mixing their own water and powder as in HCG example. Using U40 insulin syringes would require one to figure the volume per IUs and apply to their situation. Which is more difficult than the above when one uses U100 insuling syringes.

The only time I woud use U40 insulin syringes if I were using U40 insulin. Pointless to the original question and pointless for most of us on this board.

Edit: I don't like to deal with volume as it is meaningless when one is trying to know how much to use on an insulin syringe. Try to measure volume of 1IU of U40 insulin - it is 0.025ml. Are you going to tell someone to use 0.025ml on a syringe. It is just stupid. Insulin syringes have foregone ml as volume measures as it is inaccurate. Instead, they have opted of IU (read Internation Units of measure) that are the same across the world.

 

[bubbafrombama]

Edit: I got some names mixed up based on trying to wade through all the arguing. I retract the name I used, as my post really isn't directed at any one individual on here, but instead just as some insight to help those understand the measurements, etc.


I know this has been explained in-depth, but I'm hopefully going to make this easy for those who are still unclear, or just reading this thread for the first time:

IMPORTANT: As clearly explained, an "iu" (International Unit) is a measure of the amount of active "substance" within the product! See here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_unit

International unit
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In pharmacology, the International unit (IU, alternatively abbreviated UI, from French unité internationale) is a unit of measurement for the amount of a substance, based on measured biological activity (or effect). It is used for vitamins, hormones, some drugs, vaccines, blood products and similar biologically active substances. Despite its name, the IU is not part of the International System of Units used in physics and chemistry.

The precise definition of one IU differs from substance to substance and is established by international agreement. To define an IU of a substance, the Committee on Biological Standardization of the World Health Organization provides a reference preparation of the substance, (arbitrarily) sets the number of IUs contained in that preparation, and specifies a biological procedure to compare other preparations to the reference preparation. The goal here is that different preparations with the same biological effect will contain the same number of IUs.

For some substances, the equivalent mass of one IU is later established, and the IU is then officially abandoned for that substance. However, the unit often remains in use nevertheless, because it is convenient. For example, Vitamin E exists in a number of different forms, all having different biological activities. Rather than specifying the precise type and mass of vitamin E in a preparation, for the purposes of pharmacology it is sufficient to simply specify the number of IUs of vitamin E.

The mass equivalents of 1 IU for selected substances:

1 IU Insulin: the biological equivalent of about 45.5 μg pure crystalline insulin (1/22 mg exactly)
1 IU Vitamin A: the biological equivalent of 0.3 μg retinol, or of 0.6 μg beta-carotene
1 IU Vitamin C: 50 μg L-ascorbic acid
1 IU Vitamin D: the biological equivalent of 0.025 μg cholecalciferol/ergocalciferol
1 IU Vitamin E: the biological equivalent of about 0.667 mg d-alpha-tocopherol (2/3 mg exactly), or of 1 mg of dl-alpha-tocopherol acetate
The IU should not be confused with the enzyme unit, which is also known as the "International unit of enzyme activity" and is abbreviated as U.

However IU is equivalent to IE the symbol for "international einheit"[1] the German name for the international unit.

Now that we have that out of the way (lol):

We know that:

1 ml = 1 cc
0.5 cc = 0.5 ml

Humans generally always use U-100 based insulin syringes. Some U-100 insulin syringes are sold in either quantity (1 ml or 0.5), and are always made up of "units" (do NOT confuse the word "unit" with "iu").

Therefore:

1 ml insulin syringe = 100 units (again, do NOT confuse this with "iu")
0.5 cc insulin syringe = 50 units (again, do NOT confuse this with "iu")

You will clearly see the units of measurement marked on the syringe.

Okay, easy enough so far?! Continuing...

As an example of a certain HGH product, if you're mixing Jintropin (GenSci) per the directions, then 1 vial mixed with 1 ml = 10 iu, per GenSci's packaging. However, the iu may be different for a different product, so always determine this by the packaging/instructions of the product you're using! Therefore, mixing Jintropin per the directions would yield:

1 ml = 10 iu

Therefore, every unit on the insulin syringe = 0.1 iu

i.e. if you wanted to do 2 iu daily, you would using 20 unit measurements on the insulin syringe.

Therefore, in this example of using Jintropin with a U-100 insulin syringe:

10 units = 1 iu
20 units = 2 iu
30 units = 3 iu
40 units = 4 iu
50 units = 5 iu
etc.
etc.

That wasn't that hard, now was it?

 

[finny]

Great, another scholar.

Let me guess, you haven't answered the original poster's question?

I really love when people quote Wikipedia and it makes them sound smarter.

I've never heard of 'measurement of fluid' - volume yes, not fluid.

Here I'll say it again:

1cc U-100 insulin syringe has a volume of 1cc=1ml=100 units/ticks whatever you want to call them. They all are measuring volume of the syringe which is 1ml.

1/2cc U-100 insulin syringe has a volume of 1/2cc=1/2ml=50 units/ticks.

From there, you have concentration of substance, which in most cases is per U-100 insulin standard.

Here is simple math that anyone can do:

5,000IUs Insulin goes into 2ml or 200units/tics
500IUs of insulin is calculated by multiplying =(500IUsx200units)/5,000IUs = 20units will give you 500IUs of insulin at above concentration.

To the lives I have endangered, I appologize