Superior Genetics

[Mini Truck]

In this year's Mr Olympia -

Fact: Of the top 12 best bodybuilders in the world, 3 are Caucasian.

Fact: Of the 12 best 212 competitors, 4 are Caucasian.

That's 25 33%.

-MT

 

[concreteguy]

Looking at the major factors of BB, lets say Training, Diet, Recovery, the answer must lie in recovery, right? If someone gains muscle, it's because they recovered. If they gain it fast, it's because they've recovered fast. Muscle doesn't grow unless it's recovered enough prior to new stress.

So then...nervous system recovery or tissue recovery? Both?

My big guess is that nervous system recovery is the most important. Everyone taking drugs, eating and sleeping is recovering faster. But few of us are freaks. Nor are we that unGodly strong that many freaks are.

But what if we could TRULY, fully recover. Fast. We could hit it again. Every time. Train, recover, increase the weights, increase the reps per set.

Look at how strong a lot of the freaks are. That's a superior nervous system and tendon strength. Levrone (and I always think of Troponin too, strong as an ox and massive to go with it.) So, my vote goes to better nervous system recovery in a freak. Probably goes right along with better muscle recovery too.

This is exactly the type of response I was hoping to get from this thread. A conversation about what it is that are the markers of a Genetically superior athlete.

Great response, Thank you!

CG

 

[Cito33189]

Alot of the reason Kevin responds like he does is because he actually COMES OFF STEROIDS

Then he blasts the fuck out of himself w gear gh and SEO

 

[Deleted member 121863]

an exact answer of what "superior genetics" is, why do some people grow insanely fast is such a deep conversation that will be over 99% of people`s head. You wanna get in to g-protein coupling, mRNA transcription in the DNA, receptor downregulation, etc? This is where the steroids we take are expressed and it is determined the effect it will have. I don`t think its even worth going that deep.

Here is a basic youtube video. Don`t forget steroids (lipid based) go thru different steps than hydrophilic(water soluble) hormones like insulin.
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWmu1kV1flY"]Action of Steroid Hormones - YouTube[/ame]

Either you got it or you don`t. No need being jealous or killing yourself with 3g/wk trying to keep up. You can understand biology and genetics inside out, you still can NOT change it. You can influence things with drugs, diet, routine, but your body will be fighting to stay in homeostasis. Which is why receptor down regulation happens.

 

[tenny]

Looking at the major factors of BB, lets say Training, Diet, Recovery, the answer must lie in recovery, right? If someone gains muscle, it's because they recovered. If they gain it fast, it's because they've recovered fast. Muscle doesn't grow unless it's recovered enough prior to new stress.

So then...nervous system recovery or tissue recovery? Both?

My big guess is that nervous system recovery is the most important. Everyone taking drugs, eating and sleeping is recovering faster. But few of us are freaks. Nor are we that unGodly strong that many freaks are.

But what if we could TRULY, fully recover. Fast. We could hit it again. Every time. Train, recover, increase the weights, increase the reps per set.

Look at how strong a lot of the freaks are. That's a superior nervous system and tendon strength. Levrone (and I always think of Troponin too, strong as an ox and massive to go with it.) So, my vote goes to better nervous system recovery in a freak. Probably goes right along with better muscle recovery too.

what about just better at recovery period...???

like the guy who gets away with 6 hours of sleep and feels
great all day long.....or the guy that sleeps10 to 12 and always
needs more...??

or the people who never seem to get well after being sick... and
then the people who you have NEVER seen sick....???

or the ability to simply heal a cut...??? i know ive needed stitches
ALOT of times and never went....just wrapped it up and kept working..
after 2 or 3 days its closed up enough for just a bandaid....after another
couple days...its pretty much healed....pretty nasty cuts healed very
quickly....

or the people who seem to get a bruise if you shake their hand too hard...

interesting.

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

In this year's Mr Olympia -

Fact: Of the top 12 best bodybuilders in the world, 3 are Caucasian.

Fact: Of the 12 best 212 competitors, 4 are Caucasian.

That's 25 33%.

-MT

Now take that number and put it in a ratio of how many white competitors are in this sport compared to black competitors.....I did this once at a really good state level show

There were I think 96 competitors.....only 2 of those competitors were black out of the 96....the 2 black guys won the light heavy and the superheavy and overall

 

[Elvia1023]

Well yes like anything there are different definitions of strong. Yes that is a lot of weight. But is it a lot of weight for someone who lives bodybuilding and trains most days for years... not really. Is it strong compared to everyone in most gyms.. definitely. Flex is even still fairly strong today. I have seen Dexter leg pressing a fair amount of weight recently but again I don't classify him as super strong. He just has amazing genetics for bodybuilding.

I would think that anyone who trains over 10-30 years would be strong. If they weren't that would just be weird or they just have never pushed themselves to their limits. But I still disagree with your statement about the guys with the best bb genetics are super strong. Again if a guy can be a great bodybuilder without lifting super heavy that is only a great thing for their longetivity.

Dexter is probably a prime example of what I meant in my earlier post. He looks incredible. Obviously he is older now and needs to be careful in regards to injuries. But he is also looking his best ever and in most of his training videos it's quite depressing just how much he doesn't push it. He seems to quit a few reps short of failure in most of them. He doesn't lift very heavy weights. He walks around slowly and never seems that driven. He isn't doing anything special training wise. Yet look at the guy he probably looks the best on the O stage... amazing bodybuilder. Some guys just have it come easier to them.

I can reverse things and say how many guys do you see lifting heavy that look crap... I see loads. Yes many use bad form and don't effectively target the intended muscle. But I also see loads of fairly shit looking young guys deadlifting 4 plates a side all the time. I see young guys (not loads) in my gym squatting about 3 plates and not bad form and their legs are skinny. Being strong does not set everyone up for amazing muscle growth.

Now if you have great bodybuilding genetics and push your limits and progressively get stronger over years then you are going to look amazing.

Actually all those guys are really f'ing strong Elvia, Since you called out Flex as being "not that strong" I will point out to you that in his prime he was incline benching 405 for reps... Now I don't know what your standards are but I would call that beast ass strong lol ... Flex was a guy that had long limbs and bird like joints and was totally not built for powerlifting either... I really feel that all these guys, whether they are training to be huge or strong have it in them either way ... That's genetics ... I thought of another example.. In the past people bring up Serge Nubret as an example of not having to train heavy ... Because he did all these pumping sets... Well that was when he was in his sixties and seventies... He had already built all the mass that he was capable of... When he was in his twenties and thirties though, he was lifting heavy... I believe he was incline benching 315 for reps during his Olympia competition days... not now, but back then he would have been stronger than 99% of the people in the gym ...

 

[Love_to_Bodybuild]

when you get the time watch this video

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_P0a3wKsiU"]Dorian Yates Seminar in Bromberg - YouTube[/ame]

The man himself is asked do black people have natural talents better suited for bodybuilding? as a general answer yes...

He is later asked about genetics and says it all comes to the mind and goes into detail

 

[TeknoViking]

At 19:00 I LOVE Dorians response. Thanks for sharing the vid.

 

[doug1]

At 19:00 I LOVE Dorians response. Thanks for sharing the vid.

Haha! I agree, that was classic. That's what happens when you have a female who doesn't know anything about bb and is asking questions that were probably given to her beforehand.

 

[NGL34]

If I had to take a stab at it...

insulin sensitivity
androgen receptor sensitivity
strong CNS
More fast twitch versus slow twitch muscles.


myostatin blocking is questionable since if they did have this disorder they'd already be big as fuck before touching a weight.

 

[doug1]

He's got 6 Sandow trophies, I think he should have 7. I think he was better than Lee Haney that last year that Haney won. That's just me looking at pics back then in my Muscle and Fitness magazine.

 

[rippedyearround]

Total number of muscle cells must play a role, too.

I remember reading that actual hyperplasia was a rare thing. Hypertrophy is what happens when you train and take gear. The more cells you have capable of hypertrophy, the bigger you get.

 

[dragonfire101]

Agreed but what I'm more interested in is the guys that are hyper responders to drugs small or large doses it's to my knowledge that mysotatin is just a hormone that limits muscular growth but what's in their body that just makes hyper responders blow up so quickly. Levrone/ ramy

Crazy


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I

Alot of the reason Kevin responds like he does is because he actually COMES OFF STEROIDS

Then he blasts the fuck out of himself w gear gh and SEO

I think it's more than that. He did his first show in 89 and by 91 turned pro with just a few shows. Then one year as pro takes 2nd at Olympia next year in 92. If it was that simple there be many more pros doing this. His genetics are super he has elite genetics of the elite.

 

[dragonfire101]

Did flex wheeler have genetics testing done and posted in musclemag showing his myostatin genes different from most of population.

 

[Gravel]

Now that's interesting to me. Your saying it's been proven that dark skinned folks have more fast twitch fibers than lighter skinned in comparison? That a huge genetic marker for making more muscle. HUGE!!!


CG

.....Olympic weightlifters and powerlifters have much greater fast-twitch muscle-fiber development than bodybuilders; my son is a great example staying around the 3 rep range specifically for explosive strength in the shot put. Typically bodybuilders will train 8-12 reps with 60-90 second rest in between sets while strength athletes stay in the 1-5 rep scheme with 3-5 minute rest periods. Bodybuilders still have larger overall muscle size than powerlifters because we have drastically increased the size of our slow-twitch muscle fibers although our fast twitch muscles lag behind.

For the genetically average bodybuilder it would make sense to incorporate heavy-low rep training to maximize the gains. Now I'm 52 so forget that but if your young train heavy and save the higher reps for when your old and broken....haha

 

[Cito33189]

I


I think it's more than that. He did his first show in 89 and by 91 turned pro with just a few shows. Then one year as pro takes 2nd at Olympia next year in 92. If it was that simple there be many more pros doing this. His genetics are super he has elite genetics of the elite.

ofcourse its more than that. But alot of people look the same with very little changes. If people came off more they would get better results. Kevin obv. is a freak we know. But he also worked w o'reagan back in the day. O' reagan also turned dallas pro, he also got trigilli huge and he works with a guy here who is on his way. O'reagan is no slouch when it comes to gear orals and seo

 

[trainlikeaboss]

Your forgot D



D: Having strong organs that can deal with blasting high dosages of

gear for a long time without getting sick...

This is a huge roll in the genetic part

Even though I don't have a link for that particular subject, I feel like that would be covered in response to AAS.

 

[concreter]

Looking at the major factors of BB, lets say Training, Diet, Recovery, the answer must lie in recovery, right? If someone gains muscle, it's because they recovered. If they gain it fast, it's because they've recovered fast. Muscle doesn't grow unless it's recovered enough prior to new stress.

So then...nervous system recovery or tissue recovery? Both?

My big guess is that nervous system recovery is the most important. Everyone taking drugs, eating and sleeping is recovering faster. But few of us are freaks. Nor are we that unGodly strong that many freaks are.

But what if we could TRULY, fully recover. Fast. We could hit it again. Every time. Train, recover, increase the weights, increase the reps per set.

Look at how strong a lot of the freaks are. That's a superior nervous system and tendon strength. Levrone (and I always think of Troponin too, strong as an ox and massive to go with it.) So, my vote goes to better nervous system recovery in a freak. Probably goes right along with better muscle recovery too.

Most do workout way to often.
Most really don't understand that growth takes place outside the Gym and by training before fully recoverd is stopping any growth in its Tracks.
Plus taxing the livin shit out of your nervous system.
People think I must workout everyday and cant believe it is only 1-3 times A week. Depending on my workweek!

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

Did flex wheeler have genetics testing done and posted in musclemag showing his myostatin genes different from most of population.

Yes but its Victor Conte (and sometimes you have to look at what he says with wariness

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by BALCO Laboratories, Inc.
October 1, 1998

Re: Flex Wheeler

To whom it may concern:

I am writing this letter per the request of Flex Wheeler.

I would first like to briefly provide you with some background information regarding BALCO Laboratories. BALCO has been working with elite Olympic and professional athletes for over fifteen years. BALCO has provided testing and consultation for over 250 NFL players including the entire 1998 Super Bowl Champion Denver Broncos team and the entire Miami Dolphins team. BALCO works with professional athletes in many sports including teenis (Michael Chang, Jim Courier, etc.), hockey, bodybuilding (10 of the 16 1998 Mr. Olympia contestants), track and field, soccer and basketball (Seattle SuperSonics).

BALCO Laboratories has been testing and monitoring Flex on a routine basis during the last year. We have performed tests including blood chemistry (SMAC), complete blood count (CBC), PSA, anabolic hormone levels, genotyping as well as comprehensive testing for nutritional elements. Flex's test results have been compared to twenty-four other professional bodybuilders and overall he has one of the healthiest profiles. Basically, Flex is in excellent health and has demonstrated the discipline necessary to maintain a peak level of conditioning.

Flex was a participant in a study we recently conducted in collaboration with the Department of Human Genetics at the University of Pittsburgh involving 62 men who made unusually large gains in muscle mass in response to strength training (extreme responders). Flex was one of only nine extreme responders that had the very rare "myostatin mutation." Myostatin is the gene that "limits muscle growth." Specifically, Flex had the rarest form of myostatin mutation at the "exon 2" position on the gene. This simply means Flex has a much larger number of muscle fibers compared to the other subjects or the normal population. We believe that these are the very first myostatin mutation findings in humans and the results of this landmark study have already been submitted for publication. Flex was also found to have a very unusual type of the IGF-1 gene. In fact, Flex was the only participant in the study that did not have a "match." All of the other extreme responders had at least three other subjects with a matching IGF-1 gene. Based upon Flex's very unique genetic profile, we plan to expeditiously publish a scientific paper that reveals his complete genotype in specific detail. The publication of his remarkable genetic data should generate an enormous amount of media exposure.

Hope this information will be helpful and please call if I can be of assistance.

Sincerely,

/s/ Victor Conte
Victor Conte
President
BALCO Laboratories, Inc.