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Low Frequency training...

cal

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Hi

Been lifting for well over 25 years. Done basically every sort of split, bro split, push pull leg, full body, high frequency powerlifts, 5-3-1 etc.

Despite having lifted for so long, I still get very sore and my most responsive and most genetically advantaged parts tend to get the sorest. I'm in mid 40s and also do BJJ recreationally. I have decided to try a split where each major muscle group is trained once every 9 days. I have responded to from major muscle 3x a week to once a week but lately been finding higher frequency is too much for my joints along with BJJ even if the volume is adjusted in each workout.

Anyone train with much 9 or more days rest between parts on a regular basis. Id be doing a 4 way split over 3 days of training per week. Interested to hear what people's experiences have been. Thanks.
 
Hi

Been lifting for well over 25 years. Done basically every sort of split, bro split, push pull leg, full body, high frequency powerlifts, 5-3-1 etc.

Despite having lifted for so long, I still get very sore and my most responsive and most genetically advantaged parts tend to get the sorest. I'm in mid 40s and also do BJJ recreationally. I have decided to try a split where each major muscle group is trained once every 9 days. I have responded to from major muscle 3x a week to once a week but lately been finding higher frequency is too much for my joints along with BJJ even if the volume is adjusted in each workout.

Anyone train with much 9 or more days rest between parts on a regular basis. Id be doing a 4 way split over 3 days of training per week. Interested to hear what people's experiences have been. Thanks.
I've only done the bro split so once every week. I think skip hill was doing something similar to you... there was a thread about it a few months back and skip was talking about it on think big bodybuilding (YouTube)
 
Arthur Jones and Mike Menzer would think that was a great idea.
Jones was actually a proponent of high frequency. Three times a week full-body workouts.

I think Mentzer was initially the same until Heavy Duty II and then started training less and less. Some people think that had a lot to do with the loss in 1980 and disillusionment and apathy for training and the sport.
 
Give it a bash why not, if you're able to add weight to the bar for moderate to high rep sets then there you go.
 
Arthur Jones and Mike Menzer would think that was a great idea.
Paul Carter would too lol. In a year he will be saying it's too frequent and too much volume.
 
Paul Carter would too lol. In a year he will be saying it's too frequent and too much volume.
Seems to be Jones thinking too from my reading. Once a week per muscle for most was what he thought in his later years.
 
You still have issues with weekly? I would think the volume needed for 9 days rest would be just as taxing.
 
Less frequency = high intensity high volume training. No problem here just give it!
 
You still have issues with weekly? I would think the volume needed for 9 days rest would be just as taxing.
Im old and bjj training really for me takes its toll on recovery.
 
Arthur Jones and Mike Menzer would think that was a great
MM got to point where he was advocating alot less than what I was thinking. Medium low volume every 9 days...he was advocating a few sets once every 2 weeks at some point I think. I was thinking 10 hard sets or so a bodypart.
 
MM got to point where he was advocating alot less than what I was thinking. Medium low volume every 9 days...he was advocating a few sets once every 2 weeks at some point I think. I was thinking 10 hard sets or so a bodypart.
I think 10-20 is what most reccomend per week as for the "evidence based" crowd. Then you have Paul and borge saying if you need more than 4 your a pussy who doesn't generate the superman intensity that they do. Mike Israetel has some chart out people reference too for average volume...I think it's a decent guide and unlike Paul and his possie it acknowledges that different muscles may have different volume reccomendations.
 
I think 10-20 is what most reccomend per week as for the "evidence based" crowd. Then you have Paul and borge saying if you need more than 4 your a pussy who doesn't generate the superman intensity that they do. Mike Israetel has some chart out people reference too for average volume...I think it's a decent guide and unlike Paul and his possie it acknowledges that different muscles may have different volume reccomendations.
Not an Israetel fan for many reasons nor a fan of the "evidence based" crowd at all. The studies aren't very relevant to the board, and even if these studies used enough bodybuilders there are far far too many variables to control for. I can't take someone with his background calling himself Doctor very seriously, pretentious and embarassing.
 
I’m late 40s and only train 3 days a week or every other. I still hurt and have stiffness often. If your 9 days means you don’t feel like shit then go for it. If BJJ is something your enjoying more perhaps and you can’t recover from both then reduce the one you enjoy the least for a while. Maybe even just look at callisthenics type bodyweight training for a while. Or have a good old deload and focus on mobility
 
Not an Israetel fan for many reasons nor a fan of the "evidence based" crowd at all. The studies aren't very relevant to the board, and even if these studies used enough bodybuilders there are far far too many variables to control for. I can't take someone with his background calling himself Doctor very seriously, pretentious and embarassing.
I'm not huge on Mike but he has put out some good stuff his humor is annoying..but he's excellent at explaining the science stuff. I personally don't really use his methods other than myo match and I'll glance at his volume chart occasionally for reference as I see it mentioned alot online.

But in general I agree most studies are either flawed or not applicable advanced lifters who use AAS, train with actual intensity, etc I tend to read the research then follow more bro science myself. Ex....use the bro split alot although it's supposedly sub optimal and love Alfrescos pre exhaust type sets although the scientists say not to do them.
 
I'm not huge on Mike but he has put out some good stuff his humor is annoying..but he's excellent at explaining the science stuff. I personally don't really use his methods other than myo match and I'll glance at his volume chart occasionally for reference as I see it mentioned alot online.

But in general I agree most studies are either flawed or not applicable advanced lifters who use AAS, train with actual intensity, etc I tend to read the research then follow more bro science myself. Ex....use the bro split alot although it's supposedly sub optimal and love Alfrescos pre exhaust type sets although the scientists say not to do them.

Mike's volume recommendations are way overkill for most people.

Most would do far better scaling way back and getting strong.
 
you will absolutely be able to build muscle -even as an advanced guy- by hitting each muscle once every 9 days. I know that for a fact

You want something different? Skip the negative portion of each rep as much as you can. Like for example do concentration curls for biceps where one arm lifts the dumbbell and then on the negative portion you use your other hand to bring it down. People will cry here saying -if anything- you have to emphasize the eccentric, but I am in your position and get very sore and strongly reccomend you give this a try.
 
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you will absolutely be able to build muscle -even as an advanced guy- by hitting each muscle once every 9 days. I know that for a fact

You want something different? Skip the negative portion of each rep as much as you can. Like for example do concentration curls for biceps where one arm lifts the dumbbell and then on the negative portion you use your other hand to bring it down. People will cry here saying -if anything- you have to emphasize the eccentric, but I am in your position and get very sore and strongly reccomend you give this a try.
Ill give this a try. Thanks for the idea.
 
The majority of stimulus for hypertrophic response in skeletal muscle is between 12-20 sets taken to technical failure over the period of a week.. 7 days.

If you were to target a muscle every 9 days that is roughly every 1.3~ weeks.

If you adjust your volume accordingly
That’s around 16-20 sets to near failure per muscle group every 9 days.

That data is in natural athletes however.

If you’re overly sore I think you need to adjust your diet, rest, or gear honestly.

Your post implies your DOMS is overbearing and that you want to avoid it. But training less frequent and more intensely has shows to INCREASE soreness following training.

I recall Platz in his prime would train legs 1-2x a month due to how beat up he got from infrequent volume and high stimulus.

You are trying to balance a stimulus to fatigue ratio by reducing frequency.. in order to compensate for the reduction in frequency with training in isolation you will have to either increase intensity or volume of your lifting both of which will further increase muscle soreness.

I think you need you reevaluate or further clarify your goal because you can’t say you want the same results while doing less and also taking it easier.
 

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