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Strange recent prolonged shoulder issue

Knight9

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Let's rewind about three weeks. I was feeling an ache in my left scapular area so I decided to get to the gym(even though I had been avoiding going to it as often with the recent outbreak). So I go to the gym and do some pulldowns to pump the area full of blood and stretch it out. My training partner shows up and wants to do chest so I oblige and we start warming up on dumbbell incline. I only do incline work...I have probably only flat benched a dozen times or less in the last decade or more. Aside from that, I do a flat press machine if anything.

DB Inclines....warmed up with sets of 45,55 and 70. Jumped to 100, 120 or 130...all good and feeling good. I did two sets of 150s for 7-8 reps each and then moved onto other movements. Full disclosure my left shoulder has had something minorly wonky with it for years. It's hard to describe but it will crackle(not crack, but crackle) sometimes when I take my shirt off...it's hard to externally rotate..and it feels less stable under heavy weight. Also...when i scratch my back or pick at something and use a corner of a wall or entertainment center to push my elbow back so my hand can reach further behind me...SOMETIMES...especially the day of or after a pressing day it can be hard to get back rotated frontwards and back over/infront of my head. Sometimes I literally have to help it with my other hand.

I felt pretty good about the training session as I hadn't pressed 150s in likley 6-8 months. I go home and eat and shower and eventually sleep. I wake up in the middle of the night and my shoulder/chest tie in area is in a lot of discomfort. I feel like it could be the onset of DOMS in the tie-in but my shoulder feels like its inflamed and I would have to take it easy a few days. FOUR days of pain and discomfort. Somehow I ended up going back to the gym and got some blood flowing and it felt fine...for the time being. Several hours later it had returned although not quite as bad at first. These initial times for several days it felt like I had maybe torn something in my rear delt...it was painful but it would depend how I layed on the bed. I couldn't sleep on my right side..because my left shoulder would sulk down and be in pain...and no way I could sleep on my left side. On my stomach, pain would usually feel like it was at the front of my shoulder..but on my back it would feel like it was my rear delt. Then my neck and trap started to ache/hurt...then my left arm would feel weak...my tricep would ache(the long head)...the claw would spasm at times. My inner elbow would hurt and I would feel a 'pulsating' sensation in the meaty part of my forearm near my elbow if it was at a 90 degree angle. My elbow...forearm...and wrist would seem to crack more often. I would have tingling in my fingertips at times and my overall arm just felt like it was generally week and slightly unstable. Occasionally I could pinpoint sharp pain where my pectoral and underarm meet. No bruising or swelling anywhere ever through all of this.
It was 17-18 days of borderline misery and extreme annoyance/discomfort and the last 48 hrs it has seemed to tone down a bit but it still there to a less varying dergree...except in small waves which is usually alleviated by sleep. Other things that would help during this time was hot showers, standing up(not sitting or laying), and oddly enough..the last couple days taking a pre workout has alleviate the dull aches and pains I was feeling. It makes no sense to me how that has happened.

So started as a scapula ache...
Trained and turned into a Delt/pec tie in problem that progressed to triceps, trap, neck, down the arm..tingly fingers issue. Id say for 18 days I was at a 75-80% discomfort level and now I'm in the 25-30% range.

Please contribute with your knowledge fellas. What is going on?
 

MR. BMJ

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Fukk...I can't help, but i'm almost in the same boat. My pinky and side of my hand is all numb and tingly. My shoulder hurts around my neck, and then front/side/back of shoulders. Sleeping is a bitch! The pain is in waves like you mentioned too. I've had an issue with this shoulder since 2016 when I fell directly on it on the cement running from a bunch of wasps ( :( yep)...but out of nowhere, it just started hurting, especially in my last recliner I just got rid of a few weeks ago.
 

maldorf

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Tingly fingers and sharp pain that runs down the arm would most likely be compression on a nerve and possibly a damaged nerve. Something in the brachial plexus. The brachial plexus is where the nerve roots come off of the spine, its in the armpit area where they branch off. The roots divide into smaller nerves and then smaller ones etc. the pain you feel down in your arm is referred pain, the damage is most likely up in the armpit area around the shoulder region. Something in the rotator cuff is damaged and putting pressure on a nerve maybe.
 

maldorf

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Here is a decent photo of a cadaver that displays the brachial plexus.

92ae6ef5115620da1a995a7e073de337.png
 

thethinker48

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If it was an isolated tendon or ligament issue, it wouldn't radiate down.

Could be some brachial neuritis.

I would avoid movements like heavy pressing for a bit. Not sure if they do any nerve conduction tests for those, see if you can ask your doc over the phone. Has your ROM been regressing in that shoulder?

P.S- 150s is pretty damn strong on the incline
 

muscle96ss

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Let's rewind about three weeks. I was feeling an ache in my left scapular area so I decided to get to the gym(even though I had been avoiding going to it as often with the recent outbreak). So I go to the gym and do some pulldowns to pump the area full of blood and stretch it out. My training partner shows up and wants to do chest so I oblige and we start warming up on dumbbell incline. I only do incline work...I have probably only flat benched a dozen times or less in the last decade or more. Aside from that, I do a flat press machine if anything.

DB Inclines....warmed up with sets of 45,55 and 70. Jumped to 100, 120 or 130...all good and feeling good. I did two sets of 150s for 7-8 reps each and then moved onto other movements. Full disclosure my left shoulder has had something minorly wonky with it for years. It's hard to describe but it will crackle(not crack, but crackle) sometimes when I take my shirt off...it's hard to externally rotate..and it feels less stable under heavy weight. Also...when i scratch my back or pick at something and use a corner of a wall or entertainment center to push my elbow back so my hand can reach further behind me...SOMETIMES...especially the day of or after a pressing day it can be hard to get back rotated frontwards and back over/infront of my head. Sometimes I literally have to help it with my other hand.

I felt pretty good about the training session as I hadn't pressed 150s in likley 6-8 months. I go home and eat and shower and eventually sleep. I wake up in the middle of the night and my shoulder/chest tie in area is in a lot of discomfort. I feel like it could be the onset of DOMS in the tie-in but my shoulder feels like its inflamed and I would have to take it easy a few days. FOUR days of pain and discomfort. Somehow I ended up going back to the gym and got some blood flowing and it felt fine...for the time being. Several hours later it had returned although not quite as bad at first. These initial times for several days it felt like I had maybe torn something in my rear delt...it was painful but it would depend how I layed on the bed. I couldn't sleep on my right side..because my left shoulder would sulk down and be in pain...and no way I could sleep on my left side. On my stomach, pain would usually feel like it was at the front of my shoulder..but on my back it would feel like it was my rear delt. Then my neck and trap started to ache/hurt...then my left arm would feel weak...my tricep would ache(the long head)...the claw would spasm at times. My inner elbow would hurt and I would feel a 'pulsating' sensation in the meaty part of my forearm near my elbow if it was at a 90 degree angle. My elbow...forearm...and wrist would seem to crack more often. I would have tingling in my fingertips at times and my overall arm just felt like it was generally week and slightly unstable. Occasionally I could pinpoint sharp pain where my pectoral and underarm meet. No bruising or swelling anywhere ever through all of this.
It was 17-18 days of borderline misery and extreme annoyance/discomfort and the last 48 hrs it has seemed to tone down a bit but it still there to a less varying dergree...except in small waves which is usually alleviated by sleep. Other things that would help during this time was hot showers, standing up(not sitting or laying), and oddly enough..the last couple days taking a pre workout has alleviate the dull aches and pains I was feeling. It makes no sense to me how that has happened.

So started as a scapula ache...
Trained and turned into a Delt/pec tie in problem that progressed to triceps, trap, neck, down the arm..tingly fingers issue. Id say for 18 days I was at a 75-80% discomfort level and now I'm in the 25-30% range.

Please contribute with your knowledge fellas. What is going on?

Wow, so many possibilities. It definitely sounds like there is nerve involvement being caused an instability, but the symptoms are so vast that it could really be a lot of things. I would recommend a real good stretching program for the entire upper body as well as a dynamic shoulder stabilization program. You probably need a good physical therapist who works with high level athletes who can figure out the imbalances going on and execute the program.
 

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It could be a issue that may or may not be fixed with surgery. I injured my shoulder as a kid but didn't get it checked out until years later. The doctor said he didn't see anything obviously wrong except for fluid build up around the shoulder area. I would have needed a shoulder scope surgery for him to get a better look. It's been a few years since I got another scan. For the past couple of years my affected shoulder gets irritated easily. If I overdue it with volume then the issues can range from pain to even numbness going down to my pinky.

However, it'll eventually subside after going easy on it for a couple of weeks. If you have good insurance then a mri would give you a more definitive answer. If not, give it some rest and also do mobility movements and stretches for your shoulder.
 

Knight9

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Thanks for the input so far...

My pec also will have some light spasms..
It seems very much concentrated or stemming from my tie in area between delt and pec and radiates all ways out from there down to the fingertips...around through the delt and scapula and up through the trap and neck.

My doctor (who is 4 states away) and is a friend who advises me more than anything said today "brachial plexus injuries are not super common without trauma. And usually resolves within 6-12 weeks. Neck and shoulder injuries resulting in nerve compressions are significantly more common."
He is suspecting a cuff or neck disc and swelling or compression from swelling is what he says is likely the problem. The fact that I take a pre workout and it helps...or a hot shower indicates blood flow is the likely culprit.
He is really leaning on it being rotator cuff or disc..and says the crackling in my shoulder is somewhat normal of inflammation there or worn out cartilage and isn't always a big deal. When I told him about putting my arm behind my head to scratch my back and getting stuck, he mentioned a possible labral tear.

If what was going on wasn't going on right now, I could fly or drive down to him and get an MRi for free and figure it out. Looking down the road, I might be looking into mesenchymal stem cell therapy in Panama if warranted.(Just saying I would be willing to go that route)
My shoulders are my calling card and I'd like to keep their functionality and appearance.

I am taking 500mg Life Extension Super Bio Curcumin
and
Dante's The Lab J-Flex9 full dose (6 caps).
 

thethinker48

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Would your insurance cover it if he sent a referral ?

If your co-pay isn't bad, it might be worth getting it scanned to know more right away. Otherwise, rest, and rehab with a good PT (hard to find right now) is probably all you can do.

Could try BPC 157 if it's a labral or RC tear (severity dependent), but that's not doing anything for a nerve issue.
 

Knight9

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Uninsured..
I have two chiropractors I could go to but havent really pulled the trigger...partly because of the ongoing situation in the world and also because I'm not sold on the profession..though I am not hating on it either.

Regardless, a PT or Chiro wouldn't be able to know for certain unless an mri was done. One of the chiros recommended a diagnostic ultrasound which he said would cost $300 as opposed to a $3k mri.
 

muscle96ss

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Thanks for the input so far...

My pec also will have some light spasms..
It seems very much concentrated or stemming from my tie in area between delt and pec and radiates all ways out from there down to the fingertips...around through the delt and scapula and up through the trap and neck.

My doctor (who is 4 states away) and is a friend who advises me more than anything said today "brachial plexus injuries are not super common without trauma. And usually resolves within 6-12 weeks. Neck and shoulder injuries resulting in nerve compressions are significantly more common."
He is suspecting a cuff or neck disc and swelling or compression from swelling is what he says is likely the problem. The fact that I take a pre workout and it helps...or a hot shower indicates blood flow is the likely culprit.
He is really leaning on it being rotator cuff or disc..and says the crackling in my shoulder is somewhat normal of inflammation there or worn out cartilage and isn't always a big deal. When I told him about putting my arm behind my head to scratch my back and getting stuck, he mentioned a possible labral tear.

If what was going on wasn't going on right now, I could fly or drive down to him and get an MRi for free and figure it out. Looking down the road, I might be looking into mesenchymal stem cell therapy in Panama if warranted.(Just saying I would be willing to go that route)
My shoulders are my calling card and I'd like to keep their functionality and appearance.

I am taking 500mg Life Extension Super Bio Curcumin
and
Dante's The Lab J-Flex9 full dose (6 caps).

If you get a MRI, have them do it with contrast too so you can see the labrum. If the labrum is torn, depending on where the tear is; the head of the humerus can be butting up against various structures and causing inflammation.
 

muscle96ss

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Uninsured..
I have two chiropractors I could go to but havent really pulled the trigger...partly because of the ongoing situation in the world and also because I'm not sold on the profession..though I am not hating on it either.

Regardless, a PT or Chiro wouldn't be able to know for certain unless an mri was done. One of the chiros recommended a diagnostic ultrasound which he said would cost $300 as opposed to a $3k mri.

Many places will do cash-pay at a reasonable price for an MRI if you are uninsured.
 

Knight9

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Any experienced BPC-157 users have an idea on how to attack this "blindly" right now? I have 10mg sitting around and maybe some Humatrope.
 

Knight9

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See if this is applicable in your area. Some places are offering out of pocket MRIs for $300 under this program.
I'll look into it bro. Thank you. Did you see my free test numbers from all my tests on the other thread? I typed them out..
 

thethinker48

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Any experienced BPC-157 users have an idea on how to attack this "blindly" right now? I have 10mg sitting around and maybe some Humatrope.

250 mcgs 2-3 times a day near the pain site (tbh, I think it's systemic). I started using it on my injured knee, I waited around 4 weeks for stuff to kind of heal on it's own before starting.

Dramatically reduced swelling and ROM has improved only in a few days (I have torn basically every ligament in my knee). PT is good, and I'm walking normally again. Worth a shot.

Only thing I'll add is, angiogenic properties of BPC makes it pretty likely to form scar tissue (maybe even excess). So do PT with it to establish ROM, and stability, somehow I think in inactive cases, it'll cause improper scar tissue build up. It's all speculation.

Just my opinion
 

thethinker48

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$675-$720 in my area.
BTW do I want with contrast or with and without?

RC tears are without contrast usually. Confirmed labral tears are MRI arthrograms (with contrast) I'm pretty sure.

Your doctor friend might have better knowledge on this, also gotgame if you can get in touch with him. Guy worked as an ortho and radiologist
 

muscle96ss

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$675-$720 in my area.
BTW do I want with contrast or with and without?

Its around $300 in my area as well, you should be able to negotiate with some of these places as well.
 

muscle96ss

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