For Those on TRT

[massnup]

Can tren not be injected twice per week like cyp or enan?

 

[gordo14]

Depends..........

Can tren not be injected twice per week like cyp or enan?

on the ester. Tren e, or tren a.

 

[gordo14]

Thanks...........

I am far for a expert on this but I would say daily injections would be best.

What about in theory............If i inject(all numbers here after are just conjured up)150mgs of test monday evening and by tuesday/wednsday i have peaked at 1000 and started to decline, then by friday afternoon when time to inject again i am at 600. Then that brings me back up to 1000.
That was 300mg of test per week. In theory would it be possible to cut that dose in half and do every other day shots, and still keep the levels stable at around the same level, meaning using less to maintain the highest level and most stable levels possible.

Would results, and or gains be better? I'm just asking uneducated questions so feel free to tell me i'm dumb. I am still learning.

 

[machola]

So air would be getting into barrell before you are injecting IM correct.

Not trying to be a dick here and just want to learn the difference apart from voloum the ammount of air that would be used taking the plunger out of slin pin as with changeing pins and injecting IM.

Would we also not cause infection swiching pins when injecting IM.

air is not going to hurt anything. we inject 1cc of air into our vial before we pull 1cc of solution...

here's why one is ok and the other is not.
IM needle change (this is a common practice in healthcare)
-draw up solution
-twist off needle
-open end of package of replacement needle so only the hub is sticking out and screw onto syringe
the sterility of the contents of syringe is never compromised

taking plunger out of an insulin syringe(this is not allowed in healthcare)
-draw up solution in im syringe
-cap it
-put it down
-take plunger out of insulin syringe
what do you do with the plunger? what do you do with insulin syringe? i don't know how this would work. assuming you somehow found a way to keep them both sterile and keep insulin syringe steady i'll go on...
-pick up im syringe
-uncap
-stick needle in insulin syringe
-inject solution
-put plunger in in insulin syringe

that is just scary. in health care we would never cut that corner. its not safe. its not worth it. its not allowed. never sacrifice time for safety...

 

[Big Bapper]

air is not going to hurt anything. we inject 1cc of air into our vial before we pull 1cc of solution...

here's why one is ok and the other is not.
IM needle change (this is a common practice in healthcare)
-draw up solution
-twist off needle
-open end of package of replacement needle so only the hub is sticking out and screw onto syringe
the sterility of the contents of syringe is never compromised

taking plunger out of an insulin syringe(this is not allowed in healthcare)
-draw up solution in im syringe
-cap it
-put it down
-take plunger out of insulin syringe
what do you do with the plunger? what do you do with insulin syringe? i don't know how this would work. assuming you somehow found a way to keep them both sterile and keep insulin syringe steady i'll go on...
-pick up im syringe
-uncap
-stick needle in insulin syringe
-inject solution
-put plunger in in insulin syringe

that is just scary. in health care we would never cut that corner. its not safe. its not worth it. its not allowed. never sacrifice time for safety...

So if air is not going to effect anything why did you say it would cause an infection if you pull the plunger out of a slin pin. That is why I was asking you these questions because I cound not understand how air could cause a infection and thought you might of known something we all dont.

So your answer is yes it is fine to take the plunger out of slin pin because air wont harm anything. But health care says its not OK. I just wanted to get that clear.

 

[Big Bapper]

What about in theory............If i inject(all numbers here after are just conjured up)150mgs of test monday evening and by tuesday/wednsday i have peaked at 1000 and started to decline, then by friday afternoon when time to inject again i am at 600. Then that brings me back up to 1000.
That was 300mg of test per week. In theory would it be possible to cut that dose in half and do every other day shots, and still keep the levels stable at around the same level, meaning using less to maintain the highest level and most stable levels possible.

Would results, and or gains be better? I'm just asking uneducated questions so feel free to tell me i'm dumb. I am still learning.

I would honestly not know. Why would I call you dump for asking a question. This is professionalmuscle were everyone helps each other out. We leave all the other crap to GitBig and bodybuilding.com its what make this place different. Can you talk us trough what you do because there is parts were its unclear what you are talking about so if you could explain it would make a good contribuition to this thread and I with hand on heart will say if anyone calls you dumb without good reason I will ban them. Stick around bro its a good place, with lots of good members anyone insults you just send me a pm and I will look into it for you. Enjoy the board its what its here for.

 

[machola]

So if air is not going to effect anything why did you say it would cause an infection if you pull the plunger out of a slin pin. That is why I was asking you these questions because I cound not understand how air could cause a infection and thought you might of known something we all dont.

So your answer is yes it is fine to take the plunger out of slin pin because air wont harm anything

the air isn't a problem but where are they going to put the plunger while its out of the syringe? i'd imagine they need one hand to hold the insulin syringe and one hand to uncap and inject the im syringe.

edit: technically i can't say it is never safe. it could be done safe. the extra steps and extra supplies needed increases risk. i wouldn't feel comfortable doing it.

 

[Big Bapper]

air is not going to hurt anything. we inject 1cc of air into our vial before we pull 1cc of solution...

here's why one is ok and the other is not.
IM needle change (this is a common practice in healthcare)
-draw up solution
-twist off needle
-open end of package of replacement needle so only the hub is sticking out and screw onto syringe
the sterility of the contents of syringe is never compromised

taking plunger out of an insulin syringe(this is not allowed in healthcare)
-draw up solution in im syringe
-cap it
-put it down
-take plunger out of insulin syringe
what do you do with the plunger? what do you do with insulin syringe? i don't know how this would work. assuming you somehow found a way to keep them both sterile and keep insulin syringe steady i'll go on...
-pick up im syringe
-uncap
-stick needle in insulin syringe
-inject solution
-put plunger in in insulin syringe

that is just scary. in health care we would never cut that corner. its not safe. its not worth it. its not allowed. never sacrifice time for safety...

I am sorry for coming back to this but I have had a few bad experences with health care. I think the only scary thing here is that there is people like you in health care. The way you have spoke to some members in this thread is a joke. Then tell members air will increse risk of infection but its OK to inject air ito a vial and say air wont harm a thing and in the same post you say its not worth it" never sacrifice time for safety". So Mr. health care what is the truth here does air increse risk of infection if we take the plunger out of a slin pin ??

How much more is the risk than with IM injection ??

One last thing why if you are in health care would you be injecting air into vials when knowing it could increse risk of infection.
But thats right I forgot air wont harm a thing, its one or the other pal and I want a answer.

I have taken a plunger out of a slin pin many times and really would like to know if I could be causeing myself harm thats why I why I asked you about this and 3 days later I am still none the wiser. I would not ike to be treated by you if I had any problems. Does air increse risk of infection yes or no ?? simple.

 

[machola]

Does air increse risk of infection yes or no ?? simple.

no. and i apologize if i was rude to you or any members.

 

[Big Bapper]

the air isn't a problem but where are they going to put the plunger while its out of the syringe? i'd imagine they need one hand to hold the insulin syringe and one hand to uncap and inject the im syringe.

edit: technically i can't say it is never safe. it could be done safe. the extra steps and extra supplies needed increases risk. i wouldn't feel comfortable doing it.

Thank you.

This is professionalmuscle not GetBig guys. We are the number one board because we are mostly made up of top aumatur and professional bodybuilders. Please try to learn from these guys and not try to get one up on each other just like this knuckle head is still trying to do even after addmiting he is wrong and this guys in health care. Just remember that your next visit to hospitial.

Learn from these guys, they are all very helpfull but some refuse to post and just lurk to avoid situitions just like this. Respectfully learn then you can pass on what you learn to the new guys. Its the way it always has worked and Big Bapper says if its ait broke why fix it. If you guys only knew what you had access to, everything is here. But how can people help if they are exposed to this crap. My advice if you dont know what you are talking about and are going to twist things at all costs to prove you are correct dont bother posting or at least hold your hands up if you are in the wrong so in years to come new members can use the search button and get true real world bodybuilding information and that is not usually backed up by a research paper BTW.

 

[Big Bapper]

no. and i apologize if i was rude to you or any members.

Well I apologize for calling you a knuckle head, there must be somthing in there. Now can we all please be respectfull to each other and keep this board for what its known. People helping each other not getting one up on each other to prove you are they are correct. I love this board to much to let that happen.

 

[SpankyDXM]

I know this is an OLD thread but more info never hurts

WARNING ____________________________________________
SC injections can cause Cellulitis. Especially if injected straight into fat tissue.

 

[e6er]

I just got off of TRT within the past few weeks. People say TRT is for life, well it isn't if your doc diagnosed you incorrectly.

I had a few harsh cycles, crashed really bad and my Doc did a blood test for my test levels that came back at a 238. My doc went straight for the Androgel, but with no HCG. After a couple years of use, and finally realizing that I was badly atrophied and my test levels crashed again I went to another Doc that specializes in Hormone Treatment.

After concerns that I would be sterile, he asked me to try one more thing before I went on inj test. He gave me 2 months of HCG 20,000 iu's. 250 iu's dosed every 3rd day.

Did my baseline test check after one month off of andro - 268
After 4 weeks we checked my test again with the HCG protocol, it was at 1000.
after 8 weeks he had me quit the HCG for 3 additional weeks and then ran my test levels again.
This time I was at a 810

So far so good, HCG protocol worked well in my case and happy to be off of TRT.

 

[bpcsatx]

Androgel

After concerns that I would be sterile, he asked me to try one more thing before I went on inj test. He gave me 2 months of HCG 20,000 iu's. 250 iu's dosed every 3rd day.

Did my baseline test check after one month off of andro - 268
After 4 weeks we checked my test again with the HCG protocol, it was at 1000.
after 8 weeks he had me quit the HCG for 3 additional weeks and then ran my test levels again.
This time I was at a 810

So far so good, HCG protocol worked well in my case and happy to be off of TRT.
Yesterday 06:40 PM

What were your levels when you applied the Androgel? I have been on Andro for almost 8 months now and my last level of Total T was @ 500.

How did the HCG ramp you levels back into the 810 range?

 

[machola]

I know this is an OLD thread but more info never hurts

WARNING ____________________________________________
SC injections can cause Cellulitis. Especially if injected straight into fat tissue.

It hurts if its wrong information.

Saudi Med J. 2006 Dec;27(12):1843-6.
Subcutaneous administration of testosterone. A pilot study report.

Al-Futaisi AM, Al-Zakwani IS, Almahrezi AM, Morris D.

Department of Medicine, College of Medicine & Health Sciences, Sultan Qaboos University, Muscat, Oman. [email protected]

OBJECTIVE: To investigate the effect of low doses of subcutaneous testosterone in hypogonadal men since the intramuscular route, which is the most widely used form of testosterone replacement therapy, is inconvenient to many patients. METHODS: All men with primary and secondary hypogonadism attending the reproductive endocrine clinic at Royal Victoria Hospital, Monteral, Quebec, Canada, were invited to participate in the study. Subjects were enrolled from January 2002 till December 2002. Patients were asked to self-administer weekly low doses of testosterone enanthate using 0.5 ml insulin syringe. RESULTS: A total of 22 patients were enrolled in the study. The mean trough was 14.48 +/- 3.14 nmol/L and peak total testosterone was 21.65 +/- 7.32 nmol/L. For the free testosterone the average trough was 59.94 +/- 20.60 pmol/L and the peak was 85.17 +/- 32.88 pmol/L. All of the patients delivered testosterone with ease and no local reactions were reported. CONCLUSION: Therapy with weekly subcutaneous testosterone produced serum levels that were within the normal range in 100% of patients for both peak and trough levels. This is the first report, which demonstrated the efficacy of delivering weekly testosterone using this cheap, safe, and less painful subcutaneous route.

 

[gelatine]

e6er, after 2 years of TRT, your HPTA should have been completely shut down with LH production at pretty much zero. You said you were atrophied, so this makes sense.

HCG should have directly stimulated your testicles, but it would have been slightly suppressive on your LH, wouldn't it? How could your pituitary just decide to pick up and go even though its function was being supplanted by the HCG?

I'm glad it worked for you, but it doesn't make a damn bit of sense to me. Maybe someone can show me where I'm going wrong.

 

[repmks]

It hurts if its wrong information.

Done SC plenty of times for oils. works fine.

 

[bpcsatx]

SC Test Injections

e6er, after 2 years of TRT, your HPTA should have been completely shut down with LH production at pretty much zero. You said you were atrophied, so this makes sense.

HCG should have directly stimulated your testicles, but it would have been slightly suppressive on your LH, wouldn't it? How could your pituitary just decide to pick up and go even though its function was being supplanted by the HCG?

I'm glad it worked for you, but it doesn't make a damn bit of sense to me. Maybe someone can show me where I'm going wrong.
Today 12:55 AM

I am also curious how you could run your Test levels back up to the 800 range and what was the actual Free Test to overall Test using HCG alone. It would indicate that the HCG fired up the Testicles to start producing at puberty levels which seems unlikely if he was in a state of atrophy. Maybe I am misunderstanding e6er's post.

On another note it would be interesting to post a poll on how many people have actually tried SC injects of Test and their feelings regarding efficacy or any other sides or safety issues.

 

[e6er]

What were your levels when you applied the Androgel? I have been on Andro for almost 8 months now and my last level of Total T was @ 500.

How did the HCG ramp you levels back into the 810 range?

My doc prescribed Andro and never had me do any follow ups on blood tests, it wasn't until I started experiencing the same low test symptoms (2 years later) I went to another doc that specialized in treating my disorder which I was lucky enough to be covered by insurance. When he tested me while I was on Andro I was in the low 300 range.

The goal is to get my body to produce testosterone on it's own by using low frequent doses of HCG for a month or two and hopefully after stopping my body continues to produce testosterone on it's own without HCG or AS.


There are a few articles on this subject, and I don't think it's very popular as of yet and it's not to be meant for running long-term. I feel a good portion of BB'ers that are on TRT might benefit from HCG monotherapy. I am learning as I go along here, so I am not 100% confident in explaining how it works but I know when I mentioned it to my doc he had no problem trying it. He had one other guy try the same thing and it worked for him as well.

I don't expect my test level to remain in the 800's, I think I may dip down after a couple more weeks of non use.

**broken link removed**

T-Nation.com | Interesting HCG Study - Page 1

 

[e6er]

I am also curious how you could run your Test levels back up to the 800 range and what was the actual Free Test to overall Test using HCG alone. It would indicate that the HCG fired up the Testicles to start producing at puberty levels which seems unlikely if he was in a state of atrophy. Maybe I am misunderstanding e6er's post.

On another note it would be interesting to post a poll on how many people have actually tried SC injects of Test and their feelings regarding efficacy or any other sides or safety issues.

I didn't get copies of my blood work but I have to go back in 2 weeks to see the results of my past blood test so when I get everything back I will make sure to post it.