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NEW STUDY ON RECEPTOR SHUTDOWN

LATS

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i can not get into to many specifics but, a friend of mine is doing a study funded by a university in cali. he is a professor there and is doing the study himself. to make a long story short. he is of the opinion that long term steroid use is not going to shut down the receptors. the study will try to show that long term roid use does not shut down the receptors as once thought. he will be finished with the study late summer and once it is released to his peers in his department i will show portions of it here. we will have to see what the study reveals.
 

MikeS

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There has been conflicting opinions on this subject.
One is that receptors will downgrade as LATS said.
But ther has been reasons to think that they actually
upgrade. They increase to compensate for the expected flood
of steroids that are taken. Id be real interested to see an actual studies results. But real life BB experience seem to show that androgen receptors do downgrade. Else something else causes
AS to become less effective over time. :eek:
 

Ivan

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MAybe

Do you think it could be because of the increased level of cortisal that slows all the gains down after awhile?? I am still really interested in finding out if they do indeed downgrade/regulate
 

homonunculus

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Bingo...

MikeS said:
Else something else causes
AS to become less effective over time. :eek:
The receptor concentration in the cell is of course not the end-all-be-all. Post-receptor control (binding, transcriptional control, mRNA degradation, RNA translation efficiency, protein synthetic machinery activity, etc.) can just as easily bring the anabolic effects of an androgen to a screeching halt as having no receptors around...

Nonetheless, looking forward to the results. I take it this was an animal model, LATS?... (Mice, rats, rabbits?....)

-Randy
 

PHIL HERNON

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My opinion

The only downgrade I have experienced in "Real life" is when I get off completely. I never get weaker or lose the agressiveness to train unless I am completely off. I never believed in downgrade because of this. Just because the gains slow or even stop, this doesnt mean your receptors are downgrading. If you are at a plateau, it is because you just are not able to ingest more protein. I dont care how much juice you take, if you dont get the calories in, you just wont grow, period.
 

Big A

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Re: My opinion

PHIL HERNON said:
The only downgrade I have experienced in "Real life" is when I get off completely. I never get weaker or lose the agressiveness to train unless I am completely off. I never believed in downgrade because of this. Just because the gains slow or even stop, this doesnt mean your receptors are downgrading. If you are at a plateau, it is because you just are not able to ingest more protein. I dont care how much juice you take, if you dont get the calories in, you just wont grow, period.
Agreed 100% :D
 

patk

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Dido...:D I think that it is BS! Will be very interested in seeing the results of the study though, take care.

patk
 

homonunculus

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Phil and Big A

How many kcal and g protein do you guys put down when eating at your highest levels?...

-Randy
 

Fathead

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LATS

My wife is doing something similar but it has to do with insulin, I don't know why but she is obsessed with insulin and the affects it has on athletes and non athletes. She also has studied Anabolics way more in depth and is probably on the downgrade argument side which I am to so this would be interesting to present to her.

Hey Phil I gotta disagree with you about the protein theory you have there because human anatomy 101 dictates that once the muscle or cell is full it just wont absorb anymore you just make more poopy. Mike Francois and his doctors all agree that is probably what led to his problems. Also to be quite honest your growth all depends on your genetic potential or on how much GH you can afford to buy along with the anabloics and whatever else you may want to use like synth because you can only trick it so much.
 

flex4me

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I have a question about the whole receptor deal. If you are "on" and you are eating bad while "on" doesn't your receptors pick this up and stor the fat. Doesn't it make it even harder to burn off for Competition? Hope that makes sense.
 

Fathead

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No

flex4me said:
I have a question about the whole receptor deal. If you are "on" and you are eating bad while "on" doesn't your receptors pick this up and stor the fat. Doesn't it make it even harder to burn off for Competition? Hope that makes sense.


Your completely confusing a receptor with a fat cell two different things, a fat cell has no idea your taking anabolics or what your receptors are doing with them.

here is a link that gives some idea of a steroid receptor

http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/S/SteroidREs.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...list_uids=2194782&dopt=Abstract&holding=f1000



fat cell links

http://www.rockefeller.edu/pubinfo/trap220_053102.nr.html

http://www.majidali.com/the1.htm this was kind of a interesting quick read tells about fat.
 

Big A

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Re: Phil and Big A

homonunculus said:
How many kcal and g protein do you guys put down when eating at your highest levels?...

-Randy
I honestly don't know. I just eat, and eat, and eat. The more protein I eat the more I grow. If I am not happy with the rate of growth, I just eat more protein. It never failed.
It's really not any more basic than that LOL
 

PHIL HERNON

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Good point Fathead, but

There is quite a big difference between studying anabolics and actually using/abusing them for 10-15 years. A lot of these doctors have never been around the kind of dosages that we use and see the effects of. This is why I agree with Big A and Tom Platz on the protein issue. It is hard for me to believe that too much protein was the cause of Mike Francois' problems.
 

Big A

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Re: Good point Fathead, but

PHIL HERNON said:
It is hard for me to believe that too much protein was the cause of Mike Francois' problems.
If plenty of fluids and fibre is ingested, protein, in any amount, shouldn't cause any colon problems.
 

flex4me

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Thanks for the sites. How ever I do know what a fat cell is. I have taken many Kinesiology and A&P courses. Someone I talked to said if you are eating shitty while you were on, it would do something to the receptors. I was just trying to see if this person was right or not.
Thanks for the feedback.
 

Fathead

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well

You need to educate your friend because he/she has no idea about cell biology to make such a statement.
 

Step

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Maybe SHBG could be part of the reason why gains slow down-

Sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) is a glycoprotein synthesized by the liver. Circulating androgen and estrogen concentrations influence SHBG synthesis. Elevated testosterone, for example, causes SHBG synthesis to decrease, whereas high estrogen stimulates SHBG production. The regulation of SHBG synthesis, combined with SHBG's higher affinity for testosterone, impacts bioavailable testosterone levels.
It could also be partly why some people respond well to steroids while others don't.....
 

Steak Helmet

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I would love to read the study on that one...


I hope you can share or make a good article out of it and send it to one of the muscle mags.
 

JETHRO TULL

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HAHAHAAHA....OH, BOY...I AM CRACKING UP HERE!

FATHEAD............BUD, PLEASE STOP READING MY MIND. YOU ARE LIKE MY EVIL MUTANT TWIN! < EXCEPT YOU ARE BUILT BETTER>......:D :D :D :D ...........I SURE HOPE FLEX4ME GETS A CHANCE TO HELP HER FRIEND! HAHAHA............

LATS: THANKS FOR GETTING THIS THREAD GOING!

PRO CONTRIBUTORS: THANKS FOR THROWING IN ON THIS.......IT HELPS ME OUT. SO..........ITS TIME TO GO HOARK DOWN SOM OATS WITH MY PROTEIN!!! FIBER, FIBER, FIBER! :)
 

flex4me

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Jethro tull
I really hope that you are not trying to make fun of me for something I have heard. I always feel comforatsblr asking questions on this board that I "hear" and always feel comforatable with the responses. A guy that I know from the gym I work out in was saying something about it and i wasn't even sure what he was talking about so, I thought I would post what I had heard.
Not trying to be rude but, I think I should be able to ask about something I hear. I am not the one who stated that.

The person I heard it from is not that educated on AS that is why I wanted to ask people that I thought knew.
 

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