t-3 for Dad

[Nat]

Just wanted some of your thoughts about any complications that would
come from t-3 usage for a 55 year old overweight man.

He was around 350 and has been exercising and dieting hard for about 2 months with someone else and has lost roughly ten pounds. He finally let go of his pride and asked his son who is an expert (me) on the subject. I have already put together a pretty solid program for him but thought his thyroid may not be producing as it should. Again he is 5'10 about 350 lbs and cant loose any weight.

I am thinking about getting him on 30mcg of t-3 to see if this would help out his weight loss. Keeping high levels of quality proteins to preserve muscle.

Again I am just asking for any problems or complications that some of you experts may feel to watch for.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Well

Just wanted some of your thoughts about any complications that would
come from t-3 usage for a 55 year old overweight man.

He was around 350 and has been exercising and dieting hard for about 2 months and has lost roughly ten pounds. He finally let go of his pride and asked his son who is an expert (me) on the subject. I have already put together a pretty solid program for him but thought his thyroid may not be producing as it should. Again he is 5'10 about 350 lbs and cant loose any weight.

I am thinking about getting him on 30mcg of t-3 to see if this would help out his weight loss. Keeping high levels of quality proteins to preserve muscle.

Again I am just asking for any problems or complications that some of you experts may feel to watch for.

Did you give him a blood test? You just are going to put him on t-3 to see if it would help, 30mcg? You are giving him quality protein? You already put together a solid program? He is 350 and cant lose any weight? You are looking for what complications we may feel to look out for? I am just clarifying what I think I am reading here..............before I respond

 

[Big Bapper]

I would get you Dad some medical advice from a qualified MD before self prescribing any drug, as Phil said a little blood work would go a long way to finding out what the problem is. It could be a number of things.

 

[madetolift]

Hey I understand that and first I would go to a Dr and get his Test levels done up. The national average for men in the US has dropped 20% over the last 20 years and most men around his age suffer from a test deficiency... or at the low end of the scale. So me may be able to get a prescription to help him out and have him ask if he is at the low end to get it boosted up to the upper end of the scale and not the bottom end. If the Dr gives push back get another Dr.
When one is that large development of more muscle will burn off more of what he eats and get him to where he wants to go. of course he will have to develop and start lifting first and do cardio separate but I know you know all that. he will want results really fast but make sure remind him it is a process. I am in teh computer industry and have help a lot of my fellow workers out like you are doing.
So in essence from my worded response do it and do it right and you should be proud that you are there to help your dad.

 

[Skip]

Did you give him a blood test? You just are going to put him on t-3 to see if it would help, 30mcg? You are giving him quality protein? You already put together a solid program? He is 350 and cant lose any weight? You are looking for what complications we may feel to look out for? I am just clarifying what I think I am reading here..............before I respond

You beat me to the punch. I am getting slow in my old age.

I will go ahead and not wait because not only am I getting slow but I am also impatient. : )

Being 350 pounds the first priority is getting his weight down, period. Quality protein is a good idea but holding muscle shouldn't be a priority - getting the weight off should. If you are, in fact, an expert I don't understand what the issue is and why he isn't dropping any bodyweight at 350 pounds and having only trained and dieted for 2 months. If he lost only 10 pounds in 2 months I would questions your "expert" credentials. ; )

Do the blood test to determine his thyroid function. It is UNLIKELY that it is a thyroid issue but at least you will know for sure.

Skip

 

[Nat]

Thanks for the reponse guys! I have developed a complete new exercise and diet program for him. Granted the diet and exercise program he has been on for the last two months was not bad. After looking at his diet and training plan from the last 2 months I felt he should have lost alot more weight than he did. So my conclusion was that he might have a problem with his thyroid due to our family history.

I have also talked to his Doctor about the possibiltiy of cytomel but he seemed a bit confused in that department. He is looking into it but you know how Doctors can be. He did have his blood work done but they could not specify his t-3 and t-4 counts. All other blood work came in fine. Low cholesterol, he had a bit of a high blood pressure but that has been corrected. I am sending him back for another blood test to check his thyroid levels and to check for any thyroid hyper function.

I feel that short-term intake of Cytomel in a reasonable dosage is certainly "healthier" than any extreme hunger diet. I have personally taken cytomel without any complications with great results. Many of my clients have done extremeley well, yet most of them are bodybuilders, not overweight older men.

My question about any complications of the drug surround the paranoia of the drug. The paranoia that exists around the the permanant shut done of your thyroid or developing a chronic thyroid insufficiency. As a consequence, the person might be forced to take thyroid medication for the rest of his life. I have heard so many different thoughts about this but was hoping you guys could pass down your experience or thoughts. Again I am not willing to just take my own personal experience with the drug when it comes to pops (or anyone else for that matter).

 

[vadim_b1]

Rebound is a much more important issue here
If his diet is not up to par, and youre looking for an easy way out with cytomel, sure he will lose weight, but he will gain it all back again + some extra once he is off.
Dont look at T3 as a crutch, but rather as an enhancement to an already successful diet plan.

 

[inoverdrive]

I dont understand why they had a hard time checking his thyroid levels. Id go to another doctor. You dont want to experiment on someone 55 yrs old especially your own Dad.

 

[Nat]

You beat me to the punch. I am getting slow in my old age.

I will go ahead and not wait because not only am I getting slow but I am also impatient. : )

Being 350 pounds the first priority is getting his weight down, period. Quality protein is a good idea but holding muscle shouldn't be a priority - getting the weight off should. If you are, in fact, an expert I don't understand what the issue is and why he isn't dropping any bodyweight at 350 pounds and having only trained and dieted for 2 months. If he lost only 10 pounds in 2 months I would questions your "expert" credentials. ; )

Do the blood test to determine his thyroid function. It is UNLIKELY that it is a thyroid issue but at least you will know for sure.

Skip

Hey Skip,

I respect your opinions greatly, you are well respected! But I havent been training him for 2 months if you reread the post again. He was training with another trainer because of his pride and then he finally ask his son for help. Anyway when he asked me I simply thought that it may be a thyroid problem because it has ran in the family. I have consulted with the physician once but he hasnt got back to me. We are sending him back for blood test to check his thyroid levels.

 

[Fa Seeshus]

he should also get fasting blood glucose done to rule out diabetes

one of the prime contributors to metabolic syndrome X is insulin sensitivity issues.

 

[dragonfire101]

he should also get fasting blood glucose done to rule out diabetes

one of the prime contributors to metabolic syndrome X is insulin sensitivity issues.

Right on with the glucose testing.

Also is he on any meds that can be contributing to weight gain, have sleep apnea that may be contributing factors.

From what I have seen with the majority of overweight/obese persons most of them have all 3 of these issues that just keep them in a never ending circle of weight gain and other health issues until they can all be addressed.

insulin sensitivity
endocrine issue, thyroid, hypogonadism, etc.
sleep apnea

 

[KillerStack]

My question about any complications of the drug surround the paranoia of the drug. The paranoia that exists around the the permanant shut done of your thyroid or developing a chronic thyroid insufficiency. As a consequence, the person might be forced to take thyroid medication for the rest of his life. I have heard so many different thoughts about this but was hoping you guys could pass down your experience or thoughts. Again I am not willing to just take my own personal experience with the drug when it comes to pops (or anyone else for that matter).

Personally I would be more concerned with the cardio effects it could have, the increase in heart rate for example, especially with him being so heavy. Some studies on thyroid for weight loss have said a big cause of increase in metabolic rate from thyroid hormone supplementation is due to increase in oxygen consumption by the heart. The heart "consumes" a lot of calories.

 

[Nat]

he should also get fasting blood glucose done to rule out diabetes

one of the prime contributors to metabolic syndrome X is insulin sensitivity issues.

Great point! Much appreciated!

 

[Nat]

Right on with the glucose testing.

Also is he on any meds that can be contributing to weight gain, have sleep apnea that may be contributing factors.

From what I have seen with the majority of overweight/obese persons most of them have all 3 of these issues that just keep them in a never ending circle of weight gain and other health issues until they can all be addressed.

insulin sensitivity
endocrine issue, thyroid, hypogonadism, etc.
sleep apnea

Thanks so much for this post Dragon! I think you may have hit the nail right on the head with that post. He actually has two of the three you mentioned with a possible third being insulin sensitivity. Any info or links on some information pertaining to the above would be greatly appreciated. I suppose I will need to correct or address all three of those problem areas (with the help of a MD). I am not sure about the meds and problems surrounding the sleep apnea but I will do some home work. As far as his insulin sensitivity I can get him on some metformin to help his insulin sensitivity. And depending on his t-3and t-4 counts it will depend on whether he take t-3/or t/4. Thanks again for the post it is exactly what I was looking for! It has at least pointed me in a better direction for researching to help pops!

 

[Skip]

Hey Skip,

I respect your opinions greatly, you are well respected! But I havent been training him for 2 months if you reread the post again. He was training with another trainer because of his pride and then he finally ask his son for help. Anyway when he asked me I simply thought that it may be a thyroid problem because it has ran in the family. I have consulted with the physician once but he hasnt got back to me. We are sending him back for blood test to check his thyroid levels.

I also missed the part about it running in the family. Had I caught that it would have made more sense to me.

I can hear Phidias running as fast as he can but here is MY experience with t3 use with myself and my clients and understand that I am neither advocating or condoning t3 use but simply conveying MY experiences:

I have been in bodybuilding for 24 years, competing since 1990, training people for .... I don't even know how many years and doing contest prep for about 10 years, give or take. I train a LOT of clients every year - more than most, I am pretty sure. I have not ONCE seen t3 use cause a thyroid to shut down. On a few occasions I have seen a very lethargic thyroid having trouble recovering where the person is very sluggish, tired, etc, for a month or so. However, this is rare considering this has probably happened only 3 or 4 times with hundreds of clients. I can think of one of these clients that was taking 200mcg per day of t3. Now, I did NOT advise this but this came out when we were trying to figure out why they were so sluggish for the month after coming off t3. This is an absolutely absurd level of t3. No one should ever take a dose this high.

I would also say that I have dealt long term t3 use as long as 8 months and the same thing holds true: thyroid function is normal within weeks or a month after coming off. Normal dosing patterns would be doses like 25mcg, 50mcg, 75mcg but I don't agree with going higher than 100mcg. That should be the ceiling and kept lower, if possible. At 50mcg or even 75mcg I have seen the drug run for MONTHS without any issues in both women and men.

Again, I am not saying that someone can't have problems. I am simply saying that I have not once seen an issue, ever, where thyroid problems occurred from using or abusing t3. Just MY experience.

Skip

 

[Nat]

I also missed the part about it running in the family. Had I caught that it would have made more sense to me.

I can hear Phidias running as fast as he can but here is MY experience with t3 use with myself and my clients and understand that I am neither advocating or condoning t3 use but simply conveying MY experiences:

I have been in bodybuilding for 24 years, competing since 1990, training people for .... I don't even know how many years and doing contest prep for about 10 years, give or take. I train a LOT of clients every year - more than most, I am pretty sure. I have not ONCE seen t3 use cause a thyroid to shut down. On a few occasions I have seen a very lethargic thyroid having trouble recovering where the person is very sluggish, tired, etc, for a month or so. However, this is rare considering this has probably happened only 3 or 4 times with hundreds of clients. I can think of one of these clients that was taking 200mcg per day of t3. Now, I did NOT advise this but this came out when we were trying to figure out why they were so sluggish for the month after coming off t3. This is an absolutely absurd level of t3. No one should ever take a dose this high.

I would also say that I have dealt long term t3 use as long as 8 months and the same thing holds true: thyroid function is normal within weeks or a month after coming off. Normal dosing patterns would be doses like 25mcg, 50mcg, 75mcg but I don't agree with going higher than 100mcg. That should be the ceiling and kept lower, if possible. At 50mcg or even 75mcg I have seen the drug run for MONTHS without any issues in both women and men.

Again, I am not saying that someone can't have problems. I am simply saying that I have not once seen an issue, ever, where thyroid problems occurred from using or abusing t3. Just MY experience.

Skip

Greatly appreciated Skip! This has been my own experience as well with myself and my clients. But I am always learning and very cautious when it comes to areas I may be uncertain of (older overweight men). But it really helps to get that confirmed by someone such as yourself.