Should we really take anti-es?????

[MR.BICEPS]

Ive got a question I really need answered!!!

Ive never stuck with an anti-es throughout a cycle. Tried a low dose of femara and it shut my sex drive down. I tried nolvadex once and it did not agree with me either.

A local competitor said to never take nolvadex unless you start getting gyno. He also told me to stay away from anti-es because it hurts your gains because of the lack of water retention in the muscles. He suggested anti-es were for competiton or for getting that cut look when going to the beach or a photo shoot.

Well heres my question>>>> WHY TAKE THEM?? Is it because the extra estrogen causes one ot gain bodyfat over a period of time? Or do you guys take them to help keep your blood pressure down?

Looks to me blood pressure wouldnt be a problem if everyone would stick to the dosages of 750mgs of test and 400mgs of EQ or deca like BIG A suggest in his article.

I'm not going to compete an dI have novadex on hand in case gyno would appear so why should I take drugs like femara? No one can give me a good answer to how it would really benefit me!!!

 

[xcelbeyond]

My $0.02 Worth

I'm PRONE to e-related gyno.

Reasons:
1) To prevent gyno if you're prone to e-related gyno
2) To prevent bloat. Certainly retaining water within muscle isn't bad (muscle consists of primarily water!) but it's the water that makes you bloat that's the problem. Besides making you look like the Pillsbury Doughboy it can really increase your heart rate (does big time in me).
3) Anti-aromotase' prevent test from converting to estrogen, while men's breasts are a receptor site, so are the testicles (but they're not enlarged - hahaha). So - in my theory, they should also aid in reducing "raisin syndrome."

Not everyone is gyno prone or bloats from too much estrogen - others are very prone! A concern I have with anti-aromatase' is their effect on your lipid profile - good article here: http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6983

Since it doesn't sound like you're "real prone" (I'm just speculating on this) how about using Proviron for precontest. It's a mild anti-e and helps to make you hard.

 

[mike ross]

xcel hit on the head....if you are prone to gyno and bloating. use them. if not then whats the worry. you should use some post cycle though to help balance the switch in the hormonal balance/environment.

 

[rAJJIN]

I agree

Im the same way as your buddy BigBiceps.
IM one of the lucky ones I guess, Ive taken maybe 2-3 nolvadex in my life
thats it.
Ive always heard the same, Hinders your gains and is just as hard or harder on you then the aas. Plus there a bit expensive hehe Id rather buy more gear.

I have buddies though that just look at some test or Dbol and there nips
get sensative, Its very individual imo...

Good question though, Ive often wondered the same thing....
What other bennefits besides gyno and water retention do Antie serve.

 

[zephyr22]

Yup puffy painful nips...

Yes I too suffer from the puffers. I also have a bit of gyno on my left side and it hurts sometimes. I tried arimidex but it totally threw my cholesterol a curve ball not to be believed. So now i use nolvadex. I get it very cheap. However my BP is much better on anti-e's also due to less fluid on board. My bp has been good since using nolva. I do however still take zestril 20mg QD (QD means everyday,and zestril is an ace inhibitor bp medication) Nolva does seem to hinder gains though as I am down about 10lbs from usaull. I look much harder. You can gauge your fluid loss by weight. 1 pint=pound , 1Kilo=Liter. So i guess its just fluid loss but makes a difference in strength also. Later.

 

[Rogue]

I think Anti-aromatise type products are very important. They help preserve you HPTA function through out the course of the cycle. This is very important after cessation of steroidals, as you don’t have to suffer from complete HPTA shutdown. Also these products keep you healthy... firstly they manage your estrogen level, which is key to staying healthy, as it’s the estrogen that causes all sorts of problems. HPTA shutdown, gyno, prostate cancer etc. the side effect most prevalent from steroids are mainly from elevated estrogens not androgens. The elevated lipid are typically no higher than a person who uses steroids without anti-e. I have never had anyone’s lipid levels skyrocket from anti-e's. On a typical cycle my lipids only go up slightltly whether on AAS or AAS and anti-e's.
The sex drive thing, I’ve never heard of the anti-e's reducing that??? They increase mine drastically!
By the real perk is after the cycle, when on anti-e's my recovery is almost instant and my gains hardly dissipate.
This is my opinion.

 

[mike ross]

everyone is different. a patient of mine had a blood profile done while on arimidex 0.25mg qd and his ldl was over 500 and triglycerides over 900. two weeks before he had the same test done, both were fasting by the way, and his ldl was 186 and triglycerides were 400 something....everyone is different genetically. so for you your way works, for others it doesnt. that statement holds true with all things associated with this sport.

 

[diverz]

Used to run arimidex throughout my cycles. Now I don't and I'm doing 1g testoviron every week. I don't get any bloat or sore nips. And I'm very thankful for it. My take... take it only if you need it.

 

[GetnDiesel]

Ditto That Rogue

I think Anti-aromatise type products are very important. They help preserve you HPTA function through out the course of the cycle. This is very important after cessation of steroidals, as you don’t have to suffer from complete HPTA shutdown. Also these products keep you healthy... firstly they manage your estrogen level, which is key to staying healthy, as it’s the estrogen that causes all sorts of problems. HPTA shutdown, gyno, prostate cancer etc. the side effect most prevalent from steroids are mainly from elevated estrogens not androgens. The elevated lipid are typically no higher than a person who uses steroids without anti-e. I have never had anyone’s lipid levels skyrocket from anti-e's. On a typical cycle my lipids only go up slightltly whether on AAS or AAS and anti-e's.
The sex drive thing, I’ve never heard of the anti-e's reducing that??? They increase mine drastically!
By the real perk is after the cycle, when on anti-e's my recovery is almost instant and my gains hardly dissipate.
This is my opinion.

I use 1/2 to 1 mg arimidex/day while on, and one to two 20mg Nolvadex when off. Just helps me KEEP what I gained. Without the estro I dont gain 20 pounds in one cycle, but I keep a lot more of what I gain instead of gaining 20 and losing 19 later.

 

[BigBoyJ]

Yep, I use nolva all the time. It keeps me tighter, leaner, harder, hpta revovery is quicker and I can be more leniant on my diet.

 

[Paul Bunyan]

My thoughts are to use them sparingly. Always have some onhand for an emergency. Some people end up causing more damage by being overly cautious. I use 1 tab of femara once per week and I always have nolva around. Haven't had any problems with my bloodwork.

PB

 

[FRKNHUGE]

i use 20mg nolva ED regardless on or off
i use aromasin also during cycle if i get sore nippies, lol
i believe my body produces too much estro as is, since i had natural gyno REAL bad at a young age, so i take it along with my multi ED. lol
frk

 

[BigBoyJ]

i use 20mg nolva ED regardless on or off
i use aromasin also during cycle if i get sore nippies, lol
i believe my body produces too much estro as is, since i had natural gyno REAL bad at a young age, so i take it along with my multi ED. lol
frk

You use nolva everyday? This proves it, nolva hinders growth. Maybe you should quit using it and try to bust past that puny 340 lb mark.

Obviously it's hindered your strength gains too.

 

[FRKNHUGE]

hahaha yessssir
maybe if i hadnt used it, lol, i might be a 700+ bencher or possibly be at the 375lb mark, lol
oh god, good one man lol
frk

 

[MR.BICEPS]

I think Anti-aromatise type products are very important. They help preserve you HPTA function through out the course of the cycle. This is very important after cessation of steroidals, as you don’t have to suffer from complete HPTA shutdown. Also these products keep you healthy... firstly they manage your estrogen level, which is key to staying healthy, as it’s the estrogen that causes all sorts of problems. HPTA shutdown, gyno, prostate cancer etc. the side effect most prevalent from steroids are mainly from elevated estrogens not androgens. The elevated lipid are typically no higher than a person who uses steroids without anti-e. I have never had anyone’s lipid levels skyrocket from anti-e's. On a typical cycle my lipids only go up slightltly whether on AAS or AAS and anti-e's.
The sex drive thing, I’ve never heard of the anti-e's reducing that??? They increase mine drastically!
By the real perk is after the cycle, when on anti-e's my recovery is almost instant and my gains hardly dissipate.
This is my opinion.

It sounds like your body produces a lot of estrogen if your sex drive increases with anti-es . Letro-femara kills a lot of peoples sex drive unless you take just a little bit of the powerful drug...

 

[Rogue]

I use 1 tab EOD. Last time I had been clean for 10 weeks, my test was at 860 and my estrones well in range.I think at this dosage, the body regulates the HPTA minimaly and the addition of the exogeneous androgens and the naturally occuring one makes for an good sex drive.Now, I also have an elevated libido when I dont take anti-e's and maintain my cycle.

 

[MikeS]

If you need them-use them. But its true that it does protect HPTA function-especially clomid. It is great at bolcking the estrogen receptors in the Hypothalamus. That is the main cause of HPTA shutdown in drugs that convert to estrogen-not the extra test in the body (which does have some effect).
My theory has always been there is a fine line between not enough and too much. Walk that line!

I use .25mg arimidex 2x wk, plus clomid 3x wk.