Interesting in regards to protein.

tr · Dec 22, 2012

sma said:
Who cares about a study you just clearly quoted a statement about max charles diet as its true and it might not be the healthiest but hes 300lbs off season

Get a clue.

Why dont you do a poll on everybody here whos in the 240s lean how much protein they ate to get there thats real world studies guaranteed they were all eating 2X plus body weight (because when in need of a surplus best thing to add would be ? (you guessed it)

I know what results a poll would give already.
but how do you think...
they ate more protein more because of they needed more than recomendations or because they were brainwashed to do so?
how do you think lowering protein or lowering/discontinueing AAS would cause more shrinkage?
why stop at 2x bodyweught? if more protein means more muscle why to stop at 2x, let's go to 3-4x bw and we will all be 300-400 pounds no?

Swaglantern · Dec 22, 2012

emeric delczeg said:
Depend on how long and how intense is your training, is not the protein inake that controls muscle growth, but rather the demand for growth caused by the trauma of intense exercise. No one ever grew an once of muscle from simply gulping protein. Muscle grow from pushing poundage period. So the trick is to match your individual protein to your program.

I totally agree, and this should be pretty much common knowledge.
When I train (for me personally what works) is I will get up in the morning, and take in mostly carbs. If i don't train until after lunch- then lunch will contain more carbs. When I say "mostly" this doesn't mean that the meals don't contain some protein - it's just weighted more towards the fuel side. After a strenuous training session I will drink a protein shake, and eat a very protein filled meal with a light snack before rest. Ive found this program can work quite well for me endurance wise. I was always taught that carbs fuel muscle, and protein helps repair it. If you aren't doing serious training you don't need serious protein. You really don't need serious carbs either ....I'm sure someone is going to tear into me now.

sma · Dec 22, 2012

tr said:
[/B]

I know what results a poll would give already.
but how do you think...
they ate more protein more because of they needed more than recomendations or because they were brainwashed to do so?
how do you think lowering protein or lowering/discontinueing AAS would cause more shrinkage?
why stop at 2x bodyweught? if more protein means more muscle why to stop at 2x, let's go to 3-4x bw and we will all be 300-400 pounds no?

I will not even go into any details ... your definitely not a bodybuilder I can say that for sure your a scientist...

Go to a scietific bodybuilding board this is a board with results .. not what if . or maybe or could be

sma · Dec 22, 2012

Swaglantern said:
I totally agree, and this should be pretty much common knowledge.
When I train (for me personally what works) is I will get up in the morning, and take in mostly carbs. If i don't train until after lunch- then lunch will contain more carbs. When I say "mostly" this doesn't mean that the meals don't contain some protein - it's just weighted more towards the fuel side. After a strenuous training session I will drink a protein shake, and eat a very protein filled meal with a light snack before rest. Ive found this program can work quite well for me endurance wise. I was always taught that carbs fuel muscle, and protein helps repair it. If you aren't doing serious training you don't need serious protein. You really don't need serious carbs either ....I'm sure someone is going to tear into me now.

its vary vague but it does make sense. However protein repairs muscle and your training regularly then all your meals should contain a good amount of protein(how much exactly) no one knows (if you start letting them rip all day though then your doing something wrong for sure LOL. I personally like more balanced meals and i feel I get better digestion. Including pineapple 1-2 silces in a meal has been another huge aspect for me

Swaglantern · Dec 22, 2012

sma said:
its vary vague but it does make sense. However protein repairs muscle and your training regularly then all your meals should contain a good amount of protein(how much exactly) no one knows (if you start letting them rip all day though then your doing something wrong for sure LOL. I personally like more balanced meals and i feel I get better digestion. Including pineapple 1-2 silces in a meal has been another huge aspect for me

Yea - I went through a phase where I was weighing and counting things, and came to the conclusion that it was detrimental, because while I have a lot of dedication regarding training - I get burned out regarding food intake. Yea I know it's part of training also - but I go more on feel and instinct. Ive been training so damn long it's kind of second nature sometimes. My biggest problem isn't how I eat but over training. Took me a while to realize that recovery was almost more important than everything else combined.

brutus69 · Dec 22, 2012

a poster made a good point here. eating 300+ grams/protein/day equals at least 241 pounds....pounds, of protein in one year. and putting on 10 pounds of real muscle is considered fantastic. so......where's all that extra protein going? right out your dickhole.
like the article said, upping total calories saves protein from being used in metabolic processes, energy, etc, making daily needs pretty small.
how about, instead of parroting whomever u choose to believe, you try altering your diet? you'll never know til u know, and really, you could end up saving a shit-ton of money if low protein's enough to grow on. as opposed to, say, eating 241 pounds a year.
after all, if you could get people to each buy dozens and dozens of pounds of your protein powder every year, wouldn't u tell them they need it???

PHIL HERNON · Dec 23, 2012

Yes

If you over train you will need more protein.......just to make it back to where you were before you trained! Do not over train, take in just enough protein.........just enough fats and just enough carbs to support your growth.........or not and get fat.

bruiser · Dec 23, 2012

Funny....

So after reading this, guys in this very thread that once argued about high protein diets and certain diets to get big, are suddenly saying you don't need high protein to build big muscle and its all hype to buy mass amounts of protein? That's what it sounds like IMO.

Not trying to be a Dick but what does this saying now mean "gotta have your diet in check if you're gonna grow"

I'm probably reading into things too much and taking things out of context but, some one please explain the contradictions here.

Turkishexpress · Dec 23, 2012

I have always been a good gainer with minimal protein. Maybe around 1g/lb. Never had an issue.

bruiser · Dec 23, 2012

Turkishexpress said:
I have always been a good gainer with minimal protein. Maybe around 1g/lb. Never had an issue.

So what "in your diet" attributes the growth in your opinion?

tr · Dec 23, 2012

bruiser said:
Funny....

So after reading this, guys in this very thread that once argued about high protein diets and certain diets to get big, are suddenly saying you don't need high protein to build big muscle and its all hype to buy mass amounts of protein? That's what it sounds like IMO.

Not trying to be a Dick but what does this saying now mean "gotta have your diet in check if you're gonna grow"

I'm probably reading into things too much and taking things out of context but, some one please explain the contradictions here.

please tell my what is high? for a normal person everything above 10-15% is high so on average more than 50-80g is considered to be high. 100g is high 150g is high 300 is high 600 is high. So what is high? I assume high for you is as high as you can possibly eat/afford to eat right?

The final word on protein(?) | Borge Fagerli – aka Blade: My blog and coaching services

emeric delczeg · Dec 23, 2012

bruiser said:
Funny....

So after reading this, guys in this very thread that once argued about high protein diets and certain diets to get big, are suddenly saying you don't need high protein to build big muscle and its all hype to buy mass amounts of protein? That's what it sounds like IMO.

Not trying to be a Dick but what does this saying now mean "gotta have your diet in check if you're gonna grow"

I'm probably reading into things too much and taking things out of context but, some one please explain the contradictions here.

Exercise causes the body to use protein at a much faster rate. You need to kip your body`s nitrogen balance in positive range, how much protein? depend on how long, how many times per day and how intense is your training. It can be from 1g to up to 3g per 2.2lbs body weight.

Swaglantern · Dec 23, 2012

Ive never taken in more than a 100 grams of protein a day at most, and usually average around 50grams give or take. My race weight is about 165lbs. I have hit 185 in the off season when I spend more time in the gym, and cross training...but like I said - I'm an endurance athlete, and my symptoms of over training simply means that I'm not getting any faster on the bike - I don't look forward to workouts, I have trouble sleeping, and my mood changes. Often times I can l look at my heart rate data and realize that my heart is no longer responding to efforts (great tool). Can I push through all of this? - absolutely, but the point is that I'm not making any gains. I you are a body building athlete then I would assume that it's the same scenario with different specifics in regards to activity. You probably don't look forward to work outs either, and you probably aren't getting any bigger. You may not get smaller - but you aren't growing. I don't think that eating more protein helps prevent over training, but as the above poster said you would probably up your protein in an over trained state. I'm not sure when a bodybuilder knows when they are over trained though. I think I just shifted topics...my bad.

bruiser · Dec 23, 2012

emeric delczeg said:
Exercise causes the body to use protein at a much faster rate. You need to kip your body`s nitrogen balance in positive range, how much protein? depend on how long, how many times per day and how intense is your training. It can be from 1g to up to 3g per 2.2lbs body weight.

I work out three hours a day, each bodypart 2x week. People will say over train, I say strong and prolong like a train.

PHIL HERNON · Dec 23, 2012

Pics

bruiser said:
I work out three hours a day, each bodypart 2x week. People will say over train, I say strong and prolong like a train.

You have pictures on here?

Swaglantern · Dec 23, 2012

bruiser said:
I work out three hours a day, each bodypart 2x week. People will say over train, I say strong and prolong like a train.

There is no way to tell by what someones accumulated efforts are if they are over training. Everything is dependent on genetics, how experienced you are, your nutrition, rest. etc.. You just can't look at someone and say - you are over training.

PHIL HERNON · Dec 23, 2012

Yes I agree

Swaglantern said:
There is no way to tell by what someones accumulated efforts are if they are over training. Everything is dependent on genetics, how experienced you are, your nutrition, rest. etc.. You just can't look at someone and say - you are over training.

But I sure can tell if working out 3 hours a day is working or not working well........

bruiser · Dec 23, 2012

emeric delczeg said:
Exercise causes the body to use protein at a much faster rate. You need to kip your body`s nitrogen balance in positive range, how much protein? depend on how long, how many times per day and how intense is your training. It can be from 1g to up to 3g per 2.2lbs body weight.