Borge Fagerli protein article

[Kapeta]

I posted this here to possibly drive more hits and discussion as the article section seems "dark" at times.

Borge Fagerli is a smart dude it seems. John Meadows speaks highly of him. This article touched a small nerve, but I've been thinking about this a lot lately and he backed it up well with some science stuff from Stuart Phillips (protein researcher).

The final word on protein(?) - The blog of Borge Fagerli – aka Blade

I would like to know if anyone has gone as low as he recommends in protein and have you had any issues? By issues, I mean by actual objective, meaningful differences. Subjective feelings are one thing, but has anyone every measured anything when going lower on protein?

I know some here have dropped their protein intakes by taking in things like Humapro and LBAs and reported subjective improvements (perhaps there are objective ones, but I haven't seen them).

All thoughts are welcome!

 

[Blade_HST]

Thanks for posting (and thanks to John for the props in his recent picture thread - you’re going to kill it this year, buddy :headbang.

Just like to mention that for enhanced bodybuilders, research indicates that protein efficiency is actually higher when using AAS/GH, making protein needs LOWER. We could argue, though, that it is wise to increase protein, since protein synthesis is accelerated - with 600mg/week of testosterone you grow muscles faster while sedentary, than someone not using and training hard.

At this point we do not know for sure, and there obviously isn’t a lot of interest in doing research on the protein needs of 250lbs+ pharmaceutically enhanced bodybuilders. IMO and IME, however, you probably won’t get further gains beyond 1.3-1.5g/lbs of LBM unless you’re dieting hard, and would get more bang for you buck just having more carbs and fats to cover a decent surplus for growing.

 

[BOOMSHAKER]

Very informative article, thanks for posting it. I have emailed a few folks already and passed it on.

 

[NZRABBIT]

How wide are individual variances for optimal protein requirements amongst subjects in these studies typically?

 

[Blade_HST]

There are always individual variances in the MPS, but they didn’t single out subjects to give them added protein. The response to the 40g vs. 20g was within a pretty high confidence interval insignificant for all subjects, and AAs were oxidized and/or went into gluconeogenesis.

 

[TrenBrah]

Thanks for posting (and thanks to John for the props in his recent picture thread - you’re going to kill it this year, buddy :headbang.

Just like to mention that for enhanced bodybuilders, research indicates that protein efficiency is actually higher when using AAS/GH, making protein needs LOWER. We could argue, though, that it is wise to increase protein, since protein synthesis is accelerated - with 600mg/week of testosterone you grow muscles faster while sedentary, than someone not using and training hard.

At this point we do not know for sure, and there obviously isn’t a lot of interest in doing research on the protein needs of 250lbs+ pharmaceutically enhanced bodybuilders. IMO and IME, however, you probably won’t get further gains beyond 1.3-1.5g/lbs of LBM unless you’re dieting hard, and would get more bang for you buck just having more carbs and fats to cover a decent surplus for growing.

That would be awesome if they did those studies! I do 1g/lb while off cycle but on I do 1.5g/lb just incase more protein is better. Rather get too much protein than be consuming not enough protein to maximize my gains on cycle.

 

[ccohen]

protein

I've gone as low as .8-1.0 gram per pound of LBM in myself and clients with no muscle loss and in most cases gains in LBM while that low.

 

[Stewie]

Great read!

 

[mrlakramondas]

I posted this here to possibly drive more hits and discussion as the article section seems "dark" at times.

Borge Fagerli is a smart dude it seems. John Meadows speaks highly of him. This article touched a small nerve, but I've been thinking about this a lot lately and he backed it up well with some science stuff from Stuart Phillips (protein researcher).

The final word on protein(?) - The blog of Borge Fagerli – aka Blade

I would like to know if anyone has gone as low as he recommends in protein and have you had any issues? By issues, I mean by actual objective, meaningful differences. Subjective feelings are one thing, but has anyone every measured anything when going lower on protein?

I know some here have dropped their protein intakes by taking in things like Humapro and LBAs and reported subjective improvements (perhaps there are objective ones, but I haven't seen them).

All thoughts are welcome!

I agree with a lot of what Blade says about nutrition and training.

2g/kg bw/day is plenty in most cases (Both for dieting and growth).

Although a hormonized lifter might benefit from a bit more. Same thing with very aggressive dieting.

 

[Unknown]

Very nice article thank you for this!

 

[wardog50]

I remember Lou Ferrigno years ago talking about his protein intake being much lower than most. It seemed like he was between .75 to 1.0 grams of protein pr lbs. of body weight.
That dude is huge too. In 93 he stepped on stage at the O ripped and no water and weighed 305 on stage. My understanding is he was the first BB to actually compete at over 300lbs (not just off season weight).

Anyway it seems like his logic and this article have some likeness.

War

 

[MR. BMJ]

Good guy right here!

 

[halflife]

Best most informative advice/quote from this article:

So is this the final word? Probably not, but for the most part I doubt there will be any major surprises. Over-anal-yzing and going back and forth on a gram here or a minute there is, more often than not, irrelevant in the grand perspective of things. Over the span of months and years where so many other things can go wrong anyway…