please all read////

[Big Wheel]

Wonder if your teacher was on birth control.... we live in a society where almost 50% of the population has messed with their natural hormone levels virtually since puberty and the effects of that are apparently not extreme enough to bother addressing. Personally I've found that my diet and my blood sugar level has a much more dramatic effect on my emotional condition than my "supplementation".... but for good or bad, living with any excess for a long time will change a person.

Same here, blood sugar and diet are key to mental health, Processed foods with additives and other chemicals really fuck with me.

The key is to be aware of what factors are influencing your emotional well being and learning to control them.

 

[Amazon Doll]

I've been around the BBing lifestyle since the late 70's and can say that I have seen more emotional problems in my friends that have been lifelong users. Some hjave gone off the deep end and I have had conversations with people about this subject.

Maybe everyone in the world has troubles that mount up and causes a crash, and because some of us are around aas more it might seem that that can be the root cause. I don't know if it is or not

 

[TooPowerful4u]

CMON now....

Emotions yes, but IQ? Cmon now. I was tested extremely high when i was young and tested along for my ADHD. The joke was my ADHD kept me from being able to utalize my IQ haha. The only thing i am able to be good at (concentrate on) are things that interest me (scored perfect on SAT's in math, bombed english). Also the reason i am so good with fitness, nutrition, anatomy, etc...but suck at reading and fixing cars, etc... You could offer me any amount of money to write a research paper on something i hate, and unless i take a ton of neural stims, im screwed. I refused to take the medications that i researched and found were mind control drugs. That said...i feel i am much smarter and mentally developed today than i was years ago when my IQ tested so high. There is no way AAS has made me dumber.

Maybe this is based on dumb people taking steroids in the first place. I dont think if you give them to a more intelligent person that it will cause his mental capacity to diminish.

 

[nosmas]

I really think it depends on the person and what they are prone too. If you tend to pattern aggresive behavior then that will possiblly come out of you.

My thoughts are the same right now. Dependant on society, growing up, genetics ets...
Altered...hell yes, no dispute.
Permanent...I think the level of permanent loss depends from person to person.

Good thought to post though...Somethings to think about.

 

[Massive G]

Yes big time, AAS effect brain chemistry pretty bad.
Isn't there a study somewhere that shows people with high test levels have lower IQ's.
I sure feel dumber than when I started all this stuff.

I am rushed for time or I'd write more as I think your post brings up a good point.

I guess you guys missed the smiley. Yes there was a study supposedly based on IQ and test levels, it also included a higher propensity for violence and was done on prisoners I think.
Accurate? nope and skewed as many other social things are probably going on there with those fellas.
Steroids affect everything-especially brain chemistry just because there isn't a study on it doesn't mean it isn't possible. Especially in people practicing polypharmacy on them selves with 10 different things.

 

[violentmessiah]

I got the smiley

yep...... "studies" are usually biased/skewed. That was why my reply was what it was, sarcastic and dry...
Hormones absolutely alter chemistry EVERYWHERE...."cascade"....
Studies done on prisoners, eh? As in "violent offenders had higher levels of testosterone"?
Makes sense that a study would be done on prisoners and indicate this. Testosterone does make one more aggressive, no doubt about it, doesn't mean it has absolutely has to make someone violent.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

OF COURSE

AND IF ANYONE TELLS YOU THAT THEY KNOW HOW EACH STEROID WORKS IN COMBINATION WITH OTHERS AT THE DOSAGES SOME OF THESE GUYS ARE TAKING THEY ARE FULL OF SHIT. IT CRACKS ME UP WHEN GUYS COME ON HERE AND ASK HOW THEIR CYCLE LOOKS. IT IS SAD WHEN I SEE YOUNG GUYS ON HERE GIVING THEIR FRIENDS CYCLE ADVICE. EACH AND EVERY PERSON IS A WALKING EXPERIMENT...........BELIEVE THAT. SOME EXPERIMENTS FAIL MISERABLY, OTHERS DO OK, SOME BENEFIT GREATLY AND OTHERS GO INTO AN ABYSS THAT THEY CAN NEVER DRAG THEMSELVES OUT OF. THIS SPORT IS NOT FOR EVERYONE AND IF IT IS NOT FOR YOU AND YOU MISS THE RED FLAGS..........GOD BLESS YOU AND EVERYONE IN YOUR LIFE.

 

[Syn]

I've been doing them for years but I noticed you have to take the right dosage for your body. Too much will make you more confident but you also lose patience. You don't have those crazy side effects if you don't abuse gear.
My IQ is exactly the same or better, and I feel the same as I ever was. the only thing that makes me feel depressed are antiestrogens like Nolvadex, Clomid,etc, in PCT.
Why don't those big pharmas develop something that restores testosterone without getting rid of estrogen?

 

[steele]

i suffer from and take meds for depression...

...before and after AAS use. i fall in the "clinically depressed" category and blood work and etc. revealed my brain does not produce enough serotnin for me to maintain moods or keep anxiety at bay.
i did some looking into it and although testosterone can increase aggression at the same time it raises serotonin as well. according to a "study" i read. and from personal experience i will say its true. i have done the dumbest shit in my life OFF of AAS and when i hit the 6-8 week mark of being on a moderate to high dose of testosterone i always say, "i feel like a god." (damn that sounds dumb after writing it) but point is it seems to make me feel...better. like something i was missing is now present. i attribute that to the increase in serotonin and thats why when people get off of test they usually fall into a depression cuz your serotonin levels come back down.

i struggle w alcoholism (rampant in my family) and that is almost THE reason i started this lifestyle was becasue i needed physique goals to keep me from the bottle. i needed to eat healthy and have regimented workout schedules to keep me from drinking and wrecking my health and life.

i fall into deep depressions from time to time EVEN with meds, but the frequency of them drop DRAMATICALLY when i am on test.

as far as them making you dumber, they call him Milos THE MIND for god's sake and he is brilliant (excuse me but i am a huge fan of his) and i gotta say there seems to be alot of bright guys on here, myself included -STEELE

 

[GeeNo]

In my opinion, this is where the fine line between use and abuse comes into play. Personally, I don't feel that 'safe' or 'responsible
(and I know these are very abstract words, especially in this context) that there would be no significant changes.

With that said, you have to keep in mind the mindset of the majority of people that get into bodybuilding. In a lot of cases, we are obsessed with perfection and never happy. We are never big enough, never lean enough, never proportioned enough, etc. Also, a lot of us have very addictive personalities and in a sense could be considered OCD in some aspects. That is a very unstable mindset to start with, so when you add drugs in to the equation I think a lot of dependancy is developed among other psycological changes.

Then again, I don't think anyone here is a doctor or more specifically a endocrinologist, so I don't know that any of us are truly qualified to speak with confidence on the matter. I would assume though that there are some obvious psychological changes with prolonged hormone alteration. Also, there is a definite and defined change in emotions with supraphysiological hormone levels, however this 'change' varies from person to person.

 

[STEEDA69]

Again you have to compare proper USE against ABUSE.
thats why we take breaks and dont stay on year around.

EXACTLY!

There's a HUGE difference between use (going on a HRT dose of 200-400 mgs / week) and abuse (1000-2000mgs and more for years at a time and the stopping). It's sometimes referred to as the hormonal see-saw and it can have devastating effects on the human Psyche!



STEEDA~

 

[Uluwatu]

YES, it really messes with the brain and the emotions. I have learned the "secret" to "stability" with AAS is CONTROL. Before I go off I tell myself the word "control" and think about it before I react. Same especially with my home life.......

Mike

This is a good thread. I find that my emotions are all over the place when I'm "on". I can go from happy to sad to having no patience for anything, and then back to happy all within one day. But as stated above, the key is control, which is a good way to put it. All in all I believe that anabolics screw with your brain chemistry. And being in control of our emotions is part of the game. Sometimes it is easier said than done.

 

[oldfella]

Yes they do have a profound effect on your mental faculties. I do believe as Phil said, some of us are more adapted (for lack of a better word) to the changes that take place than others. This is why we see so many diferent cycles using the same drugs at different doses producing varying effects on each individual. I believe that one thing we all have in common is an altered mental state when on vs. when off. Again some handle it better than others. Now is this altered state permanent, well it may depend on how long, how much and what you used. I also am of the opinion that much of it is psychological and not a physical change in the mind. It does alter chemistry, no doubt but if you are one of the individuals that realizes and can pinpoint these changes and deal with them, then you should be ok with that. As men it is no secret that test will alter our moods dramatically. Too low and we can suffer depression, loss of confidence, feeling of low self worth. Too high and we can display aggression, selfishness, promiscuity, infidelity and others. This is in an individual that would not or might not display these tendancies. This is where the scientific and medical community fail us to a degree. They have all the walking experiments they want and will not gather data relevant to give us definitive answers to the question that has just been asked. But I think we all, or most of us already know the answer!!

 

[dragonfire101]

Too low and we can suffer depression, loss of confidence, feeling of low self worth. Too high and we can display aggression, selfishness, promiscuity, infidelity and others.

and them comes into play that it would be dose dependent for each individual to what affect you may get. Like me. Im thinking I need at leats 300mg a week just not to be tired and depressed etc etc. I know some buddies who are actually nicer on gear at moderate dosages. TheIr attitude tends to change once they get higher 1gm plus EW. Thats them not saying 1 gm or more everyone willl start to have mor enegative type behaviors.

 

[lacrima_mortis]

AND IF ANYONE TELLS YOU THAT THEY KNOW HOW EACH STEROID WORKS IN COMBINATION WITH OTHERS AT THE DOSAGES SOME OF THESE GUYS ARE TAKING THEY ARE FULL OF SHIT. IT CRACKS ME UP WHEN GUYS COME ON HERE AND ASK HOW THEIR CYCLE LOOKS. IT IS SAD WHEN I SEE YOUNG GUYS ON HERE GIVING THEIR FRIENDS CYCLE ADVICE. EACH AND EVERY PERSON IS A WALKING EXPERIMENT...........BELIEVE THAT. SOME EXPERIMENTS FAIL MISERABLY, OTHERS DO OK, SOME BENEFIT GREATLY AND OTHERS GO INTO AN ABYSS THAT THEY CAN NEVER DRAG THEMSELVES OUT OF. THIS SPORT IS NOT FOR EVERYONE AND IF IT IS NOT FOR YOU AND YOU MISS THE RED FLAGS..........GOD BLESS YOU AND EVERYONE IN YOUR LIFE.

I usually don't agree with what Phil says on this board, but then again I understand why he says it. In this case though, he is absolutely right. Everybody is a walking experiment. Even very experienced guys who know their bodies well, have no idea what the long term physical and mental effects will be. Anybody who disagrees is in denial.

 

[loganb_football]

Steroids do mess with your genetic coding if I remember correctly...

 

[lucian]

ok

if you take 5 mg of oxycotintin for 12 weeks you are addicted. thats not abuse. and your brain will never be te same. same with valuime and even paxil which claimes to not be addictive. so you guys dont think a cycle of tren, winny, decca, dbol or anyof them which re no lnger hormones and are actualy drugs....dont effect all of us???? how? doesn matter abuse or non abuse sooner or later you will all findout theres something wrong. in the past 2 days ive been suicidal, happy then mad, hurt, all of it and im sure its worse cause of gear. as a matter of fact im prettry sure i lost my relationship due to what gear has done to me.....be warned.
lucian

 

[violentmessiah]

yeah, it changes what goes on in your brain

I knew that before I ever used anything.
Stop using anabolics (get sober) and try to get a grip on your life so it goes the direction you want it to.
Know what can affect you.
Know what has affected you.
Find out what you can do about it.
Do what you can.
Don't make excuses about your actions because we all (most anyway) choose our actions even if our brain chemistry is wacky.
Many people have come off things that have altered brain chemistry and have lived "normal" productive lives, those that normally have the most problems never stop using these things.
If you see yourself becoming something you don't like or never planned to be, then you should take a look at yourself and your choices.

If you wanna make a change in your life, you've got to make some changes in your life.
If you wanna make a difference in your life, you've got to do some things different in your life.
------my thoughts on "Dr. Phil"------

 

[massmaker56]

I think that most people know that there is an inherent risk when going into a cycle or when using any kind of PH or drug thats not natural to the human body.

But i wish everyone on here the best of luck in everything we do in this sport a.k.a. lifestyle.

 

[maldorf]

I dont think there has ever been ANY scientific evidence to even suggest that permanent changes are made in the brain. There is data to support that it does affect brain chemisty while it is being administered.