MEGADOSING LEUCINE

[Mike Arnold]

Since I can't take in supplemental protein and can't eat a lot, I rely on EAA for my protein. I get 100 grams of protein a day from food and the rest is from TN essential amino acids (90grams) with added BCAA. Most of my other nutrition comes from rice and healthy fats.

That would certainly be easier on your digestive tract. How much do you weigh? The reason I ask is because 190 grams of protein is on the lower side for most bodybuilders, unless they are under 200 lbs.

 

[BigGame]

I always add 5g of TN Instantized Leucine or AjiPure Fusil to my protein shakes.

 

[old timer]

Not to hijack, but HOW do you consume them? I have some and they're almost hydrophobic and much of it sets on top of the liquid that I have attempted to mix it with.

 

[Cinder]

That would certainly be easier on your digestive tract. How much do you weigh? The reason I ask is because 190 grams of protein is on the lower side for most bodybuilders, unless they are under 200 lbs.

190grams?
No I'm sorry I meant 100 grams food protein plus I consumed 90 grams of EAA per day. With the assumption that 5 grams EAA equals 15 grams protein. I got that from a few members hear in regards to something called humapro.
I'm 244 pounds 5'8 and 16% fat at the moment

 

[Allday]

190grams?
No I'm sorry I meant 100 grams food protein plus I consumed 90 grams of EAA per day. With the assumption that 5 grams EAA equals 15 grams protein. I got that from a few members hear in regards to something called humapro.
I'm 244 pounds 5'8 and 16% fat at the moment

Think that's what Mike meant, just added the 90 to your 100 grams of whole protein.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, as it's been a little while since I read in depth on EAAs but wouldn't 1 gram equate to 1 gram of protein since your body will produce the 11 non essential amino acids to complete the protein?

I'm sure in actuality one's body wouldn't be able to effectively complete super high amounts on essential amino acids every day (just because it's a more complex process than digesting a complete protein - never seen proof in studies on it), but in theory it should.

 

[Cinder]

Think that's what Mike meant, just added the 90 to your 100 grams of whole protein.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, as it's been a little while since I read in depth on EAAs but wouldn't 1 gram equate to 1 gram of protein since your body will produce the 11 non essential amino acids to complete the protein?

I'm sure in actuality one's body wouldn't be able to effectively complete super high amounts on essential amino acids every day (just because it's a more complex process than digesting a complete protein - never seen proof in studies on it), but in theory it should.

I do like to know this lol. Cause I'm going off 5grams EAA equals around 15grams.

 

[nothuman]

I used to religiously do 5g of leucine, 6 times a day. I'd have a little teaspoon before my 6 meals a day.


It definitely will put on some muscle.... but it gets annoying to dose that way. and it is not cheap.


I'm on the fence whether I should keep doing that or not. I've read some conflicting research, but it does seem to work.

This is exactly what I do, unless I have a protein shake as my protein source because that already has leucine in it.

 

[nothuman]

Not to hijack, but HOW do you consume them? I have some and they're almost hydrophobic and much of it sets on top of the liquid that I have attempted to mix it with.

You have to just take a small teaspoon and stick it directly into your mouth, then sip a little water to swallow it. Mixing it in water and then drinking is just a mess because it sinks to the top.

 

[jstrong20]

Not to hijack, but HOW do you consume them? I have some and they're almost hydrophobic and much of it sets on top of the liquid that I have attempted to mix it with.

Yeah bulk leucine is a bitch. I just keep chugging and adding water until I get it all. I haven't used it for awhile but always felt better recovery. Thread has me wanting to start again.

 

[Cytochrome]

Yeah bulk leucine is a bitch. I just keep chugging and adding water until I get it all. I haven't used it for awhile but always felt better recovery. Thread has me wanting to start again.

You could buy instantised leucine powder?

 

[KillerStack]

If you go by what these respected researchers in the nutrition for athletes field, like Alan Aragon, Schoenfeld, Lyle McDonald etc say, if you are eating "enough" protein, adding Leucine or BCAA's likely does nothing - according to all available research. Personally I've played with very high doses, "because it can't hurt", and it's hard to say what if anything it's doing. So I'm inclined to agree woth those guys. Though I still drink aminos during workouts or when I don't feel like ingesting solids.

For example:

As noted in a recent review by Morton et al. [5], there is a paucity of evidence supporting a beneficial effect for BCAA supplementation in promoting increases in muscle protein synthesis or lean mass, and in fact there might be a detrimental impact given that the AAs appear to antagonize each other in terms of transport both into circulation and likely into the muscle.

https://jissn.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12970-016-0128-9

But alot depends on how creatively you like to read research. Just like with the insulin hypothesis of fat loss/gain, some people will just not trust the research available.

Some like Milos seem to think free form aminos do not function like complete food protein in the body, but that's not based on anything except magical thinking since Milos bought some aminos in the pharmacy in Yugoslavia in the 80's... so they must be drug-like.

 

[JeanClaude]

Leucine supplementation has been shown to be linked to pancreatic cancer growth in mice.

Here's a link:

https://cancerandmetabolism.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/2049-3002-2-6

Here's the conclusion of the article:

These findings show that leucine supplementation enhances tumor growth in both lean and overweight mice through diet-dependent effects in a murine model of pancreatic cancer, suggesting caution against the clinical use of leucine supplementation for the purposes of skeletal muscle enhancement in cachectic patients.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Nyoco]

Leucine is HIGHLY effective at simulating protein synthesis and causing muscle growth. The research supporting this is overhwleming and beyond dispute. In fact, I consider leucine to be among the Top 3 basic nutritional supplements for bodybuilders.

However, there are 3 factors you have to take into consideration. Dose, frequency of use, and rapidity of digestion.

Regarding dosage, research shows that roughly 4.5 grams provides a maximum response in protein synthesis, with larger amounts having no additional effect (assuming it is delivered in bolus fashion and absorbed immediately; see rapidity of digestion below).

Furthermore, if you take leucine too frequently, the body desensitizes to its protein synthesis stimulating effect. So, the guys that drink a gallon of leucine/BCAA spiked water all day long are doing themselves a disservice. Leucine works best when taken at timed intervals of every 3-4 hours. This allows enough time for the body to become "re-sensitized" to its protein synthesis stimulating effect.

We also need to consider rapidity of digestion. Since administering leucine via intravenous injection is not practical (or desirable on a long-term basis), it works best when taken on an empty stomach, either 20 minutes before meals or between meals. Taking it with a stomach full of food will drastically slow down its absorption rate, thereby diminishing its protein synthesis stimulating effect.

When researchers studied the 4.5 gram dose (the dose found to maximally stimulate protein synthesis) it was administered in bolus fashion on an empty stomach. Leucine needs to hit the bloodstream all at once (or close to it) in order to have a maximum impact on protein synthesis. Otherwise, the 4.5 gram dose will not work optimally.

Mike may I ask what the other top 2 supplements would be in your opinion? Thanks.

 

[LedShotter]

If you eat 400-600g protein everyday, do you still think there is a benefit to adding 6g leucine to each meal?

To the guys that have tried supplementing with leucine, what was your protein intake? How did you spread that protein intake?

 

[heavyhitter]

If you eat 400-600g protein everyday, do you still think there is a benefit to adding 6g leucine to each meal?

To the guys that have tried supplementing with leucine, what was your protein intake? How did you spread that protein intake?

Who's eating 600 grams of protein a day????

 

[Elvia1023]

Mike may I ask what the other top 2 supplements would be in your opinion? Thanks.

Whey protein and Creatine

 

[saudades]

Not to hijack, but HOW do you consume them? I have some and they're almost hydrophobic and much of it sets on top of the liquid that I have attempted to mix it with.

It mixes quite well with hydrowhey and karbolyn as a shake.

 

[epoxy]

It mixes quite well with hydrowhey and karbolyn as a shake.

yeah honestly the only time i ever supplemented it when i was using Mike's old insulin protocol and i had it in my shakes around my insulin shot and workout. never tried it with meals.....prolly wont start.

someone tell me they contribute 10lbs of lean mass to leucine and ill invest my money. otherwise.....i'm gonna say it's one step above snake oil.

i just started taking an extra protein shake along with each whole food meal. plenty of fukin leucine there m8.

 

[Cytochrome]

yeah honestly the only time i ever supplemented it when i was using Mike's old insulin protocol and i had it in my shakes around my insulin shot and workout. never tried it with meals.....prolly wont start.

someone tell me they contribute 10lbs of lean mass to leucine and ill invest my money. otherwise.....i'm gonna say it's one step above snake oil.

i just started taking an extra protein shake along with each whole food meal. plenty of fukin leucine there m8.

I hear what you saying. But I cannot take any whey (concentrate/isolate) without stomach upset. Not lactose intolerant, just whey ruins me.

So using leucine like I have been has been a god send and has not only definitely helped with strength gains, but also fat loss.

10lbs? A lot of steroid cycles will not even elicit these type of gains consistently.

 

[OutToLunch]

I hear what you saying. But I cannot take any whey (concentrate/isolate) without stomach upset. Not lactose intolerant, just whey ruins me.



So using leucine like I have been has been a god send and has not only definitely helped with strength gains, but also fat loss.



10lbs? A lot of steroid cycles will not even elicit these type of gains consistently.

May be a better idea to consume eaa instead