Worst side effects of PEDs Dr. Mike

[qbkilla]

For the record I wasn’t beating up on you man. You’ve covered this topic enough that I knew what you were trying to say.

All of us hardcore guys on here and competitors will one day do this as a lifestyle.

I don’t expect anyone to put in the same level that I do to this sport at this point in my life.

You’re here, making an effort and actually train. More than some members can say.

Never had an issue with you. You've definitely helped me out a ton and when you do "get on me" I view it as actual helpful constructive criticism vs. someone who is just angry at the world lol. The knowledge you provide here for free ...in an age where everyone is out to make a buck..is A++ .

 

[Massive G]

I know a few big guys here have 2 weekly leg days and they dedicate one day to quads then hams. I get the scientific rational but I don't think it works well in practice.

I could not imagine doing quads and hams alone on separate days. I always have used a push pull leg schedule since I started, pretty much EOD training with cardio and abs on off days. When i was peak training I would always do legs on Monday, Chest Shoulders Tri's on Wednesday and back biceps and moderate hams and calves on Fridays.
It worked really well as the Hamstings were
already warmed up from the "backside".

 

[qbkilla]

You’re comparing things on extreme ends that are more of a personal choice, and the context is missing for most of the situations above.

What really matters is…

1- Progression. Neither RIR nor high intensity will be effective long term unless you apply the principles of progressive overload. The overall numbers, regardless of the method, must improve.

2- Progressively more food to grow. If you keep calories at maintenance, neither method will do anything but keep your wheels spinning in place.

3- If on PED’s, slowly progressing your dose to see how much you need to match your training and nutrition.


I’ve used bro splits… all the DC splits… Fortitude (very high frequency), splits catered around schedule needs, and splits needed for personal/specific improvement. I’ve trained with DC (was an actual client of Dante), with Scott Stevenson (Fortitude), and on my own.

80-90% of real bodybuilding is the consistency of your food, your judgement calls and decisions about your diet/drugs/training, and your ability to progress in whatever training methods you’ve chosen. Also, factor in staying as injury free as possible.

Some of these debates are just so pointless. It’s a sport about outcomes. Show me the people walking around like total monsters, and I’ll show you what they all have in common… which is what listed above.

How many monsters are on this board? What guys on here can compete at heavy or superheavy, or guys on here (under 6’0”) north of 250lbs at sub 10%?

Most of these debates are being fueled by those who are NOT those people. It’s no coincidence.

Don't disagree with anything you said. I believe all these programs work.. just the way Mike talks about training, it comes off as overcomplicating it. Where DC, jm, Scott, Dorian..even Milos...keep things much simpler and explain their approach in a way that doesn't cause confusion. Essentially I think he appeals to the crowd that are searching to optimize all variables all the time...vs focus on the big rocks and be consistent. The crowd of searching for optimization is not a good place for most to be...and those types will benefit from listening to those that guide them back to the basics... essentially what you mentioned in your post.

 

[qbkilla]

I could not imagine doing quads and hams alone on separate days. I always have used a push pull leg schedule since I started, pretty much EOD training with cardio and abs on off days. When i was peak training I would always do legs on Monday, Chest Shoulders Tri's on Wednesday and back biceps and moderate hams and calves on Fridays.
It worked really well as the Hamstings were
already warmed up from the "backside".

Good points. If you enjoy ppl I can definitely see how you would prefer to have a comprehensive leg day. Or even hit the full lower 2x since you are a vet and know what you can recover from. I'm heavily biased to the bro split so focusing on either hams or quads is easier lol

 

[M@NU]

Correct. I was implying the "frequency/scientific way" of hitting the entire leg 2x a week evenly looks good in paper but doesn't work as well in practice . And cited you and a few others here who do more of a quad focused day and ham focused day (when giving legs 2 days). I believe I asked you a few days ago and you about structuring the 2 leg days so I'm definitely following your advice over the mennos, nippards, and scholfields of the world.

i am training quads one day and hams + adductor the other day. no planned rest days, just as i need. most of the time it comes out to 3x per week or even 3,5x per week. and i go to failure. around 3-4 failure sets for quads and 3 for hams and 2 for adductor per workout.
and i give a shit if i have slight doms.
and my legs are one of my better body parts. go ahead and post your legs and ill post mine.
you are trying way to hard to find the optimal split that the cortisol you release while doing so hinders your progress

 

[Alzadosghost]

This guy annoys the fuck outta me and says some really retarded shit. just his tone alone makes me want to slap him. There a lot more to bodybuilding than unproven nerd science. He makes things much more complicated than they really are. I think he likes hearing himself talk.

 

[SouthernMuscle]

This guy annoys the fuck outta me and says some really retarded shit. just his tone alone makes me want to slap him. There a lot more to bodybuilding than unproven nerd science. He makes things much more complicated than they really are. I think he likes hearing himself talk.

 

[Big Dave Smith]

Don't disagree with anything you said. I believe all these programs work.. just the way Mike talks about training, it comes off as overcomplicating it. Where DC, jm, Scott, Dorian..even Milos...keep things much simpler and explain their approach in a way that doesn't cause confusion. Essentially I think he appeals to the crowd that are searching to optimize all variables all the time...vs focus on the big rocks and be consistent. The crowd of searching for optimization is not a good place for most to be...and those types will benefit from listening to those that guide them back to the basics... essentially what you mentioned in your post.

Full transparency… I’m friends with Dante, Scott, Mike Israetel, and Charly (not mentioned in this thread, but he is closely tied to Mike, even though they are no longer in business together). I’ll be as honest as I can be.

Have you ever heard Scott’s long winded podcasts? He nuances the nuances and almost never gives a straight answer. He makes you think, but I love it. Most people can’t tolerate it because they get so lost. I have to translate a lot of stuff he says for my friends who can’t bother to sit through it.

Mike? Same, but he does give more direct info. I love the quality of his content, but he’s VERY arrogant, and I just wish he’d be more honest in his personal short comings and take advice from others like we all have.

Dorian? I would never take advice from him. He’s so simple that he comes off as ignorant… and his training advice is hot garbage… sometimes just factually incorrect. He personally accomplished a lot, but if he gave a free training seminar at my local gym, I would not go. I’d smoke a joint with him and pet his dog, but probably never listen to him about back training.

Bodybuilding content is like porn. We don’t all click on the same genre, and some genre’s may turn us off.

I like the overly nuanced content of Scott, Mike, Vigorous Steve, Paul Barnett, Kurt Havens, Todd Lee.. If you don’t explain the “why” well enough, I just won’t listen. Other people may not care about the “why” at all.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

[Massive G]

Good points. If you enjoy ppl I can definitely see how you would prefer to have a comprehensive leg day. Or even hit the full lower 2x since you are a vet and know what you can recover from. I'm heavily biased to the bro split so focusing on either hams or quads is easier lol

I have been training for 30 years my training has evolved on the way up and on the way down. On a full leg day back in my peak years it was heavy ass free front and back squats as a base. Ball busting sets I couldn't sleep well the night before legs knowing the path ahead. Most of the time the hamstring workouts took a back seat to quads. In my later years I tried doing hams first and my quads suffered. I see a lot of pros do it that way now but they are very advanced and training evolved as well. I never did all the warm up stuff many do now like inner outer thighs or pre exhaust with leg extensions.

4 minutes of HIT on elliptical and everything pumped and warmed up. Then I would get down on the floor and stretch back hips hams et all. Go right into squats and pyramid up 6 to 10 sets.

You have been on here since 2009 so how has your training evolved. I still learn something new every week I train nothing major but a tweak here and a tweak there.

This board is full of a lot of experience as well as it is information overload on social media influences et all. I never debate or copy programs just read learn and ask if I cannot find the information out there.

I just recently asked Danieltx his dosing for igf 1 l3 because when I see someone make astounding gains on something diet or otherwise I will ask. Not because I will copy it but it is better to chat with a real world person with experience than to rely on AI or some random FAQ on a research website.

 

[danieltx]

Dorian? I would never take advice from him. He’s so simple that he comes off as ignorant… and his training advice is hot garbage… sometimes just factually incorrect. He personally accomplished a lot, but if he gave a free training seminar at my local gym, I would not go. I’d smoke a joint with him and pet his dog, but probably never listen to him about back training.

One of the best lines we've had on here in a long time!

 

[Dutch1909]

Personally I don’t like listening to Mike. He comes across like his method is the best and the only one you should do. Also if you have so many mental issues, please stay off gear and get help. It’s absolutely not normal to have those thoughts. This is exactly what 99% of the people think about bodybuilders. Mike has a very big online audience and he confirms the stereotype bodybuilder with all his mental issues which are amplified because of the drug use.

Also if I look as his physique, it doesn’t match with all the science talk and gear use. No offense, but he doesn’t look anything special to me. He’s not huge and I guess he’s doesn’t have the best genetics to tag along in this game.

Going on the science based training methods. Sure, a lot of knowledge has been put out there the last 2 decades and a lot of research has been done, but that doesn’t mean what’s superior on paper is also superior in practice. That 5% more stimulus on paper doesn’t mean fuck all in practice. Bottom line is, oldschool vs newschool it doesn’t matter. Try different things, see how YOU feel and what works for YOU and stick to it. In this whole process, don’t forget to have fun and enjoy it as well. That 5% more gain on paper will bring you nothing if you don’t like it. That -5% will bring you more on real life if you actually enjoy it.

 

[Samson250]

I’d smoke a joint with him and pet his dog, but probably never listen to him about back training.

… Hahaha!

 

[totalrecomp]

What do you think about his diet? Too much junk and inflammatory foods imo

Well two weeks out is not the time to be eating protein cheese balls, I don't care what the fuckin macros state. Any other time, fine have your protein "snack" but two weeks out chasing a PRO CARD? FFS.

 

[Hyperemia]

What do you think about his diet? Too much junk and inflammatory foods imo

I just happened to see the bit on his Adderral use. I don’t watch a ton of his videos outside of the exercise science stuff and what I really enjoy about those is that they’re almost always confirming our “bro science”. I also like studies and he brings a ton of them to light that I wouldn’t have otherwise seen. I don’t think I’ve seen any of his personal diet stuff and didn’t follow his prep but seeing as he didn’t come in ready, I’d say he probably needs to reevaluate that part of his prep. Saying all that, I think he’s built a physique to be proud of, especially if you’ve seen how he looked when younger, but it’s not pro caliber.

 

[madg]

I not watch his vids

But

This if it fit your macros is bullshit

He looked 6 weeks out , flat , thick skin holding water and no upper body at all at his show

 

[juggy38]

I’m one of the few, like Mike….(maybe)….thet trenbolone ABSOLUTELY turns me into a headcase. Sociopathic, suicidal thoughts, extreme mood swings….at 200mg…..I can barely keep my shit together

And yes, I have struggled with mental health, addiction, etc.

Was it the concussions? Was it the loss of a child and the drug use after?

Who knows. I can run test/eq/mast/primo, orals….as long as E2 is steady, I’m the same easy going goofball. Add tren….and all hell breaks loose.

Why? Who the hell knows.

Also touching on training…..you can hit legs 1x 2x3x a week and make progress. As long as you recover between sessions and progress training stress, food and milligrams


There’s no magical “math problem” to solve. 1,3,5,7,11 sets per season 1,2,3 x a week. It’s adding plates and reps over a long time,

 

[Dutch1909]

I’m one of the few, like Mike….(maybe)….thet trenbolone ABSOLUTELY turns me into a headcase. Sociopathic, suicidal thoughts, extreme mood swings….at 200mg…..I can barely keep my shit together

And yes, I have struggled with mental health, addiction, etc.

Was it the concussions? Was it the loss of a child and the drug use after?

Who knows. I can run test/eq/mast/primo, orals….as long as E2 is steady, I’m the same easy going goofball. Add tren….and all hell breaks loose.

Why? Who the hell knows.

Also touching on training…..you can hit legs 1x 2x3x a week and make progress. As long as you recover between sessions and progress training stress, food and milligrams


There’s no magical “math problem” to solve. 1,3,5,7,11 sets per season 1,2,3 x a week. It’s adding plates and reps over a long time,

So the logical thing you do, and I guess you do this, is not take tren if it affects you so much.

 

[Massive G]

Personally I don’t like listening to Mike. He comes across like his method is the best and the only one you should do.

I think the video helps explain his arrogance. Not really a fan of those videos where he criticizes other influencers training like Sam et al.
He reminds me of Mike Mentzer who always stood on his heavy duty pedestal and told everyone they were wrong about volume training when he clearly built his physique using those methods.

Also if you have so many mental issues, please stay off gear and get help. It’s absolutely not normal to have those thoughts. This is exactly what 99% of the people think about bodybuilders. Mike has a very big online audience and he confirms the stereotype bodybuilder with all his mental issues which are amplified because of the drug use.

Also if I look as his physique, it doesn’t match with all the science talk and gear use. No offense, but he doesn’t look anything special to me. He’s not huge and I guess he’s doesn’t have the best genetics to tag along in this game.

Going on the science based training methods. Sure, a lot of knowledge has been put out there the last 2 decades and a lot of research has been done, but that doesn’t mean what’s superior on paper is also superior in practice. That 5% more stimulus on paper doesn’t mean fuck all in practice. Bottom line is, oldschool vs newschool it doesn’t matter. Try different things, see how YOU feel and what works for YOU and stick to it. In this whole process, don’t forget to have fun and enjoy it as well. That 5% more gain on paper will bring you nothing if you don’t like it. That -5% will bring you more on real life if you actually enjoy it.

Great post. ^^
I didn't watch the whole video as I clicked off after his nipple ring rant.
He apparently takes a lot of shit and recognizing what negative sides the abuse is doing but continues to follow the same path.

 

[Hatchet]

"Dr. Mike"

A true douche-canoe...

 

[astrosfan123]

i just popped in to say mike is a clown and so is the RIR cult he created