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GH and T3 on Low Carb Days

BigDonald

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I had to make a new account since it had been 8 years since I had my old on, so bear with me on the "new user" moniker. Anyway, I digress...

I know the debate on T4 and T3 with HGH, but I was thinking about something the other day as I started carb cycling for my show coming up in 5 weeks.

So as of now i'm running

Test E: 400mg/week
Tren E: 400mg/week
Mast E: 400mg/week
Meditrope GH: 3.33 IU daily
T4: 100mcg daily
Clen: 100mcg daily
Ketotifen: 1mg daily
Taurine: 5g daily
TUDCA: 250mg twice daily
Multis, Fish, Oil, etc. (you get the point)

I will be switching to short esters and adding Winstrol at 4 weeks. I run the T4 to help with T4>T3. My question is that knowing that that process requires carbohydrates to happen, would it be beneficial to add T3 on my no carb days. My current carb splits are High, Med, Med, High, 0, 0, 0.

I was considering adding T3 at 12.5mcg daily to speed up a some fat loss in general, but I really don't think it's necessary as long as I have T4, GH and carbs to convert. What do you think?
 

goal245

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I was considering adding T3 at 12.5mcg daily to speed up a some fat loss in general, but I really don't think it's necessary as long as I have T4, GH and carbs to convert. What do you think?
Is it necessary? Have to do blood work to see if it's "necessary" for you.

Can you still use it to help with fat loss - Yes

start at 25mcg and work up 12.5mcg every week till you get to 75-100mg per day. This will help fatloss
 

BigDonald

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Is it necessary? Have to do blood work to see if it's "necessary" for you.

Can you still use it to help with fat loss - Yes

start at 25mcg and work up 12.5mcg every week till you get to 75-100mg per day. This will help fatloss
You don't think that the addition of (or too much) T3 will have an undesired effect due to the negative feedback loop or the deiodinase process?
 

Pretzel Logic

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Don't think it's a good idea. You can't just take T3 one day and have it work that day, and then not take it the next day and be off it's effects. It takes a day to start raising your metabolism and does not stop immediately. Your thyroid loops would be messed up and unpredictable. Really, you probably wouldn't notice and would just have the same effect as using a low dose of T3. Anyway you have to be on T3/T4 or not. Your plan is probably fine as is with no T3, but you could probably up the T4 half the week, if you calculate half life and effective life, conversion time etc. to get the effect you want from only taking the T3 on certain days. I've never known it to be done, and don't have any experience though.
 

goal245

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You don't think that the addition of (or too much) T3 will have an undesired effect due to the negative feedback loop or the deiodinase process?
You would have to take it everyday
 

BigDonald

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Don't think it's a good idea. You can't just take T3 one day and have it work that day, and then not take it the next day and be off it's effects. It takes a day to start raising your metabolism and does not stop immediately. Your thyroid loops would be messed up and unpredictable. Really, you probably wouldn't notice and would just have the same effect as using a low dose of T3. Anyway you have to be on T3/T4 or not. Your plan is probably fine as is with no T3, but you could probably up the T4 half the week, if you calculate half life and effective life, conversion time etc. to get the effect you want from only taking the T3 on certain days. I've never known it to be done, and don't have any experience though.
I figured with the short half life of T3 (1 day) that taking about 50mcg for those 3 days might end up with a pretty significant bump in heat. And with the significantly long half life of T4 (5-6 days), it could help a bit. My main concern was the inhibition of T4>T3 conversion on my 3 days of low carb.
 

Pretzel Logic

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You're right, raising T4 for a couple days wouldn't work because of the half life. I still think something like 3 days on, four days off, would be erratic. There is sometimes a rebound effect coming off T3, don't know how that would factor in. If you do it, post your results and effects. It would be educational, I think.
 

BigDonald

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You're right, raising T4 for a couple days wouldn't work because of the half life. I still think something like 3 days on, four days off, would be erratic. There is sometimes a rebound effect coming off T3, don't know how that would factor in. If you do it, post your results and effects. It would be educational, I think.
I would continue the T4 daily at 100mcg. I was just thinking of adding the T3 in for the days I may not convert, i.e no carb days.

I'm not sure simply raising T4 would have an effect as the issue isn't a lack of T4, but more of a lack of conversion of T4 to T3 due to lack of carbs.

Maybe just running 12.5mcg of T3 alongside 100mcg of T4 is the way to go.
 

Stewie

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The rate increase of T4 to T3 in peripheral tissues by GH is going to supersed the induction of lowish carbs.

I understand your Indulging hypothesis. IMO, there's never a need to run high doses of liothyronine. Physiological is the key.

When you push the envelope unnecessary outcomes are inevitable.
 

goal245

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I'm not sure you understand my question
I understand, don't overthink, if you want to get as lean as possible take t3, if you want to be safe and avoid "undesired effects" then don't mess with hormones.

One way to know what or how much you need is to get bloodwork, anything else is guessing.

I think the clen you are taking is far more dangerous than t3. clen kills heart cells, although not at the doses we use but you can bet it's not good for the heart either way
 

BigDonald

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The rate increase of T4 to T3 in peripheral tissues by GH is going to supersed the induction of lowish carbs.

I understand your Indulging hypothesis. IMO, there's never a need to run high doses of liothyronine. Physiological is the key.

When you push the envelope unnecessary outcomes are inevitable.
Yeah I had no intention of running anything outlandish as suggested by most "protocols". I decided to add 12.5mcg. Took 25 this morning to front load as the half life seems to be about a day. Temperature was 98.1 upon waking. We'll see what it rises to.
 

BigDonald

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I understand, don't overthink, if you want to get as lean as possible take t3, if you want to be safe and avoid "undesired effects" then don't mess with hormones.

One way to know what or how much you need is to get bloodwork, anything else is guessing.

I think the clen you are taking is far more dangerous than t3. clen kills heart cells, although not at the doses we use but you can bet it's not good for the heart either way
The question was not whether to take a thyroid hormone or not. I'm already using T4. The question was whether to add T3 on low carb days due to down regulation of T4>T3 conversion during low carb states. No matter as I've decided to run between 12.5mcg and 25mcg daily alongside the 100mcg T4.
 

BigDonald

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In the interest of being thorough, I wanted to update this. I did in face run 12.5 for a week and increased to 25 for a week and am currently running 50mcg T3 alongside of 100mcg T4. I've noticed a little bit of heat, but nothing drastic. I think the use of Raloxifene has blunted some of the effect of both these hormones. I try to take them 12 hours apart in order to alleviate some of the issue. I have lost some BF and have significantly tightened up, but it's hard to attribute these results to that alone as I have switched to short esters and added 100mg winstrol for these last 3 weeks before the show.

One interesting fact is that I had been using 5IU Meditrope for some time, but when adding in the T3, I immediately started getting more sides. I now have MUCH more joint water retention, and the carpel tunnel is INSANE. Luckily I will be dropping the GH at the end of this week. I'm not sure if the two are related, but it's the only thing I really "added".

Edit: Forgot to mention that my carbs are 0 this week. Energy is definitely down. Lol
 
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