• All new members please introduce your self here and welcome to the board:
    http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?t=259
Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
M4B Store Banner
ddd
Riptropin Store banner
Generation X Bodybuilding Forum
Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
Mysupps Store Banner
IP Gear Store Banner
Anabolic Hormones Store Banner
Ganabol Store Banner
Spend $100 and get bonus needles free at sterile syringes
Professional Muscle Store open now
LandmarkChem Email Banner
Medtech Store Banner
Bruce Labs Store banner
qtropin
Professional Muscle Store open now
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store

is it bad to ask this

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
hey guys

when a 150 pound natural trainee starts
1. eating 400 grams of protien + 400grams of carbs +100grams of fats
2 Trains with progressively heavier wts.

After 3 years of immense consistencency he plateaus at 180 pounds,
increasing his diet from 400 grams to 600 grams or carbs from 400 to 800.... will not be a good idea, as it would lead to more fat gains........this is the point where he needs to increase the efficiency of his already excellent diet.

now with the same diet he does a 500mg test for 10 week cycle... he gains 20 pounds....

now he is 200pounds.

my point here is that one should not over expect from an already excellent diet.

now the same 200 pounder comes to the forums with an ultimate goal of becoming 250pounds asks for advice about drug cycle.
he unnecerarrily has to bear with the comments like "hey" noob .... its all in the diet... diet this diet that....

but the poor guy is looking for a drug cycle system he can use on a yearly basis for say 4 years
-which is safe
-lesser need to increase the dosage.

trevor smith made a great point of doing 8 weeks on and 4 weeks off type of cycles for year long basis.
and with this kind of cycling he may need to increase the dose every 4th cycle.

year 1
week 1 to 6 500mg teste + A.I + HCG
7 to 8 500mg testp
9 to 12 clomid therapy

repeats 4 such cycles in year

year 2 week 1 to 6 750mg teste + A.I + HCG
7 to 8 500mg testp
9 to 12 clomid therapy

epeats 4 such cycles in year

year 3 1 to 6 750mg teste +some anabolic + A.I + HCG
7 to 8 500mg testp
9 to 12 clomid therapy

repeats 4 such cycles in year

year 4 1 to 6 1000mg teste +some anabolic + A.I + HCG
7 to 8 500mg testp
9 to 12 clomid therapy.

repeats 4 such cycles in year

year 5 1 to 6 1250mg teste +some anabolic + A.I + HCG
7 to 8 500mg testp
9 to 12 clomid therapy.

repeats 4 such cycles in year


and during these 5 years the same guy ate 500 grams of protien + 500grmas of carbs and 100grams of fats.... and is now 250 pound mass monster..

what is wrong with this blue print of the cycle design...
i think the guy is making the full use of the dose before increasing it.
thank you



PS this is just a hypothical case secanrio.... where a person can be on most the time and the same time the need of upping the dose is minimized as much as possible.
 
Last edited:

sinfulimages

New member
Registered
Joined
Apr 28, 2010
Messages
382
Diet and nutrition plays a huge role if he plateaued at 180 then his diet needs to be tweaked so that he can start growing again.

As for the cycle time on should be time off and if this person is young he doesnt really need it.
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
what kind of dietary modifiactions wud you make
when the guy was eating 400mg protien , 400grams carbs, and 100grams of healthy fats...and grown from 150 to 180 pounds....and has now plateaued on 180...... the problem with upping his calories wud only lead to fat gains..... or if you think you put him on keto diet and then... restart the whole process...


nothing much will be achieved...... this is the point of introduction of AAS, where we will increase the efficiency of the diet through hormonal manupilation.
 
Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
515
Dude... what is with you and your page-long, drawn out, extremely over-complicated, mind-numbing posts and questions?!?
I remember you from another thread a few monthes ago, only because you had the same huge page long mumbo jumbo crap and no one would even answer you because it was so ridicules!
 

sinfulimages

New member
Registered
Joined
Apr 28, 2010
Messages
382
what kind of dietary modifiactions wud you make
when the guy was eating 400mg protien , 400grams carbs, and 100grams of healthy fats...and grown from 150 to 180 pounds....and has now plateaued on 180...... the problem with upping his calories wud only lead to fat gains..... or if you think you put him on keto diet and then... restart the whole process...


nothing much will be achieved...... this is the point of introduction of AAS, where we will increase the efficiency of the diet through hormonal manupilation.
If you think drugs are the answer and not food then you need to spend a lot more time searching this board.

Do you honestly think that Jay or Kai or Ronnie could maintain their size or continue to grow eating less and drugging more. Food is the most anabolic thing you can put in your body.
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
in my opinion we as bodybuilders with excellent diet and Hormones are trying to achieve "progressive oveload"

and its this progressive overload that hold the key to the trasure of huge mucle gains......

"SO OVERALL WE ARE RUNNING AFTER PROGRSSIVE OVERLOAD".

SOME PROPERTIES OF PROGRSSIVE OVERLOAD WHEN COUPLED WITH
EXCELLENT DIET + HORMONES is that it only stays for sometime.... for some it may be 6 week or 8 weeks.......

now at this point you try to push further in terms of progressive overload.... the dangerous part of the equation ie increased levels of hormones have to be increased..... that point is the danger zone.

how can we safely attain consistent muscle gains.... the point where we can no more run after progressive overload and not entering the danger zone.

we need to step back for some time....for 4 weeks of pct and 1 week here and there and then again you can go full throttle for the progressive overload.

after some point every forth cycle we`ll have to up the dose a bit...as our body will get to used to the toys its being playing with... that would be the time to increase the dosages after a whole year of playing with 500mg by (250mg)....
 
Last edited:

jay_dub

Featured Member / Kilo Klub
Featured Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
2,267
I understand where your questions stem from, I actually enjoy most of your threads. But it seems like you're still confused about the same exact stuff you've been confused about for a long time now, though. You're making it waaayyy too difficult here.

Everything you're asking about is covered in Big A's article 'Growth Principles for Beginners'. If your sole goal is to gain as much mass as possible I think these basics will cover it all

-increase protein intake and do things like morning cardio to increase appetite to help increase overall calorie intake
-I highly recommend hiring someone to do your diet, tons of awesome guys here
-use a system like DC training where every week you're number one focus is to beat your numbers from the previous week (Big A's routine is great as well)
-Get as much rest as possible
-Take gear and increase dosage when it becomes ineffective

Time on = time off is bullshit if you ask me. For some of us it just is not the way to go. I got sick of yo yoing up and down, and my overall progress was hurt as well. I now prefer long cycles with short breaks.

I'm just a young guy and a nobody in this sport trying to get as big as possible, so my opinion means absolutely nothing. But if I had to sum up what I've learned from this awesome website and try to simplify it as much as possible, it'd be the above. And in my limited experience, it has been working great for me.
 

Benjifornothing

New member
Registered
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
98
If you think drugs are the answer and not food then you need to spend a lot more time searching this board.

Do you honestly think that Jay or Kai or Ronnie could maintain their size or continue to grow eating less and drugging more. Food is the most anabolic thing you can put in your body.
^^^^^this!!! i get so sick of the random guys that openly ask you in public places "hey what are you cycling? how do i get big like you?" and they look dumbfounded and almost insulted when they get a response like "..........lots of red meat, chx, potatoes and rice man. oh, and go to bed a resonable time."
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
If you think drugs are the answer and not food then you need to spend a lot more time searching this board.

Do you honestly think that Jay or Kai or Ronnie could maintain their size or continue to grow eating less and drugging more. Food is the most anabolic thing you can put in your body.
what is an excellent diet
lets say for a 200lbs man who wants to grow 250 in the next 4 years
so for this year his goal is 220 lbs

so his macros
protien = 2 x target bodywt in lbs = 440 grams
carbs = same as protien = 440 grams
fats = 0.5 x target body wt in lbs = 110 grams

now this is a diet that could get a 210 pounder to 220 pounds, leave alone our 200lbs guy.

when this 200lbs guy does a 8 week cycle of 500mg test and gains upto 215....in those 8 weeks.
you know the reaseon his excellent diet is not working.....because body resists the change it will up regulate all its muscle plateauing factors(cortisol. SHBG levels, our new FAV myostain CNS oversaturation).......

now suppose the same guy stops his cycle does his PCT for 4 to 5 weeks(still eating the same food to mentain the muscle)

now this 215 guy again on the same excellent diet ie
protien = 2 x target bodywt in lbs = 440 grams
carbs = same as protien = 440 grams
fats = 0.5 x target body wt in lbs = 110 grams

will start gaining again....


AAS are needed to increase the efficiency of the dietary protien
 

sinfulimages

New member
Registered
Joined
Apr 28, 2010
Messages
382
what is an excellent diet
lets say for a 200lbs man who wants to grow 250 in the next 4 years
so for this year his goal is 220 lbs

so his macros
protien = 2 x target bodywt in lbs = 440 grams
carbs = same as protien = 440 grams
fats = 0.5 x target body wt in lbs = 110 grams

now this is a diet that could get a 210 pounder to 220 pounds, leave alone our 200lbs guy.

when this 200lbs guy does a 8 week cycle of 500mg test and gains upto 215....in those 8 weeks.
you know the reaseon his excellent diet is not working.....because body resists the change it will up regulate all its muscle plateauing factors(cortisol. SHBG levels, our new FAV myostain CNS oversaturation).......

now suppose the same guy stops his cycle does his PCT for 4 to 5 weeks(still eating the same food to mentain the muscle)

now this 215 guy again on the same excellent diet ie
protien = 2 x target bodywt in lbs = 440 grams
carbs = same as protien = 440 grams
fats = 0.5 x target body wt in lbs = 110 grams

will start gaining again....


AAS are needed to increase the efficiency of the dietary protien
Everyones caloric needs are different. I will say this When said guy doses and does not change his diet. Then comes off what do you think will happen to the weight he added? He will piss it away. If he is lucky he will had a couple pounds.

All I am saying you can run whatever you want but if you dont feed your body all you are going to get is some water weight and acne. I am not going to keep replying to this thread because you clearly only want to hear about drugs. Getting big isnt just about gear.
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
my point is not to overexpect from any one particular thing.

1. drugs:- the wont to do a thing unless there is an excellent diet waiting for them

2. Diet;- a person on best of AN EXCELLENT DIET UNABLE TO PRODUCE RESULTS only because he needs to increase the efficiency of the diet through hormonal manipulation
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
Everyones caloric needs are different. I will say this When said guy doses and does not change his diet. Then comes off what do you think will happen to the weight he added? He will piss it away. If he is lucky he will had a couple pounds.

All I am saying you can run whatever you want but if you dont feed your body all you are going to get is some water weight and acne. I am not going to keep replying to this thread because you clearly only want to hear about drugs. Getting big isnt just about gear.
i want to hear about a Drug cycle System
which promises muscle gains safely....ie the need to increase the dosage is minimized as much as possible with excellent diet and progressive training
 
Last edited:

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
excellent diet= best macros to that particular person and at right amounts... for the sake of arguement.
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
it happens guys some one would read a prodrug cycle and then he starts thinking....its drugs it all about drus and all....

then some one would read about 10 articles on kai greenes 700 gram protien diet or victor richards 30000cal diet then its all about diet this diet that......same goes with all these training systems......

its not about following one philosophy or other philosophy......its about creating a 250lbs mass monter.

what would be your 8 year blue print for the guy.
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
Dude... what is with you and your page-long, drawn out, extremely over-complicated, mind-numbing posts and questions?!?
I remember you from another thread a few monthes ago, only because you had the same huge page long mumbo jumbo crap and no one would even answer you because it was so ridicules!
hey man please forgive me for the last time... please please....i wont do this ever again
 

dr intensity

New member
Registered
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
593
I understand where your questions stem from, I actually enjoy most of your threads. But it seems like you're still confused about the same exact stuff you've been confused about for a long time now, though. You're making it waaayyy too difficult here.

Everything you're asking about is covered in Big A's article 'Growth Principles for Beginners'. If your sole goal is to gain as much mass as possible I think these basics will cover it all

-increase protein intake and do things like morning cardio to increase appetite to help increase overall calorie intake
-I highly recommend hiring someone to do your diet, tons of awesome guys here
-use a system like DC training where every week you're number one focus is to beat your numbers from the previous week (Big A's routine is great as well)
-Get as much rest as possible
-Take gear and increase dosage when it becomes ineffective

Time on = time off is bullshit if you ask me. For some of us it just is not the way to go. I got sick of yo yoing up and down, and my overall progress was hurt as well. I now prefer long cycles with short breaks.

I'm just a young guy and a nobody in this sport trying to get as big as possible, so my opinion means absolutely nothing. But if I had to sum up what I've learned from this awesome website and try to simplify it as much as possible, it'd be the above. And in my limited experience, it has been working great for me.
welll said ..thanks bro...but look into the other que
 

jay_dub

Featured Member / Kilo Klub
Featured Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
2,267
i want to hear about a Drug cycle System
which promises muscle gains safely....ie the need to increase the dosage is minimized as much as possible with excellent diet and progressive training
excellent diet= best macros to that particular person and at right amounts... for the sake of arguement.
This in itself is enough to be reason to rarely have to increase dosage...
 

jay_dub

Featured Member / Kilo Klub
Featured Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
2,267
As rarely as possible I should say.. It will still need to be done obviously.
 

SizeMeUp

New member
Registered
Joined
Dec 3, 2009
Messages
73
This is an interesting thread--but here is the point: It isn't about drugs. It IS about food. I'll dig up this study I have.....I'll upload it. I've got it filed away somewhere because it absolutely amazed me at how simple building muscle is.

In a nutshell, the study took a bodybuilder, a powerlifter, and a Sumo Wrestler. Their body compositions were taken, and their LBM was established. The Sumo wrestler, of course, had more muscle than the bodybuilder and powerlifter. The powerlifter came in 2nd, bodybuilder of course was last.

Sumo wrestlers eat a retarded amount, every day......FOOD. It's all about the food. So EAT. SLEEP. GROW.
 

richiec

Verified Customer / Kilo Klub Member
Kilo Klub Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 6, 2010
Messages
5,609
You think upping the calories will make him fat? Well it will if you go from 2k to 5k all the sudden and don't change any excersize regimen. If you slowly increase the cals, say 250/day for a month, his body will use them to build muscle.
 

Staff online

Forum statistics

Total page views
501,700,888
Threads
123,322
Messages
2,346,594
Members
155,042
Latest member
BenJ34
Top