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FERTILITY RECOVERY !SOS!

provimed50

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Keep going dude, use the knowledge on this board.
There's one thing we ALL know, and that's that there are a TON (if not MOST) doctors that arent up to date on ANY KNOWLEDGE regarding this type of stuff. Hell, fertility, nutrition, muscle building....most Dr's and scientists are stuck in the 1960s. So keep talking to this dude and keep taking your stuff.
I know what I've to do, many people gave me already excellent advice and I run a very good protocol but my doc won't prescribe me HMG anymore. So I've to buy it on the black market, very expensive and cause covid and brexit UK sources don't get good gear.
 

herculeus

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Finally found out today that the wife is pregnant!

I pretty much listened to what Mike said and what Mike Arnold and Ben Chow have done.

Started Monday 11/23/2020

Monday/Wed/Friday- 50iu HMG

Tues/Th/Saturday- 2,000iu HCG

Proviron- 25mg twice a day

I eventually dropped the HCG down to about 1,000iu last couple week.

I was taking a little HCG/HMG since August but started the official protocol above just before Thanksgiving and finally conceived.

On top: I have been running a cycle of 900mg Test, 400mg EQ and 150mg Tren A since about October.

I would agree with Mike... takes about 5-6 months for recovery.
 

provimed50

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Finally found out today that the wife is pregnant!

I pretty much listened to what Mike said and what Mike Arnold and Ben Chow have done.

Started Monday 11/23/2020

Monday/Wed/Friday- 50iu HMG

Tues/Th/Saturday- 2,000iu HCG

Proviron- 25mg twice a day

I eventually dropped the HCG down to about 1,000iu last couple week.

I was taking a little HCG/HMG since August but started the official protocol above just before Thanksgiving and finally conceived.

On top: I have been running a cycle of 900mg Test, 400mg EQ and 150mg Tren A since about October.

I would agree with Mike... takes about 5-6 months for recovery.

Congrats brother! But I think u haven't abused roids as long as me, 13 years (without any break)?

I run 75 HMG EOD, 500 HCG EOD, 100 PROVIRON ED.

But since 8 weeks nothing, spermiogram bad, very bad and FSH after HMG injection only 1.2, no idea why. All pharma grade!
 

herculeus

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Thanks brotha!

You have me beat by about 4 years. Ive been on without any break for about 8-9 years.

I would bump up the HCG to about 2,000 iu or 2,500iu for a couple weeks or longer as Mike Arnold posted, same thing Bostin Lloyd did and then you can back off.

All pharma grade too? Interesting..... how expensive is that?

Only thing I can think of is the timing, have you been doing what you said above for at least 5-6 months? I started my protocol back in July and then ran out and started it back up while on a full blown cycle.

I got all my HCG/HMG from Board sponsor ClearSkyPharmacy, and asked for all Bayer.

I think its gonna come in time for you! Rooting for you brotha.

Congrats brother! But I think u haven't abused roids as long as me, 13 years (without any break)?

I run 75 HMG EOD, 500 HCG EOD, 100 PROVIRON ED.

But since 8 weeks nothing, spermiogram bad, very bad and FSH after HMG injection only 1.2, no idea why. All pharma grade!
 

provimed50

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Thanks brotha!

You have me beat by about 4 years. Ive been on without any break for about 8-9 years.

I would bump up the HCG to about 2,000 iu or 2,500iu for a couple weeks or longer as Mike Arnold posted, same thing Bostin Lloyd did and then you can back off.

All pharma grade too? Interesting..... how expensive is that?

Only thing I can think of is the timing, have you been doing what you said above for at least 5-6 months? I started my protocol back in July and then ran out and started it back up while on a full blown cycle.

I got all my HCG/HMG from Board sponsor ClearSkyPharmacy, and asked for all Bayer.

I think its gonna come in time for you! Rooting for you brotha.
Too much HCG in my opinion , 500 EOD is the perfect amount I think.

Yes all pharma grade, Ferring UK (from pharmacy)

No I'm running this protocol since (just) 8 weeks.

Stopped my cycle in Oct.(900 Sust, 450 Deca, 5 HGH) , then 200mg Cyp + 3x250IU HCG / week. Since Nov. '20 this here..
 

muscle96ss

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Too much HCG in my opinion , 500 EOD is the perfect amount I think.

Yes all pharma grade, Ferring UK (from pharmacy)

No I'm running this protocol since (just) 8 weeks.

Stopped my cycle in Oct.(900 Sust, 450 Deca, 5 HGH) , then 200mg Cyp + 3x250IU HCG / week. Since Nov. '20 this here..

I know you don't like Clomid, but if all else fails, please consider adding it at 100mg per day. I've always said that if I can conceive, anybody can, lol.
 

herculeus

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I do remember Mike Arnold saying there was a reason to start off that high and then you can back off. Even Matt porter (RIP) did something similar.

I know you may think 500 EOD is the perfect amount but since you have been doing that and it hasn't worked might as well try it for a couple weeks right? I don't see what you have to loose even for a couple weeks 2-3 tops. Just an idea.

I have a feeling that in another couple months you should be golden.


Im gonna post everything I collected for you in my notes folder for fertility. Hope you find it useful.

Fertility Protocol by Mike Arnold





5 weeks after last pin get blood work done for test, estrogen, LH and fsh


Then 2000iu hcg 3x a week


Followerd by clomod 6-9 weeks once hcg causes normal levels of test. Clomid is 100mg per day for two weeks followed by 50mg











*15-20 million spent count needed for high rate pregnancy.


*Need 1-2 million production on cycle, if so can use external FSH


*use hcg for LH and Hmg for FSH (spermatogenesis)


*full spermatogenesis takes 40 days one starting hmg so keep taking until conceive.








Mon/Wed/Fri: HMG @ 75 iu


Tues/Thurs/Sat: HCG @ 2,000








You need HMG more than HCG, so if you only had one, HMG is the way to go. HCG appears to compliments the HMG by increasing sperm production indirectly, but HMG DIRECTLY increases sperm production because it contains FSH (follicle stimulating hormone). This is the actual hormone responsible for stimulating sperm production in the body.





On the other hand, HCG mimics LH (leutinizing hormone), which is the hormone responsible for stimulating testosterone production, not sperm production.





However, as mentioned above, combining HCG with HMG seems to have a synergistic effect on sperm production, so using both is ideal. You can use this protocol when you are ON or OFF steroids. It does not matter, as these compounds bypass the first two stages of the HPTA and head directly to the testes, where they stimulate testosterone and sperm production directly. I have had numerous people report great success with this protocol


Too much HCG in my opinion , 500 EOD is the perfect amount I think.

Yes all pharma grade, Ferring UK (from pharmacy)

No I'm running this protocol since (just) 8 weeks.

Stopped my cycle in Oct.(900 Sust, 450 Deca, 5 HGH) , then 200mg Cyp + 3x250IU HCG / week. Since Nov. '20 this here..
 

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provimed50

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I know you don't like Clomid, but if all else fails, please consider adding it at 100mg per day. I've always said that if I can conceive, anybody can, lol.
even when I pin exo. test? (200mg/wk)
 

provimed50

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I do remember Mike Arnold saying there was a reason to start off that high and then you can back off. Even Matt porter (RIP) did something similar.

I know you may think 500 EOD is the perfect amount but since you have been doing that and it hasn't worked might as well try it for a couple weeks right? I don't see what you have to loose even for a couple weeks 2-3 tops. Just an idea.

I have a feeling that in another couple months you should be golden.


Im gonna post everything I collected for you in my notes folder for fertility. Hope you find it useful.

Fertility Protocol by Mike Arnold





5 weeks after last pin get blood work done for test, estrogen, LH and fsh


Then 2000iu hcg 3x a week


Followerd by clomod 6-9 weeks once hcg causes normal levels of test. Clomid is 100mg per day for two weeks followed by 50mg











*15-20 million spent count needed for high rate pregnancy.


*Need 1-2 million production on cycle, if so can use external FSH


*use hcg for LH and Hmg for FSH (spermatogenesis)


*full spermatogenesis takes 40 days one starting hmg so keep taking until conceive.








Mon/Wed/Fri: HMG @ 75 iu


Tues/Thurs/Sat: HCG @ 2,000








You need HMG more than HCG, so if you only had one, HMG is the way to go. HCG appears to compliments the HMG by increasing sperm production indirectly, but HMG DIRECTLY increases sperm production because it contains FSH (follicle stimulating hormone). This is the actual hormone responsible for stimulating sperm production in the body.





On the other hand, HCG mimics LH (leutinizing hormone), which is the hormone responsible for stimulating testosterone production, not sperm production.





However, as mentioned above, combining HCG with HMG seems to have a synergistic effect on sperm production, so using both is ideal. You can use this protocol when you are ON or OFF steroids. It does not matter, as these compounds bypass the first two stages of the HPTA and head directly to the testes, where they stimulate testosterone and sperm production directly. I have had numerous people report great success with this protocol

bro thats what I do since 8 weeks, I know how things are working!

Clomid is useless for me , I'm on TRT.

75HMG EOD
500 HCG EOD (too much could be bad cause it's overstimulating the system)
200 Cyp /week

Actually my FSH increased to 2.0 (before <0.2) , hope thats a good sign, next spermiogram on January 18th. Last one was after 4 weeks HCG / HMG (650.000). Before I think I had zero.
 

muscle96ss

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provimed50

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Yes, I never came off for either of my kids.
I prefer HCG HMG bro, paid £6.2k for the 6 month run, insurance paid 50% but after 4wks I had already an FSH levels 10 times higher than before!
Before: <0.2 , after 4 weeks 2.4

Says the FSH much or possible that I'm although infertile? (We'll see in one week).

Clomid is horrible for my psych. I don't tolerate more than 25mg ED or 50 EOD.

All other values are also in perfect range!
 

shaker88

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Sep 26, 2018
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the answer is this:

for 3 to 4 months

hcg 1000-2000 IUs eod
hmg 75 IUs eod
zinc , L-carnitine

doesn't make a difference whether you stay on or cycle off.
start the protocol with normal testis size, if yours are atrophied stay on hcg only till they get back to normal.
nothing else is needed, maybe up your dose of AI if u stay on to prevent hcg stimulated aromatization.
 

TheOtherOne55

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I know the HMG is a must but I've seen SO many protocols for HCG....

Some say 2500ius 2-3 times a week (for 1-2 weeks) and then back off to 500-1000ius from then on.
Then i see some say 2500ius for as long as possible (2-3 times a week).

Is there any REAL answer or are these just different opinions and protocols?
 

MouthBreather1982

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Last time all I could find was chinese HCG and it was not local and might not have worked and kind of a pain to get, other wise I would keep taking it year round for the pregnenolone effects. Sponsors should make more of an effort to carry both.
 

TheOtherOne55

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so does this mean no sex for 40 days?

I assume you can have sex, it just means the results from the HMG wont be realllly showing until 40 days in.
It takes 40 days for the sperm to fully mature
 

Sides

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I assume you can have sex, it just means the results from the HMG wont be realllly showing until 40 days in.
It takes 40 days for the sperm to fully mature

This is the point that many guys find hard to accept, that they won't start seeing results from taking HCG and HMG until after successive sperm cycles have completed maturation of the sperm in the body. The sperm are there growing, but they won't be ready to be ejaculated until the sperm cycle is complete.

The length of a sperm cycle varies a lot from one individual to another. It used to be a rule of thumb that it was about 2.5 months, but studies have showed a range of 42 to 76 days from the time of sperm production to ejaculation in normal men.

 

Sides

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I know the HMG is a must but I've seen SO many protocols for HCG....

Some say 2500ius 2-3 times a week (for 1-2 weeks) and then back off to 500-1000ius from then on.
Then i see some say 2500ius for as long as possible (2-3 times a week).

Is there any REAL answer or are these just different opinions and protocols?

There is no REAL answer, if only because studies will never be done in a real-world setting with bodybuilders using the types and dosages of drugs that we do. A study like that would be considered irresponsible by the traditional medical community. And so we are left to sift through the studies out there on HCG/HMG/FSH use, and experiment to find what is applicable to us, and what each individual can take and tolerate (and afford, as fertility is an expensive business) without too many negative side effects.

Larry Lipshultz's work at Baylor with men on TRT using HCG to regain fertility is a good guide to try to figure out what will work for you.

What worked for me personally, after 28 years of heavy test and other steroid use and abuse, was:

200-300mg Test per week
30-60iu HMG every day
500iu HCG every other day

Without that protocol, I would never have had my daughter, who is almost 14 months old now, big and bright and beautiful, and the greatest blessing in my life.

Other guys will have protocols that worked for them, and of course there will be guys for whom their protocol didn't work. But then there's plenty of "normal" people who have trouble conceiving as well.

So in the end, all we can do is roll the dice, give it our best shot (quite literally), hope and pray that the sperm and egg come together. Use what has worked for other guys as your guide. But there will never be an official study to determine what is the best protocol for the typical bodybuilder. And who is the typical bodybuilder anyway?
 

Sosa123

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Im gonna give u the best advice Ever .... Clomid and Maca Root she can take maca root as well.... I was running heavy cycles very very heavy and now a 1 year old and one on the way (shes 3 n a half months preg) best of luck!
 

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