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Study RE: RHR on Gh

I would look into Mannitol. Mannitol is known to affect cardiac function. I guess the starting place to go down that path would be to find out if prescription GH contains mannitol in it like the chinese generics does?
Norditropin contains Mannitol and was used in the study where HR barely fluctuated;

“Non-medicinal ingredients: histidine, mannitol, phenol, poloxamer 188 and ... Do not use Norditropin® which has been frozen or exposed to excessive temperatures.” (Novo Nordisk Canada https://www.novonordisk.ca/content/dam/nncorp/ca/en/products/norditropin-consumer-information.pdf)
 
I’ve been searching for days as to why some Gh increases RHR. My findings are inconclusive, however, I found this study showing that pharma Gh does not increase RHR. 9iu/day increases RHR by 1 bpm. 18iu/day increased RHR by 5 bpm.


1.5 weeks ago I started some GH from a well known supplier who I love. At 3.33 iu/day, my RHR increased from 55-60 bpm to 88 beats per minute. On one hand, normal heart rate is 60-100 bpm, so I’m within range. On the other hand, a 50% increase in Resting Heart Rate overnight can’t be healthy. Needless to say, I’m stopping the Gh. It’s unfortunate because my muscles were already fuller, skin was tightening, sleep was increased by roughly 20%.

As mentioned, I’ve been searching for days but can’t find any conclusive evidence as to why some gh does this. Does anyone have any idea why?
In this study alone it’s contributed to cardiac remodeling and a 10% increase in the left ventricular wall thickness.

While that may not seem like much, a 10% change in the heart is one the body will absolutely have to adjust to.

One could argue that ARB’s and Nebilivol could be used to combat this change, but none the less will be a physiological change that will be felt by most.

Apologies as I responded earlier before reading the actual study. 😊 Rookie mistake.
 
In this study alone it’s contributed to cardiac remodeling and a 10% increase in the left ventricular wall thickness.

While that may not seem like much, a 10% change in the heart is one the body will absolutely have to adjust to.

One could argue that ARB’s and Nebilivol could be used to combat this change, but none the less will be a physiological change that will be felt by most.

Apologies as I responded earlier before reading the actual study. 😊 Rookie mistake.
It is true that the main basis evaluated the cardiac remodeling, however, they measured heart rate.

“The subjects were assigned to treatment with placebo or 0.03 or 0.06 mg/kg·d of recombinant GH”

If I’m 100kg, that = 3mg or 9iu or 6mg or 18iu.

While yes, there was cardiac remodeling, heart rate barely increased;

Placebo n = 25Low GH n = 17High GH n = 18
Age (yr)23 ± 0.524 ± 0.724 ± 0.4
Body mass indexBaseline22 ± 123 ± 123 ± 1
Body mass index4 wk22 ± 123 ± 123 ± 1
Heart rateBaseline (bpm)67 ± 263 ± 267 ± 2
Heart rate4 wk (bpm)68 ± 164 ± 272 ± 2

The chart is slightly off on the copy, but 9iu raised rhr by 1 beat per minute and 18iu raised rhr by 5 beats per minute.

*Side note, very interesting that igf elevation was not linear (9iu yielded a 608igf or roughly doubled the baseline, and 18iu yielded a 768igf)

IGF-IBaseline (μg/liter)301 ± 17363 ± 40325 ± 22
IGF-I4 wk (μg/liter)312 ± 16608 ± 71a,b768 ±
 
It is true that the main basis evaluated the cardiac remodeling, however, they measured heart rate.

“The subjects were assigned to treatment with placebo or 0.03 or 0.06 mg/kg·d of recombinant GH”

If I’m 100kg, that = 3mg or 9iu or 6mg or 18iu.

While yes, there was cardiac remodeling, heart rate barely increased;

Placebo n = 25Low GH n = 17High GH n = 18
Age (yr)23 ± 0.524 ± 0.724 ± 0.4
Body mass indexBaseline22 ± 123 ± 123 ± 1
Body mass index4 wk22 ± 123 ± 123 ± 1
Heart rateBaseline (bpm)67 ± 263 ± 267 ± 2
Heart rate4 wk (bpm)68 ± 164 ± 272 ± 2

The chart is slightly off on the copy, but 9iu raised rhr by 1 beat per minute and 18iu raised rhr by 5 beats per minute.

*Side note, very interesting that igf elevation was not linear (9iu yielded a 608igf or roughly doubled the baseline, and 18iu yielded a 768igf)

IGF-IBaseline (μg/liter)301 ± 17363 ± 40325 ± 22
IGF-I4 wk (μg/liter)312 ± 16608 ± 71a,b768 ±
Interesting. Keep in mind as well that this was only a 4 week study if recall correctly. I don’t know anyone who has much benefit or who only does 4 week cycles of HGH. 😂

Show me someone’s vitals after 3-6 months of usage with cardiac remodeling. That would be of more interest to me. 🤔
 
Interesting. Keep in mind as well that this was only a 4 week study if recall correctly. I don’t know anyone who has much benefit or who only does 4 week cycles of HGH. 😂

Show me someone’s vitals after 3-6 months of usage with cardiac remodeling. That would be of more interest to me. 🤔
I’d like to see it after 3-6 years…. Let’s not fool ourselves, anybody who’s honest with themselves knows that super physiological doses GH, AAS, etc isn’t healthy. I’ve made my peace with it.
 
I’d like to see it after 3-6 years…. Let’s not fool ourselves, anybody who’s honest with themselves knows that super physiological doses GH, AAS, etc isn’t healthy. I’ve made my peace with it.
Agreed. And as much as everyone likes to think an ARB and some Nebilivol is going to erase any of those outcomes is honestly kidding themselves.

I’m sure nobody will like or agree with that statement, buts it’s reality and we all make our choices. 🤷‍♂️
 
The amount of diuretic one would receive even if on 10iu+ take half a water pill of your choice, and see if your RHR is reduced.
 
I don't know why people are so fixated by thinking water retention is the mechanism for the RHR increase of HGH. Millions of things cause water retention without raising heart rate.
 
very interested in this thread… I’m older (late 50s) and ran Jintropin last year at 2iu/day and saw significant rhr increase and pretty brutal bp increase… going to running some popular generics soon…
 
very interested in this thread… I’m older (late 50s) and ran Jintropin last year at 2iu/day and saw significant rhr increase and pretty brutal bp increase… going to running some popular generics soon…
Interesting. How is your cardio and by any chance did you add any supplements at the same time?
 
Interesting. How is your cardio and by any chance did you add any supplements at the same time?
pretty good cardio, saw here on this message board that adding two or 3 g of vitamin C can help with the water retention but not sure that helped… started 2.5 of neb later on but fatigue was pretty bad and heart rate dropped may be a little too much… if you have any other ideas for supplements please let me know… I had added a bit of amlodipine for blood pressure and that helped a bit
 
very interested in this thread… I’m older (late 50s) and ran Jintropin last year at 2iu/day and saw significant rhr increase and pretty brutal bp increase… going to running some popular generics soon…
So glad you shared this. I was considering Jintropin as a replacement for the generics spiking my heart but not now. I will be sticking with Norditropin, Genotropin, Omnitrope moving forward, all of which do not give me this scary side effect.
 
So glad you shared this. I was considering Jintropin as a replacement for the generics spiking my heart but not now. I will be sticking with Norditropin, Genotropin, Omnitrope moving forward, all of which do not give me this scary side effect.
Do share....where ya getting pharma?
 

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