EPO Benefits for bodybuilders?

[TooPowerful4u]

First off dont even THINK im considering this, im not nuts, iv read on it, and i dont wanna die haha. Im just curious from what iv heard so i figured id post here and ask.

What benefits is there for bodybuilders using EPO? Iv heard some top pro's use it for bodybuilding, and i cant understand why. To make cardio easier? Workouts longer? I dont understand what it could do for you thats so special. Iv heard one guy say it gave his muscles more "peak and roundness" which sounds like total bullshit since you cant change genetic shape of your muscles.

Also, why wouldnt you just take high doses of Drol or EQ to increase RBC count in a more safe controlled manor anyway, im sure its gotta be close to same thing as taking EPO right?

 

[TooPowerful4u]

Also something confusing me. . .

EPO is used mainly by endurance athletes right? EPO is synthetic Red Blood Cells. It also makes the blood thicker. Its said to greatly increase endurance capacity.

Then why do i read tons and tons of posts on other boards saying EQ made them get "winded" much easier and faster. EQ boosts RBC count by a lot too right? Shouldnt EQ INCREASE aerobic capacity then?

 

[zephyr22]

Actually TP4U...

Epogen( synthetic erythropoiten) actually cause a direct stimulation effect. It stimulates the production of oxygen-carrying red blood cells by the bone marrow and is used in the treatment of anemia usually. It is usaully used in patients on dialysis or extreme anemias that are sympotamatic( short of breath with minimal exertion etc...). Now EQ Im sure is a secondary action causing inc in RBC not direct stim like epo. Now why pros use it??? I dont know but to me Im pretty sure it would increase muscle fullness appearance. Also causes some mean vascularity. Big A probably knows more about why BB use it. Hope that cleared up some of your questions.

 

[gooey]

I have heard...

of Bbers that popped anadrol before the show and it helped them fill out and get veiny too because of the increase of RBC, but dont know about EPO, endurance athletes use it but I dont understand either, because too may RBC and the blood becomes thicker and sticky and does not travel as efficient as before usage.
gooey

 

[BrooklynJuice]

EPO is very safe if you know what you are doing. Increased RBC = increase oxygen = more work

 

[gooey]

yes but...

here are some reasons why it may not be safe... so be careful

Problems and Side Effects

It is also possible that blood doping could have effects opposite to those intended. A large infusion of red blood cells (and resulting increase in cellular concentration) could increase blood viscosity and bring about a decrease in cardiac output, a decrease in blood flow velocity, and a reduction in peripheral oxygen content – all of which would reduce aerobic capacity (#7). The human heart was not designed to pump this thickened blood throughout the body and, therefore, could lead to a multitude of problems. Some of the problems that can arise from an autologous blood transfusion are phlebitis, septicemia, hyperviscosity syndrome (including intravascular clotting, heart failure and potential death), bacterial infections, and air/clot embolisms

gooey

 

[BrooklynJuice]

EPO is WIDELY used for many year now. Animal has extensive knowledge and experience with it...

 

[Massive G]

I never saw the point for bb'ing as most juicers have a higher than normal hematocrit caused by the secondary stimulation of RBC production as stated above by Z22. androgens>stimulate kidneys>epo produced>-bone marrow-rbc's manufactured.
Compounds like deca EQ and drol as well as Test all raise heamtocrit levels through this pathway..pretty much dose and time dependant.

NEWLY produced RBC's live for 4 months and the only way to get rid of high hematocrit levels is by phlebotomy-bleeding off pints of blood depending on the %.

 

[BrooklynJuice]

recent thread on EPO

**broken link removed**

 

[Massive G]

Can't view it.

 

[Triguy]

"of Bbers that popped anadrol before the show and it helped them fill out and get veiny too because of the increase of RBC" Gooey



The process by which red blood cells are produced is called Quick Facts about: erythropoiesis
The process of producing red blood cells by the stem cells in the bone marrowerythropoiesis. Erythrocytes are continuously being produced in the red Quick Facts about: bone marrow
The fatty network of connective tissue that fills the cavities of bonesbone marrow of large bones. (In the Quick Facts about: embryo
An animal organism in the early stages of growth and differentiation that in higher forms merge into fetal stages but in lower forms terminate in commencement of larval lifeembryo, the Quick Facts about: liver
Large and complicated reddish-brown glandular organ located in the upper right portion of the abdominal cavity; secretes bile and functions in metabolism of protein and carbohydrate and fat; synthesizes substances involved in the clotting of the blood; syliver is the main site of red blood cell production.) The production can be stimulated by the Quick Facts about: hormone
The secretion of an endocrine gland that is transmitted by the blood to the tissue on which it has a specific effecthormone Quick Facts about: erythropoietin
A glycoprotein secreted by the kidneys that stimulates the production of red blood cellserythropoietin (EPO), which is used for Quick Facts about: doping
Quick Summary not found for this subjectdoping in sports. Erythrocytes develop in about 7 days and live a total of about 120 days. The aging cells swell up to a sphere-like shape and are engulfed by Quick Facts about: phagocyte
A cell that engulfs and digests debris and invading microorganismsphagocytes, destroyed and their materials are released into the blood. The main sites of destruction are the liver and the Quick Facts about: spleen
A large dark-red oval organ on the left side of the body between the stomach and the diaphragm; produces cells involved in immune responsesspleen. The heme constituent of hemoglobin is eventually excreted as Quick Facts about: bilirubin
An orange-yellow pigment in the bile that forms as a product of hemoglobin; excess amounts in the blood produce the yellow appearance observed in jaundicebilirubin.



I was gonna discount what gooey said, until i did the research! I always thought it took longer than 7 days, do your research first guys before your spout out! I learned my lesson!

 

[xcelbeyond]

recent thread on EPO

**broken link removed**

I get this error message for that link:
"The topic or post you requested does not exist"

This should work: **broken link removed**

 

[Mr_Magoo]

yes epo is safe only if u know what ur doing, like when people were scared of insulin at first....then they realized it can be very safe...

 

[TooPowerful4u]

I was told it has to be cut 30 days precontest becuase it stops your body from releasing sodium and cuases you to retain water. Now if thats true, why would a bodybuilder use it? The fullness and vascularity it gives your muscles wont be there on show day right? Dont tell me all these bodybuilders are using it to increase aerobic capacity, thats retarted. Theres gotta be another reason.

Increased RBC = increase oxygen = more work

Still even if it allows you to work out faster and longer, wouldnt that be overtraining? Theres only so much you can do and a certain point you can tear down the muscle until it just cant recover. Does increased RBC count have anything to do with increased recovery or nutrient delivery?

Iv read it helps buffer lactic acid very well. What effect would that have?

What is the lowest effective and most common doses used for EPO?

 

[BrooklynJuice]

Well one of the ways AAS works is thru increased RBC as well

 

[Massive G]

Well one of the ways AAS works is thru increased RBC as well

EXACTLTY...that's why it always confused me why BB'ers would use this when common androgens "secondarily blood dope" you with the added benefit of increased nitrogen retention and anabolism.
As stated above RBC's live 4 months so this is something someone could do in the offseason and still maintain a high hematocrit.
Although it's not recommended as high hematocrits aren't healthy to have and many many many long term or year round juicers have this condition of steroid induced polycythemia.

**broken link removed**

 

[mrcat]

Most endurance athletes take blood thinners with it. There were some deaths before they started doing that.

Balco was using it with sprinters, so it likely would have use with bodybuilders. Quicker recovery?

 

[maldorf]

altogether it is a very useful tool if you do not with to use gear.

Yeah, if youre not taking steroids. A person is a fool if they are on steroids and taking EPO at the same time. I get the impression that there might be some on here that are doing that. That is not needed. Hell, just taking an HRT dose of 120 mg/wk and my hematocrit got to 56 which is above the safety zone and I had to have phlebotomies. Others on here know all about this. IF youre on steroids you have no business taking any EPO since it will provide no further benefits and just expose you to health risks such as death.

 

[mexbeast]

Yeah, if youre not taking steroids. A person is a fool if they are on steroids and taking EPO at the same time. I get the impression that there might be some on here that are doing that. That is not needed. Hell, just taking an HRT dose of 120 mg/wk and my hematocrit got to 56 which is above the safety zone and I had to have phlebotomies. Others on here know all about this. IF youre on steroids you have no business taking any EPO since it will provide no further benefits and just expose you to health risks such as death.

:yeahthat: the bad thing is if someone thinks they can benefit from something, they will ignore good advise!. with everything else available why use a risky drug with questionable benefits for bbrs?

 

[BigJohn]

Will blood thinners help with high RBC?

Some brief research indicated it reduces your platelet count (clotting agent) and could cause uncontrolled bleeding if an injury occured. Get to the ER type bleeding. This is probably dose dependent.

However, my docs keep cutting my test off when my RBC starts to go up. This sucks, kills sex drive, etc. They don't give a crap either. I've been going round in circles with the docs for several years now.

I don't want to have phlebotomies for the rest of my life. That's not a good solution. So would a blood thinner lower your RBC? If not, what does?