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Couple Powerlifters i meet and something that shocked me

Guys, this is the first 700 lb bencher. Pm would rip the shirtless sheriff to pieces if he posted pics. "thank you very much,get out da way"-James Henderson
x2neoh.jpg

And yes, powerlifters refer to elbows out as "bodybuilding style" of course guys who use more chest have bigger chests. In powerlifting you recruit everything you can..which is what makes that "fat shit" Paralympic lifters 700 so impressive. Mendy has popped a quad benching...his chest also pokes out less than his swollen ninja turtle abs. Spoto went elbows out-just retard strength...amazing. Where's he been?

As far as the strongman comment-again, there's just a few the masses see on tv...go to a meet and you'll find there is a pro "under 231" division and the guys are all shaped differently. Pl and strongmen as a whole think bodybuilding is kinda wierd.

What they all have in common is rampant drug abuse. No one in the general public gives a shit about bb or pl...
 
Guys, this is the first 700 lb bencher. Pm would rip the shirtless sheriff to pieces if he posted pics. "thank you very much,get out da way"-James Henderson
x2neoh.jpg

And yes, powerlifters refer to elbows out as "bodybuilding style" of course guys who use more chest have bigger chests. In powerlifting you recruit everything you can..which is what makes that "fat shit" Paralympic lifters 700 so impressive. Mendy has popped a quad benching...his chest also pokes out less than his swollen ninja turtle abs. Spoto went elbows out-just retard strength...amazing. Where's he been?

As far as the strongman comment-again, there's just a few the masses see on tv...go to a meet and you'll find there is a pro "under 231" division and the guys are all shaped differently. Pl and strongmen as a whole think bodybuilding is kinda wierd.

What they all have in common is rampant drug abuse. No one in the general public gives a shit about bb or pl...

Henderson seems like a cool guy, here's a short video of him doing incline bench: [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnW7zeDk2SU"]505 Pound Incline Bench! - YouTube[/ame].
 
Some power lifters I train with take crazy doses. Most notably anadrol up to 300mg daily. I only know of 1 who does it at a high level who is completely natural. But this is so rare to see.
 
RAW 705. so I'd say 2 of the 4?( maybe five not sure now) 700 lb raw benchers are "fat shits".bodybuilders gonna rag on him for his poor quad development?
2ufpncz.jpg


Weight moves weight. Heavyweight lifters dont care how they look - its not how you win. Its very hard for bodybuilders to wrap their heads around that - its of no consequence...much like our plastic trophies that look somewhat metallic.we All parties are killing themselves for misguided self-glorification. Im glad Trinity got the member of the month - I really like how vocal he is about health.

Ive no dog in the fight of raw vs gear. Just dont care for the misconceptions and the repitition of the same rhetoric blabbed from getbig or some crap like that. its mostly fueled by insecurity and people with experience only in one- or people on the sidelines with no experience at all. Its a niche sport, and the competitors dont care. At APF and SPF meets-the guys all warm up and bullshit together.
 
RAW 705. so I'd say 2 of the 4?( maybe five not sure now) 700 lb raw benchers are "fat shits".bodybuilders gonna rag on him for his poor quad development?
2ufpncz.jpg


Weight moves weight. Heavyweight lifters dont care how they look - its not how you win. Its very hard for bodybuilders to wrap their heads around that - its of no consequence...much like our plastic trophies that look somewhat metallic.we All parties are killing themselves for misguided self-glorification. Im glad Trinity got the member of the month - I really like how vocal he is about health.

Ive no dog in the fight of raw vs gear. Just dont care for the misconceptions and the repitition of the same rhetoric blabbed from getbig or some crap like that. its mostly fueled by insecurity and people with experience only in one- or people on the sidelines with no experience at all. Its a niche sport, and the competitors dont care. At APF and SPF meets-the guys all warm up and bullshit together.

See bold above: I don't know who you have been talking to, but I don't know a single BB'r who doesn't understand that...and I have spoken with 1,000's over the last 25 years. BB'rs might want to look good, but they understand very well that the goal of strength sports is performance ONLY and that appearance is of no consequence. You must know some dumb BB'rs.
 
It was your statement inbold...that raw guys want to" look" the part...that made me foolishly think that bodybuilders didnt get it. Most serious competitors just want to win.Maybe the complaining about physiques or ratios. If I misunderstood, my apologies. Im only exposed to bodybuilders that are vocal on this forum and I refrain from insulting anyone-its rude.

Im a long armed lifter and when I competed equipped I got smoked by guys that were better in a shirt than me-but i was aware that technique was a huge part of the sport.The competitors dont cry about this stuff-they know how hard it is and try to improve. Powerlifting is a boring sport to spectators on the whole-not much can fix that other than hot girls, loud music and pyrotechnics. The opinion of outsiders matters very little.

What would I know about anything though?Not one of the "bros"on pm-just a guy that did it for 15 yrs and I dont feel the need to be an expert from afar on any topic. Figured the insight from an actual competitor might be interesting, maybe even helpful to forum members.

Its about winning at any cost...the point I've been belaboring for two pages and I'll cease responding as it seems to have been lost. I'm very average, and have a better physique than I do lifts. I'm ok with that. Not sure quite what happens on the forums that everything has to be a pissing match. I'll say I have respect for anyone that puts it on the line and steps on a platform or stage-takes courage-win or lose. Its simply not risking ones life for-I dont believe that our maker would want that for us, much less our friends and family.
 
I'm sure he's confusing raw bench with shorted 750 bench. Yes that's possible. There are guys benching over a grand now in shirts and 800 not a big deal...
 
Meant to say I could easily believe a 750 natty shirted bench
 
Not always the case. The guy that comes to mind is the skinny black kid who is usually deadlifiting in the Animal cage at the big shows. You would never look at him and think for a second he deadlifts that much and only weighs probably a buck 60 or something.


Richard Hawthorne 610 lbs deadlift x 4 reps - YouTube
Deadlift seems to be the exception of looking the part. some have exceptional leverage and it's not so much because incredible muscle power. Leverage effects deadlift more than anything. Still impressive as all hell.

anomalies that are in part standout because of very usual leverages are always going to be there. That's why all around is what matters. Strong at everything in spite of leverages. Can't have idea leverages for all three lifts in same person.
 
Deadlift seems to be the exception of looking the part. some have exceptional leverage and it's not so much because incredible muscle power. Leverage effects deadlift more than anything. Still impressive as all hell.

anomalies that are in part standout because of very usual leverages are always going to be there. That's why all around is what matters. Strong at everything in spite of leverages. Can't have idea leverages for all three lifts in same person.

Good point. It's still kind of wild though, there's huge guys that cant even get that off the ground. It makes me wonder what muscle exactly is firing to get that much up, legs? Lower back? Even if I had the strength to get it up im not sure if my forearms would not give out. I attempted 500 one time and felt like I could have gotten it but my forearms wouldn't allow me to keep hold of it. And I didn't have straps at the time.
 
Good point. It's still kind of wild though, there's huge guys that cant even get that off the ground. It makes me wonder what muscle exactly is firing to get that much up, legs? Lower back? Even if I had the strength to get it up im not sure if my forearms would not give out. I attempted 500 one time and felt like I could have gotten it but my forearms wouldn't allow me to keep hold of it. And I didn't have straps at the time.
Mixed grip and chalk go a long way. Plus if you've ever felt the knurling on a dl bar you'd understand. It's super aggressive as compared to most "gym bars".
 
Mixed grip and chalk go a long way. Plus if you've ever felt the knurling on a dl bar you'd understand. It's super aggressive as compared to most "gym bars".


Awesome knurling, smaller diameter bar with more whip, freaky long arms etc...all useful in pulling. These lil freaks get it done though. Hawthorne pulling over 4x bw is freakish-he was good at it the first time he tried. There's also ipf guys who have to use the same bar for all three lifts and have to beat tests pulling freakish numbers. Those long arms just kill the bench on dl specialists, and there's alot less dl only shows.. It all evens out in a full meet. Strong is strong. I find it odd that people hate on bench only guys with a great arch and short arms due to great form and genetics-while guys with short femurs and long arms to go with their superb form don't take as much heat. Of course, there's th "but it was sumo" crowd who's never tried a max effort sumo pull...

These guys are amazing...all 3 lifts, raw, single and multiply. King lewey-the answer is everything firing. ME pulls leave your whole body sore. Also, I'll betcha you could pull five if you wanted too.
 
Mike, three guys in the world bench 700 lbs raw. Yup, they are mutants.
Having actually COMPETED in equipped, raw and strongman and not being a spectator-I have respect for all three.I hit just as the blast shirts changed to titan furies and inzer rage shirts-then katanas and rage X. it is crazy to see the evolution phenom, super phenom...super DUPER phenom....(yes, that is a real shirt) Multiply is also called unlimited -

Watching bodybuilders beat the dead horse of raw vs gear is like watching sprinters talk shit about pole vaulters vs high jumpers...with jealous onlookers in the stands picking apart all three.

Guess what? the drugs evolved too...Its all absurd. If we wanted to see the best man win no one would take drugs, cut weight, use equipment etc...

The irony of an internet steroid guru complaining some powerlifters respond better to "gear" shouldnt be lost on some folks with a sense of humor.raw powerlifting is new- tight jean shorts under singlets, bedsheets with tennis balls behind the knees-all par for the course"back in the day" . None of it is to make it EASIER, its to push more weight and win.

PM would call Paul Anderson a fat shit. Theres the "golden era of bodybuilding" guys who would call slin and growth guts a disgrace to the sport...but "some" drugs are ok? What does PM think of natural bodybuiding? a joke right? Clean guys think juiced guys are not hackers, cheats, no work ethic when they've never taken a shot and seen they didnt make the olympia from it.-Juicers think clean guys arent willing to do whatever it takes.

Its all stupid and it takes years off of peoples lives...being great...at what? I hope guys take better care of themselves. I dont care if they are prancing in a thong and fucking citrus or wearing a onesie squatting a grand and not being able to see their junk in the shower-its insane. I participated. I dont hate steroids, strength sports or bodybuilding- just saddens me now that Ive got a little perspective when I see all these guys getting sick for nothing.

See bold above: You can take drugs and still be the "best man" on the platform. In my eyes taking drugs and using equipment is completely different--not even in the same ballpark. Drugs or no drugs, it is the strength of the muscles alone that determine how much weight is lifted, but not with equipped lifting.

With equipped lifting, a weaker man can beat a much stronger man by a significant margin for no other reason than his equipment worked better for him. In these cases, the strongest man is not actually winning--and that's where I have a problem. Powerlifting is supposed to be about determining who the strongest lifter is--not who has the best equipment or whose body is ideally suited to the equipment they are wearing.

Powerlifting is supposed to be about pure strength--who can lift the most weight with their "OWN" body! What's next? Steel-band reinforced squat suits? Hydraulic lifts? The sport has been ruined, and I am FAR from the only one who thinks this. In every other sport who know who the best is--all the way down the line to the last ranked competitor. The stats actually mean something, as all the athletes are forced to adhere to the same standards and play by the same rules.

With powerlifting, no one has a clue who the strongest guy is, or even the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, or 7th strongest is. It's all just a crap-shoot--a guessing game when it comes to determining the true rankings. 1,000+ lb bench presses? LOL. Gimme a break. What a joke and an insult to those lifters who actually set the standard back in the 60's-70's with their 100% raw lifts. Back then, we knew exactly where everyone stood, but now no one has a damn clue. It's turned into a circus act with 100 different federations all playing by different rules and using technology to hit numbers that are 100's of pounds above what they can actually lift.

Records don't mean shit anymore. You know what the average person today thinks when he hears a new bench record has been set? "I wonder what equipment he used to hit that number?" LOL. Sad. Real sad. We should be thinking..."Wow! A new world record! This is the strongest bencher/squatter/puller the world has ever seen!" Instead, no one even begin to think he might actually be the strongest guy in history. All thought immediately turns to the horse & pony tricks employed to achieve such numbers.

In my opinion, let these guys take whatever drugs they want, eat whatever they want, reach whatever bodyweights they want, but at least lift the fucking weight yourself! At least that way we will know once and for all who actually did what. Equipment is by FAR the #1 reason for the loss of respect in powerlifting. It has ruined the best pure strength sport in the world.
 
Mike,how many meets have you done? How many entry fees did you pay to be a spectator "before" it was ruined. Curious. Did you pay for a subscription to powerlifting usa before it went under? Ever spotted and loaded for the raw icons you were speaking of? Curious...if the answer is yes to at least two then your opinion may have merit. There are still raw records, lilliebidge just did 23something without wraps. Amazing. His incredibly developed upper body only accounted for 550 of it. Everybody who actually follows or competes knows the difference. If you don't like it, don't do it-much like most powerlifters raw or equipped would never wear a thong and oil up for other dudes to admire their striated asses. I actually "get it" it's just an extreme (and ye, addictive) personality that gets obsessed with size, strength or both. A more valid point to make would be lax judging. Not one fed-varies from meet to meet.
 
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Mike,how many meets have you done? How many entry fees did you pay to be a spectator "before" it was ruined. Curious. Did you pay for a subscription to powerlifting usa before it went under? Ever spotted and loaded for the raw icons you were speaking of? Curious...if the answer is yes to at least two then your opinion may have merit. There are still raw records, lilliebidge just did 23something without wraps. Amazing. His incredibly developed upper body only accounted for 550 of it. Everybody who actually follows or competes knows the difference. If you don't like it, don't do it-much like most powerlifters raw or equipped would never wear a thong and oil up for other dudes to admire their striated asses. I actually "get it" it's just an extreme (and ye, addictive) personality that gets obsessed with size, strength or both. A more valid point to make would be lax judging. Not one fed-varies from meet to meet.

My opinion has merit regardless of your imposed qualifications, as many others who meet all these "pre-reqs" and more feel likewise, but I will indulge you anyway. Yes, I competed 3 times before I injured myself and was a spectator at about a dozen meets. I also read powerlifting USA regularly for years (not sure how that is relevant, though). I trained extensively with 2 world champions (198 lb and 165 lb weight class), who were current champions when I trained with them. They were originally from West side, but one of them went on to develop his own system. He has been plastered all over the cover of powerlifting USA.

In fact, there was a entire team who trained at my gym under this system--about 15-20 guys at any given time--many of them highly ranked. We would also occasionally have guys come up from Westside, since they were only about 2 hours away from us and knew several of the guys well. At least 4-5 world-elite lifters. Another one had the highest co-efficient in the nation.

I could go on. OK, I will. I have also been following powerlifting long before you, based on your comment that you didn't even begin following the sport until the Titan Fury came around (a shirt I happened to own and which helped me make up my mind how ridiculous equipped lifting is--after it put 150 lbs on my bench the first time I ever used it). I have been following the sport since Arcidi was king of the bench--a time before bench shirts were adding 400 lbs and equipped lifting was still very similar to raw lifting, at least compared to now.

From then until now the sport has taken a nose dive into destruction. It is a fucking joke. 100 different feds, no universal rules, different equipment for different federations, a 100 different current world records being held by a 100 different people at once (makes one wonder how that is possible when they are only 3 lifts). LOL.

Make no mistake--I realize full well that lifters in both raw and equipped lifting train brutally hard. My problem is with the equipment alone, which I and many others believe has ruined the sport--and there is sound reasoning behind this belief, which is why huge numbers of people feel likewise. Even if you overlook everything I mentioned above, the single fact that technology is determining the winners--NOT pure strength--makes the sport a farce and hypocritical. The sport was originally supposed to be about who was the strongest in the bench, squat, and deadlift...not who could combine the optimal combination of muscle and technology in order to achieve the highest possible total. The fact that people actually use equipment that ADDS weight to one's lifts is hilarious. Even worse is that some of this shit is adding 400+ lbs to people's lifts--400 fucking pounds!

Now, if this equipment was adding the same number of pounds to everyone's lifts, then at least it would be fair (although still moronic), but this is not the case at all. How anyone can defend a strength sport in which a weaker man can potentially beat a stronger man because of technological advantage alone, is dumbfounding to me.

20-25 years ago the pro-equipment advocates tried to bullshit their way into acceptance by claiming that equipment was only used to increase safety. Back then the guys didn't dare say they used equipment to achieve higher totals--because they knew damn well how it would be viewed by the majority. Of course, everyone knew better, but at least the equipment supporters didn't have the gall to publically claim that hitting higher numbers was the primary reason for using equipment.

Of course, as time went by and equipment started adding 100's of lbs to everyone's lifts, it was very clear that the ONLY reason for using equipment was to make the individual lift a weight they can't actually lift. However, because it was introduced slowly and gradually became more extreme, it didn't catch the backlash it would have had the first bench shirts added hundreds of pounds. These days the guys don't even try to hide it. Beating records is no longer about being stronger than the previous record holder--it is about technology--period. How can a sport that is supposed to be all about strength be run under a system that not only allows, but fosters an environment where a weaker lifter can beat stronger lifters for no other reason than technological prowess?

It's B.S--that's what it is, but to be honest, I don't feel like having this debate because there is nothing you can say (really) that I haven't heard before and in the end, it is all justifications and excuses for a sport that has crashed and burned.

If guys want to do equipped lifting, fine, but at least call it what it is and stop allowing them to earn a place in the record books. Leave that for the guys who can be fairly judged against the same standard--a test of real flesh & blood strength, in which everyone is on equal footing and the lifters are ranked according to their true strength.
 
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See bold above: You can take drugs and still be the "best man" on the platform. In my eyes taking drugs and using equipment is completely different--not even in the same ballpark. Drugs or no drugs, it is the strength of the muscles alone that determine how much weight is lifted, but not with equipped lifting.

With equipped lifting, a weaker man can beat a much stronger man by a significant margin for no other reason than his equipment worked better for him. In these cases, the strongest man is not actually winning--and that's where I have a problem. Powerlifting is supposed to be about determining who the strongest lifter is--not who has the best equipment or whose body is ideally suited to the equipment they are wearing.

Powerlifting is supposed to be about pure strength--who can lift the most weight with their "OWN" body! What's next? Steel-band reinforced squat suits? Hydraulic lifts? The sport has been ruined, and I am FAR from the only one who thinks this. In every other sport who know who the best is--all the way down the line to the last ranked competitor. The stats actually mean something, as all the athletes are forced to adhere to the same standards and play by the same rules.

With powerlifting, no one has a clue who the strongest guy is, or even the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, or 7th strongest is. It's all just a crap-shoot--a guessing game when it comes to determining the true rankings. 1,000+ lb bench presses? LOL. Gimme a break. What a joke and an insult to those lifters who actually set the standard back in the 60's-70's with their 100% raw lifts. Back then, we knew exactly where everyone stood, but now no one has a damn clue. It's turned into a circus act with 100 different federations all playing by different rules and using technology to hit numbers that are 100's of pounds above what they can actually lift.

Records don't mean shit anymore. You know what the average person today thinks when he hears a new bench record has been set? "I wonder what equipment he used to hit that number?" LOL. Sad. Real sad. We should be thinking..."Wow! A new world record! This is the strongest bencher/squatter/puller the world has ever seen!" Instead, no one even begin to think he might actually be the strongest guy in history. All thought immediately turns to the horse & pony tricks employed to achieve such numbers.

In my opinion, let these guys take whatever drugs they want, eat whatever they want, reach whatever bodyweights they want, but at least lift the fucking weight yourself! At least that way we will know once and for all who actually did what. Equipment is by FAR the #1 reason for the loss of respect in powerlifting. It has ruined the best pure strength sport in the world.


I totally agree my friend.
I wish everything was raw.
it irks me that people claim 700 benches when they can only do maybe 500 without the equipment.
 
Debating raw vs. equipped is a HUGE waste of time!

Besides, none of it matters anyways because when a "normal" person hears about a 600/800/1,000 lbs squat their response is, "Oh, my uncle used to squat 1,000."
 
Mike i respect your replies but one thing is not accurate.
Regardless of equipment or not, the strongest guy doesnt always win.
It is the best competitor on the day that wins.
I've beaten alot of guys that honestly were stronger then me, by being smarter
Choosing right attempts and right psychology at the meet.
I also lost alot of times by making mistakes.
Being a competitor is alot diffrent than just being brutally strong.
You say guys beat others that are stronger by getting more from equipment?
What stopped the stronger guy from getting the right equipment, learning it
Train alot in it so he can kick ass ih he knew he' competing eq?
He didnt come prepared and he lost. Thats sports.
Having potential, strength, quickness and such will not always be enough regardless
Of circumstances
 
only douchebags leave out that they use the gear and everyone has access to the same stuff...and mike-it does make a difference whether your opinion has merit and im glad youve been there. youve mentioned westside a few times with great respect. ask louie how he feels about gear and get back to typing in bold.
no ones raw records have been erased by gear. your rightious and excessively verbose indignation is misplaced.
 
Is there talk within powerlifting on whether or not equipped lifting is harder on joints? I can't imagine the 400 pounds that shirts can add to a bench being great on the shoulders. Same goes for hips on the squat.
 

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