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People eat too much protein

Pumped340

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Years back I was in the 350-450g a day gang.

Over the past five years I've cut back to about 200-225g a day and have kept gaining and honestly don't feel it's slowed me down at all.

I was at 5'9, 250 before injury and lockdown...

I think studies have generally shown 1g per lb is enough... The supplement companies obviously want you to eat more and I think a lot of guys over eat protein in fear of suffering slower growth.

The freaks of now who blow up to 280-290 at 5'9 are generally doing so with mega slin, massive carb intake, circa 800-1000g and obviously high pharma gh... Protein at 500g a day isn't necessary.
This is my and many other's experience as well. Maybe it's different on gear or high doses of gear, but after about a decade of natural training and eating 2g/lb for several years of that I switched back to 1g/lb and noticed no negative to that whatsoever. Like I said that or a similar story is pretty common.

Digestion could certainly be a different story.

I'm not sure you posted based on actual science? 1g can be enough, sure. 1.5g is better and 2g is optimal especially when in a caloric deficit.

Personal experience, I feel great at 1.5g... Stronger + leaner and my digestion is on point. Only time I've needed to go higher is when my calories are low such as in competition prep. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4617900/ ... "Consuming a high protein diet (3.4 g/kg/d) in conjunction with a heavy resistance-training program may confer benefits with regards to body composition. Furthermore, there is no evidence that consuming a high protein diet has any deleterious effects."

2g per bw was also shown to provide more fat loss. I believe more plates more dates made a video about this if I'm not mistaken and included the study.
Keep in mind this is one study, that hasn't been replicated, and is in contrast to the previous research. Not completely discounting it of course, I could see potential for benefit particularly when dieting (note that there was NO difference in accrual of muscle).
 

Pumped340

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Former fatty. I keep it around 1.5g per pound. I tried 1g per pound of body weight and I overate due to hunger. And once I pop I can’t stop lol

If i eat 8oz 96/4 beef, I don’t want anymore. If i eat one potato, I want another, with butter, and chives, and cheese, and then I just ate 700 calories lol
This is so important. SO many people make a change and don't realize why they are seeing what they see. How many of these people claiming that higher protein keeps them "tighter" are really just 1.) less bloated and 2.) eating less / getting in less net calories due to the thermic effect of protein and the increased satiety. If your waistline went down an inch because you're less bloated and you're eating 300-500 fewer calories because protein is far more satiating than carbs, it wasn't the high protein directly that had some magic benefit.

Specific dynamic action = the thermic effect of food.

Anyone here can eat the way they want to eat.....but the fact of the matter is the amount of energy it takes to digest and assimilate

protein vs carbs vs fats is very distinct.

protein =20-35%
fats and carbs = 5-15% and i think thats a gross overstatement with fats more like 5% and carbs more like 7.5%

Whats the easiest food to eat? pretty much carbs and fats...hey i get it. And again people can do what they want to do.

But the thermogenisis of diet particulars is very real...and if you are going to overeat one macro....its a pretty easy choice of the one you can get away with making the least mistakes with=protein.
Exactly though, all this is is a method to burn more calories. You could similarly just eat fewer calories.

If you track calories, this becomes completely null. If you're looking for a way to control calories and appetite without tracking then sure, high protein is one way to do that.

It's like vegans claiming they lost so much weight....yea because you ate way more vegetables and way fewer calories. You could have lost that weight on any type of diet if you tracked calories. Don't conflate the results with that change without understanding why that change occurred.
 

BoredStiff

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Been saying this (not just here) since 2017. Ive posted this a million times but basically due to digestive issues I had to cut back Protein at the start of 2017. I was now at 75g per day, I knew I'd lose everything. Well at the end of the first year, I measured myself to see how small I was and to my shock, every single measurement was the same. No strength loss anywhere as well. 2019 I pushed it more and did 50g of protein per day, end of the year? Exact same size, weight, and strength just as good.

I think protein is insanely overrated. Average sedentary adult male needs what? 50g or so per day? As an athlete or bodybuilder, sure eat a bit more, but don't overdose on it.

ESPECIALLY true for those who have peaked and are maintaining, which would include me. When we go to the gym, what are we tearing and rebuilding? Nearly nothing. So what exactly are you trying to fuel?
 

hotrod

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Dan Duchaine who was notorious at over doing everything was saying years ago that if you eat quality protein one gram per pound of lean body weight was plenty, Maybe slightly more if you were a top level bodybuilder taking copious amounts of gear.
 

Pumped340

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Been saying this (not just here) since 2017. Ive posted this a million times but basically due to digestive issues I had to cut back Protein at the start of 2017. I was now at 75g per day, I knew I'd lose everything. Well at the end of the first year, I measured myself to see how small I was and to my shock, every single measurement was the same. No strength loss anywhere as well. 2019 I pushed it more and did 50g of protein per day, end of the year? Exact same size, weight, and strength just as good.

I think protein is insanely overrated. Average sedentary adult male needs what? 50g or so per day? As an athlete or bodybuilder, sure eat a bit more, but don't overdose on it.

ESPECIALLY true for those who have peaked and are maintaining, which would include me. When we go to the gym, what are we tearing and rebuilding? Nearly nothing. So what exactly are you trying to fuel?
John Meadows has said the same. He cut protein to about 100g per day and said he noticed no negative effects from that.

As you said, when gaining it could be different but not by a lot.

Again, when dieting there are satiety benefits and potentially TEF benefits.
 

cmryan

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Been saying this (not just here) since 2017. Ive posted this a million times but basically due to digestive issues I had to cut back Protein at the start of 2017. I was now at 75g per day, I knew I'd lose everything. Well at the end of the first year, I measured myself to see how small I was and to my shock, every single measurement was the same. No strength loss anywhere as well. 2019 I pushed it more and did 50g of protein per day, end of the year? Exact same size, weight, and strength just as good.

I think protein is insanely overrated. Average sedentary adult male needs what? 50g or so per day? As an athlete or bodybuilder, sure eat a bit more, but don't overdose on it.

ESPECIALLY true for those who have peaked and are maintaining, which would include me. When we go to the gym, what are we tearing and rebuilding? Nearly nothing. So what exactly are you trying to fuel?
I'm glad you found what works best for you (and in the end that's what we all need to do). Still, I'd be concerned about 50g per day for long periods of time. Seems quite low for basic bodily necessities long term. I'd prefer to see weight training people get at least .6g/lb over the long haul. Brief periods of less than that should be no concern though. But I certainly take your overall point that too much protein can be a problem for people to digest. I'm someone that can eat a crap ton of some types of protein with little stomach upset, but it doesn't really benefit me. I try to keep to 1g/lb or slightly less.
 

juggy38

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I’ve worked with 3 coaches, and all clocked in about 1.2-1.5g per pound, but like I said, carbs were pretty low due to my propensity to store body fat.

Now, if I was a naturally lean guy who could cut on 200g carbs a day of course I would lower protein. Or guys that need 300g+ to get the scale moving, protein can be lower.

300G carbs is a damn refeed for me lol

And I like fats better honestly. Rice and oats? Naa, I rather have salted avocados, smoked salmon, sirloin steak.

But that what works for me. I tried carbs, and other than fuel for workouts, they don’t do much for me. Higher protein, EFAs, low volume training, let gluconeogenisis refil glycogen.

Hell, there’s studies showing cyclists who train, then completely fast for 2 hours replenish glycogen somewhat. Of course not back to baseline, but higher than immediately post exercise.
 

livinlean

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So you guys who are consuming low protein, what are you doing to ensure MPS? Getting enough leucine in the meal usually bumps the protein way up. I know Patrick tuor and Meadows both have their guys drink EAA... Is there anything else you guys are doing?

I'm just about to start lowering my protein to allow for more carbs which is why I am asking. I guess MPS potentially may not even matter as much in an enhanced athlete anyways since we have other compounds in our body increasing protein synthesis or am I way off there?
 

madg

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So you guys who are consuming low protein, what are you doing to ensure MPS? Getting enough leucine in the meal usually bumps the protein way up. I know Patrick tuor and Meadows both have their guys drink EAA... Is there anything else you guys are doing?

I'm just about to start lowering my protein to allow for more carbs which is why I am asking. I guess MPS potentially may not even matter as much in an enhanced athlete anyways since we have other compounds in our body increasing protein synthesis or am I way off there?
Nothing ... i think stressing about protein and leucine makes it more detrimental to gains

200 g is more than enough , especially on gear imo

I can see higher protein when cutting on prep mostly for satiety reasons

But that just me
 

livinlean

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Nothing ... i think stressing about protein and leucine makes it more detrimental to gains

200 g is more than enough , especially on gear imo

I can see higher protein when cutting on prep mostly for satiety reasons

But that just me
I'm referring to guys using even less than 200g as some did mention that in this thread. I agree that 200g from real food sources would be enough as that does hit 1g per lb for a lot of people.
 

madg

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I'm referring to guys using even less than 200g as some did mention that in this thread. I agree that 200g from real food sources would be enough as that does hit 1g per lb for a lot of people.
Sory my friend , i didnt get it , im not english 😇
 

Elvia1023

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Biggerp73

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I think individual metabolism plays into this

I'm a genetic fat boy ... Slow metabolism

I don't need much protein to maintain muscle even when on extremely low calories

But I can't go crazy on the fat/carb calories when putting on size or I just get fat, so in those stages I focus on overconsuming protein as a way to simultaneously overeat and prevent fat gain
 

headtrainer

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Years back I was in the 350-450g a day gang.

Over the past five years I've cut back to about 200-225g a day and have kept gaining and honestly don't feel it's slowed me down at all.

I was at 5'9, 250 before injury and lockdown...

I think studies have generally shown 1g per lb is enough... The supplement companies obviously want you to eat more and I think a lot of guys over eat protein in fear of suffering slower growth.

The freaks of now who blow up to 280-290 at 5'9 are generally doing so with mega slin, massive carb intake, circa 800-1000g and obviously high pharma gh... Protein at 500g a day isn't necessary.
I agree! I’ve experienced the exact same thing. I’ve tried 1.5-2 grams of protein per pound of body weight and it actually slowed down my progress by causing constipation, gas, nausea, lethargy, and excess body weight. I have learned that 1 gram per pound of body weight is optimal for size, strength, and getting lean. I’ve also learned it best to consume more clean carbs instead of fats in place of the extra protein. I keep my dietary fat intake low. Too much dietary fat makes me hold excess body fat. I do better consuming mostly clean carbs in addition to my protein needs.
 

headtrainer

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I think individual metabolism plays into this

I'm a genetic fat boy ... Slow metabolism

I don't need much protein to maintain muscle even when on extremely low calories

But I can't go crazy on the fat/carb calories when putting on size or I just get fat, so in those stages I focus on overconsuming protein as a way to simultaneously overeat and prevent fat gain
Try cutting way back on dietary fats and lower protein to 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight. Let clean fibrous carbs make up the rest of your diet. I think you’ll find out you’ll not only feel better, you’ll look better!😉
 

headtrainer

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Specific dynamic action = the thermic effect of food.

Anyone here can eat the way they want to eat.....but the fact of the matter is the amount of energy it takes to digest and assimilate

protein vs carbs vs fats is very distinct.

protein =20-35%
fats and carbs = 5-15% and i think thats a gross overstatement with fats more like 5% and carbs more like 7.5%

Whats the easiest food to eat? pretty much carbs and fats...hey i get it. And again people can do what they want to do.

But the thermogenisis of diet particulars is very real...and if you are going to overeat one macro....its a pretty easy choice of the one you can get away with making the least mistakes with=protein.
I think you just exposed the problem of why some bodybuilders gain too much body fat—“over eating!” I have learned that excess calories, even when consumed through protein, increases my body fat levels. Protein is the most expensive macronutrient and consuming excessive amounts is just flushing money down the toilet. Money could be better spent on anabolics. The more body fat you gain, the less muscle you gain, because the body becomes insulin resistance—preventing the muscles from accepting amino acids derived from protein.
 

juggy38

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^^^ehhh well there has been a few overfeeding studies on protein, basically the gist was a hyper caloric diet vs a hyper caloric diet PLUS 500 calories more protein. The more protein group gained no more body fat than the standard hypercaloric group even though taking in 3500-4000 calories more a week

Weird shit happens in protein overfeedings.

I’ll post the study after morning rounds with the doc.

And I’m not saying to overfees on calories, just saying calories in bs calories out is least accurate when we drastically change protein amounts.
 

toniportray

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Spot on about hormones being key to how calories are utilized. Anabolics will give better bang for the buck even when good protein sources are purchased on sale at my favorite warehouse retail store. If I eat more protein than my body is utilizing I start getting bloated no matter the source of the protein. On a modest cycle I can consume 2g protein/lb and not get bloated and gassy but when I'm not on anabolics anything more than 1g protein/lb body weight and my digestion starts acting up, even though my training is nearly identical on and off cycle.
 

headtrainer

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I believe everyone has different needs. For ectomorphs like myself (I can't gain fat no mater what I eat), I can get away with high carbs and moderate protein.
For other people high carbs might make them fat, so they have to use higher proteins to compensate and get their calories.
There's no 1 rule that fits all in my opinion, you just have to experiment.

The photo attached here is me eating shit all day and on TRT. Literally eating lindt chocolate, bread anything in sight, no counting calories, none of that shit.
It’s not the carbs that make you fain bodyfat as much as it is consuming too many calories for your individual metabolism. I can get skinny eating anything if I lower my calories enough. I can also get fat eating anything if I overeat.
 

headtrainer

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^^^ehhh well there has been a few overfeeding studies on protein, basically the gist was a hyper caloric diet vs a hyper caloric diet PLUS 500 calories more protein. The more protein group gained no more body fat than the standard hypercaloric group even though taking in 3500-4000 calories more a week

Weird shit happens in protein overfeedings.

I’ll post the study after morning rounds with the doc.

And I’m not saying to overfees on calories, just saying calories in bs calories out is least accurate when we drastically change protein amounts.
I get heart burn real bad when I try to bulk up by overfeeding on protein. That leads to acid reflux, headache, and feeling ill. But I agree with you that protein helps keep you feeling full ( especially during a calorie deficit) and the body burns some additional calories due to the additional thermogenic effects during the digestion of protein vs. carbs & fats. But my experience with over doing protein is like over doing anabolics—it’s makes you feel sick and it’s not worth the tiny bit of extra results I might get. Make sense?
 

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