Adderall and training

[swim15]

This is the first I've heard about ADD preventing amphetamine withdrawal. It didn't work that way for me or any of my friends after years of daily use.

I wouldn't say it prevents it necessarily but it functions differently in the people who 'need' it vs the ones who don't.

I'm working on my doctorate now and have plenty of friends pounding it and personally never known anyone to become addicted but everyone is different. Actually thought it was going to be hard to drop it but ended up not being a big deal at all and felt really good afterwards. Now I take it more sporadically when needed due to workload.

 

[finxster]

Not sure if the negative people tried it recreationally, or what, but it is a life savor for me.

Doc prescribed...20mg IR in the morning, 10-20mg IR half way through the day. I'm much more outgoing and personable with it, can concentrate and multitask/switch between projects better, and hammer out 12-13 hour days all week. I do 5 days on/2 off with no problems.

I've cut from 250s to 220 while using it and dropped to low TRT doses, so my BP and all are better. Have more energy and endurance, but that could be attributed to several things.

 

[Stewie]

Personally I wouldn't touch Adderall.

This is a partial post I made awhile back. Subjectively it's dose and duration dependent, obviously.


http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...le-forum/132571-adding-dhea-when-aas-trt.html

A topic that's rarely discussed or most don't realize. There's data indicating amphetamines can cause myelin sheath degradation, inhibit dopamine release from D2 autoreceptors, neurotoxicity from over-stimuli of dopaminergic neurons that could possibly autooxidize too a nasty byproduct (metabolite), 6-hydroxydopamine. Thus, ultimately leading to dysfunction of the BBB (blood brain barrier), potentially setting the stage for pathogen(s) to breach the BBB. This all extends beyond dopaminergic and serotonergic terminal dysfunction people obsess over.

If you're not familiar with what autoreceptors, axonal/myelin sheathing or the blood brain barrier is. I encourage you to read-up on these, which are very important conduction action potentials related to neurotransmission.

 

[thestudent333]

I was prescribed 30mg IR tablet twice daily for years but feel better now that I’m off of it. However it did help with focus in school and while getting licensed for financial industry exams. Being an amphetamine it can’t be good long term for health.

 

[Designbuilt]

Adderall and coke behave almost identical in the brain, but comparing them is apples and oranges. I know because I have tried to use coke in place of adderall. While it does speed one up, coke is useless for ADD. It exacerbates the inattention. And makes people very spontaneous. Does the opposite of what adderall does.

:yeahthat:

Exactly, trust me, I am an expert on coke, I've quit that habit for some time now, but I knew everything there was to know about it and coke and Adderall are NOTHING alike... Not even remotely similar, in fact, they are pretty much opposite... Coke, gave me a euphoric feeling, then speedy, then depending on purity, either anxiety, nervousness, or craving for more and I've tried it in 7 different countries, so I know what I'm talking about... Ritalin has a similar effect on me, so I went right back to the doctor after one week on it and had him switch me to Adderall immediate release, 20mg am, 10mg at noon... But i'm not reckless with this by any means, I had all of my blood work done, this is the lowest my blood pressure has been in ages, it's still high but it's the lowest it's been... I get my blood work next week and I have another appointment with both my behaviorist and doctor on the 28th... Trust me, this isn't recreational, I've been told by too many people and I tried a few that a friend gave me a few months ago, they worked very well, people commented on how calm and happy I was... Especially my ex-wife, my girlfriend and the partners at work...

I told the senior partner that I was taking Adderall, he told me that he really wanted to tell me something about that because of my work patterns; but he didn't want to upset me. (I work for one of the top architectural and engineering firms in the country) My main concern, or question rather, was if it caused any muscle loss, or if it negates the effects of any gear, because I know that some meds do; also because I read something to that effect, but I believe that the weight and muscle loss is caused by the addiction to amphetamines and resulting side effects of the loss of appetite...

As far as training, I train first thing in the morning, so maybe I can hold off on my morning dose until after I train, so that was a good call, thanks guys...

 

[KillerStack]

A friend of mine was on Vyvanse for years. He decided
to drop it because he didn't want to be dependent on any drug. Now a year later he's dropped almost 120lbs. Said the drug "made him" play a lot of video games while snacking. Now he can't sit still and is a lot more physically active

 

[Designbuilt]

This is a partial post I made awhile back. Subjectively it's dose and duration dependent, obviously.


http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...le-forum/132571-adding-dhea-when-aas-trt.html

Interesting, I'm going to look it over, thanks!

 

[m314]

I wouldn't say it prevents it necessarily but it functions differently in the people who 'need' it vs the ones who don't.

I'm working on my doctorate now and have plenty of friends pounding it and personally never known anyone to become addicted but everyone is different. Actually thought it was going to be hard to drop it but ended up not being a big deal at all and felt really good afterwards. Now I take it more sporadically when needed due to workload.

Stimulant use is common in the software industry, especially in Silicon Valley. At least half of my team now is on either adderall / dexedrine or ritalin. I knew a guy at a previous job who actually had a script for desoxyn (methamphetamine).

I don't talk about it with people I don't know on a personal level, but the changes in speech patterns and shaky hands make hardcore stimulant use obvious. It's also obvious when people have energy in the 8 am meetings through the 10 pm meetings, day after day after day.

I've never known someone to have an easy time coming off after a few years. The physical dependence gets to everyone I've known who take these stims for years. I know a couple guys now who've been on adderall for over a decade and can't quit despite multiple attempts. I never had that degree of "addiction" where I couldn't quit. I just needed a week to get through the physical part after several years of daily use.

Getting back to the workout question, amphetamine sucks as a performance enhancer. The difference in workouts is like night and day for me having quit and gotten back on a few times. Ephedrine is far superior as a stimulant for exercise performance. Adderall works well as an appetite suppressant for cutting, but it's not worth it. The appetite rebound coming off is worse than any other stim I've tried. It's not worth it at all for me personally.

 

[Broseph11]

Prescribed 20mg Ritalin ir 3 times a day for about 3 months and I’m not sure i, personally can train with this in my system. It helps me during normal life shit, I work at night and have major concentration issues, but after 3 doses sometimes 4 if I’m being irresponsible I will skip the gym in the morning. I get all cranked out, It does have its europhic effects but they disapaite quickly. I’d rather train on 80-120mcg of clen than Ritalin. Cant speak about Adderall because I’ve never used it but this stuff is legit addictive. Be careful fellas.

Would love to here some more opinions!!!

 

[ericraven2003]

I take Vyvanse 3 days a week adderall 2 days. Then my non work days nothing. i have not built up any tolerance, and have really no sides.

 

[Designbuilt]

I take Vyvanse 3 days a week adderall 2 days. Then my non work days nothing. i have not built up any tolerance, and have really no sides.

I heard of Vyvanse, the senior company at my company told me about it... So I told my ex-wife that the problem with this stuff is that the body develops a tolerance to it rather quickly and it would lose it's effects rather quickly... Then she said "oh no, does that mean you're going to turn into an asshole again?"

I think I might like the XR more... These seem a little bit too much like a drug, they are blue football shaped tabs (and are way harder to get btw, I had to go to four pharmacies before I found one that carried it) Two walgreens, a CVS, Walmart and eventually back to Walgreens... The XR is more readily available... The thing is that I tried a few XR that my friend gave me and I get a nice uplifting feeling after about 1/2 an hour and it lasts the whole day and at night I sleep well, which is another benefit, my sleep patterns used to be shit...

On this immediate release, I get a big hit right away, then I feel like taking more, plus they are sweet like candy... I have the fight off the urge to take more, so most likely I'll have him switch me to the XR on my next visit in 10 days... I do truly feel that this medication has improved my life a lot, I no longer have mood swings... I used to get them so bad, that a few people have told me that they thought I was schizophrenic... There are times that I've completely forgotten what I've done, I thought it was the drinking, but perhaps the drinking triggers it... I seem to have more balance now and I feel a nice, healthy euphoria, not a chemical one... Also my diet is right on the money, I haven't eaten anything unhealthy in the past few weeks now; if I can just keep this dose working for me...

Taking weekends off might be tough, because that's actually when I work most... During my week, I do various things, meet with clients, the city, I go to city council or zoning board one a month, hearings on violations for clients twice per week... So I mostly do design and drafting work in the evenings and weekends...

Sundays especially, hell I'm up now working at 6:00am on a Saturday... Perhaps, using the vyvnase on weekends is a good call... I also found that kre-alkalyn with caffeine works very well too, believe it or not, I take one or two of those with coffee and it feels very similar to Adderall...

 

[brownbanana]

Let's take a look at some of these meds. Here Dextroamphetamine. These are still prescribe. These are also the ones called "go-pills" that military pilots use.

Dextroamphetamine:
The amphetamine molecule exists as two enantiomers (in other words, two different molecules that are mirror images of one another), levoamphetamine and dextroamphetamine. Dextroamphetamine is the more active, dextrorotatory, or 'right-handed', enantiomer of the amphetamine molecule.

Adderall:

Adderall (combination of)4))
amphetamine aspartate monohydrate
25% – stimulant
(12.5% levo; 12.5% dextro)
amphetamine sulfate
25% – stimulant
(12.5% levo; 12.5% dextro)
dextroamphetamine saccharate
25% – stimulant
(0% levo; 25% dextro)
dextroamphetamine sulfate
25% – stimulant
(0% levo; 25% dextro)

As you can see, the levels of levoamphetamine and dextroamphetamine within each.

Lisdexamfetamine (Vyvanse):
Its chemical structure consists of dextroamphetamine coupled with the essential amino acid L-lysine. Lisdexamfetamine itself is inactive prior to its absorption and the subsequent rate-limited enzymatic cleavage of the molecule's L-lysine portion, which produces the active metabolite (dextroamphetamine).

From my understanding, they created Vyvanse because it can't be easily abused like addy or dextro. The reason it is still so expensive and hard to find isn't because of its properties per se. Rather, it can't be made in generic form yet.

You sound like you are already getting addicted. That's okay. I am the same way. It's neither bad or good. It's actually good and bad at the same time. But you have to be aware. If we know ourselves and take actions that limit our freedom. Then that is how we master ourself. I used to tell my ex's, "I will never cheat on you, but I will smoke up all your weed". Personal note aside. You may want to consider Vyvanse.

Out of all three of those. Adderall feels the best. I dont mean the most effective. I mean "feel". That is different from what works the best. And I didn't just try the others a few times. I would get months worth from people.

If you can't get those, XR also minimizes that "feel" good feeling. And I prefer those these days because it is released more steadily into the blood stream.

Point being, What "feels" the best and what "works" the best are not equivalent. They aren't the same.

 

[Thebigone]

Vyvanse should not be marketed as time released. All it is is a Dose of dextroamphetamine that’s takes maybe 30 minutes longer than regular dextroamphetamine to kick in when the lysine Cleves off. It’s nothing more than dextroamphetamine which for many people can wear off in two or three hours especially if you are dependent on it. A true extended release formula delivers half upfront and the other half around three or four hours later.

 

[Designbuilt]

Let's take a look at some of these meds. Here Dextroamphetamine. These are still prescribe. These are also the ones called "go-pills" that military pilots use.And

Dextroamphetamine:
The amphetamine molecule exists as two enantiomers (in other words, two different molecules that are mirror images of one another), levoamphetamine and dextroamphetamine. Dextroamphetamine is the more active, dextrorotatory, or 'right-handed', enantiomer of the amphetamine molecule.

Adderall:

Adderall (combination of)4))
amphetamine aspartate monohydrate
25% – stimulant
(12.5% levo; 12.5% dextro)
amphetamine sulfate
25% – stimulant
(12.5% levo; 12.5% dextro)
dextroamphetamine saccharate
25% – stimulant
(0% levo; 25% dextro)
dextroamphetamine sulfate
25% – stimulant
(0% levo; 25% dextro)

As you can see, the levels of levoamphetamine and dextroamphetamine within each.

Lisdexamfetamine (Vyvanse):
Its chemical structure consists of dextroamphetamine coupled with the essential amino acid L-lysine. Lisdexamfetamine itself is inactive prior to its absorption and the subsequent rate-limited enzymatic cleavage of the molecule's L-lysine portion, which produces the active metabolite (dextroamphetamine).

From my understanding, they created Vyvanse because it can't be easily abused like addy or dextro. The reason it is still so expensive and hard to find isn't because of its properties per se. Rather, it can't be made in generic form yet.

You sound like you are already getting addicted. That's okay. I am the same way. It's neither bad or good. It's actually good and bad at the same time. But you have to be aware. If we know ourselves and take actions that limit our freedom. Then that is how we master ourself. I used to tell my ex's, "I will never cheat on you, but I will smoke up all your weed". Personal note aside. You may want to consider Vyvanse.

Out of all three of those. Adderall feels the best. I dont mean the most effective. I mean "feel". That is different from what works the best. And I didn't just try the others a few times. I would get months worth from people.

If you can't get those, XR also minimizes that "feel" good feeling. And I prefer those these days because it is released more steadily into the blood stream.

Point being, What "feels" the best and what "works" the best are not equivalent. They aren't the same.

I think that the DR feels the best to me... the IR hits a lot faster, especially since I've been getting in the habit if chewing them, but they wear off quicker and sometimes I find myself wanting to take more... Or looking forward to waking up to take them, the capsules, or the XR, don't hit me as fast, but they last a lot longer in my system and I don't crave them.. I can switch to those if I prefer... but have a few capsules that in going to try on Monday (2-20mg) total, what I definitely don't want is the mood swings and the IR seem as if they will start causing that as I develop a tolerance... the initial hit is a little too euphoric, in looking for balance and focus... thanks for the great info Brown and everyone else.

 

[maldorf]

It surprises me how so many people want to solve their problems (sometimes they are not even problems) with any kind of drugs.

Those drugs never solve long-term problems, but you can get some benefits from stimulants if you use them wisely and discontinued. But doing this is not easy, and the best use is not to make use of it.

Well, the population of bodybuilders on here should for the most part not object to using drugs because we use so many in bodybuilding. I don't really see the difference between the two.

 

[brownbanana]

I think that the DR feels the best to me... the IR hits a lot faster, especially since I've been getting in the habit if chewing them, but they wear off quicker and sometimes I find myself wanting to take more... Or looking forward to waking up to take them, the capsules, or the XR, don't hit me as fast, but they last a lot longer in my system and I don't crave them.. I can switch to those if I prefer... but have a few capsules that in going to try on Monday (2-20mg) total, what I definitely don't want is the mood swings and the IR seem as if they will start causing that as I develop a tolerance... the initial hit is a little too euphoric, in looking for balance and focus... thanks for the great info Brown and everyone else.

Addy will do that. But it is unusually you playing tricks on yourself. I don't think the tolerance builds as quickly as many think. You get use to it but you are really getting use to being on addy. If that makes sense. Your "baseline" changes to being on adderall. And you start to seek that initial jump. That is, when you went from an adderall free baseline and then taking adderall. But we don't usually see that. Instead we start to rationalize.

This will allow you to get more out of a lower dose: https://www.livestrong.com/article/494957-adderall-and-calcium/ and another source https://www.drugs.com/drug-interactions/adderall-with-tums-dual-action-190-1645-467-14458.html

calcium carbonate ↔ amphetamine
Applies to:Tums Dual Action (calcium carbonate/famotidine/magnesium hydroxide) and Adderall (amphetamine/dextroamphetamine)

Ask your doctor before using calcium carbonate together with amphetamine. Using these medications together can increase the absorption of amphetamine and may increase its effects. This can cause restlessness, tremor, rapid breathing, confusion, panic, aggressiveness, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, an irregular heartbeat, and seizures. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. Do not stop using any medications without first talking to your doctor.

Keep availability limited. We have freedom by choosing to limit our freedom. If you have access you more - you will take more.

Habits build with practice (try to stop chewing them).

 

[MouthBreather1982]

I take Vyvanse 3 days a week adderall 2 days. Then my non work days nothing. i have not built up any tolerance, and have really no sides.

Why do you switch back and fourth out of curiosity? I have taken both, thou its been a while since I've tried vyvanse. I liked it cause it felt smoother.

Do you get it from a regular doctor or psych doctor? just curious since I plan to start taking it again eventually and seeing a psych was too expensive here in NYC since a lot of them won't take insurance.

 

[brownbanana]

ADD/ADHD is mostly an issue having to due with a inhibitory response and a excitatory response. That is, the volition to inhibit an action. And the volition to initiate an action (excitatory). That being said Designbuilt, since the adderall is picking up the slack for later, you have to work on that inhibitory response.

As well as, the inability to filter out the irrelevant. Meditation does wonders here. You would not believe how much we have going on inside our heads till you try to clear your mind of thoughts. Meditation is a mental discipline.

It is wise to view it as a supplement. 90% diet and 10% gear (I know I am leaving out sleep). Try not to see it as a "necessity". Otherwise you can create a starvation mentality about it. Starvation mentality: enough is never enough and you will starve to death if you don't have it.

 

[jcc80]

Edit: oops, I meant to quote maldorf's post, didn't quite happen that way. This is regarding the 'microdosing'.

Yeah, the dose is taken first thing in the morning and it's all clear by bed. I won't elaborate on it, since this is the wrong forum for that, but it's pretty easy to get a proper dose. Dose range is from 1/20th to 1/8th of a standard recreational dose. Done properly, the user should not really 'feel' much at all, just go about his/her say with extra focus and creativity. And an outstanding mood all day.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[maldorf]

Edit: oops, I meant to quote maldorf's post, didn't quite happen that way. This is regarding the 'microdosing'.

Yeah, the dose is taken first thing in the morning and it's all clear by bed. I won't elaborate on it, since this is the wrong forum for that, but it's pretty easy to get a proper dose. Dose range is from 1/20th to 1/8th of a standard recreational dose. Done properly, the user should not really 'feel' much at all, just go about his/her say with extra focus and creativity. And an outstanding mood all day.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Thanks for sharing. I wonder about any long term harm that might be caused by that though. No research done on it, but we do crazy shit as bodybuilders too which is probably more dangerous.