I need advice friends / child involved

morepain · Sep 9, 2008

OK i will try to summarize as best i can. I provide financial support to a child who is not biologically mine. I dated his mother from the time he was 8 months old until he was about 3 years old. His "father" is a deadbeat never has been involved, the child came to know me as "dad" and i love him with every ounce of my being. he is now 5 years old and i have continued to be dad and i help out with his expenses etc. I usually get to see him a couple of days a week and we do stuff together just like any other father / son.

Now for the hard part, his motehr in all her wisdom has gotten pregnant again and is about to have another child. This child will at least have a father that can provide so that is not an issue. The problem is she is upset and is taking it out on me by not allowing me to see my boy. She uses him as a weapon and doesn't let me see him unless i promise not to take him around my current fiancee even though they get along wonderfully. I have tried so hard and have always made sure he had everything he needed. I taught him how to tie his shoes, ride a bike, etc. I AM his DADDY and always will be as far as i am concerned.

Right now i am so depressed because of the grief she is giving me, i try to tell her that it is important for me to stay strong and that the boy needs me and she knows this. She is just so jealous that she is willing to make us both suffer just because she is currently unhappy. I try to help her out when i can because financially she struggles and i am better off, but even doing that she will still attack me and keep him from me or at least threaten to until i am a depressed mess and can't hardly function. Then i am no good to him, myself or anyone.

A cry for advice i guess...

B1gJ1m · Sep 9, 2008

I'm not sure about your financial situation but that's someting you may feel obligated to do although not required by a court. As far as spending time with him goes, if you truly care about the child and have his best interests at heart you can always continue to fill that role. You may be the best chance he has at having a positive male role model in his life and teaching him that he is valued and important. But I guess I'm kind of lost about what advice you want or need. What exactly is it that you're looking for? Are you wanting to stop providing support? Do you want to sever your relatonship with the child? Do you want more of a place in his life? Guess I missed that in your post.

B1gJ1m · Sep 9, 2008

Okay thats better. Sadly that's a tough situation to be in. Because we as adults are much better at dealing with the ugly side of people and what motivates them to do the things they do. I really think you need to try to compromise on the situation, unfortunately, she is the biologocal mother and has the final say on his matters. Now if you can get her to realize that your fiancee is a positive influence on him and that keeping him from you will do more harm than him being around the fiancee. In the end she needs to understand that you have loved him as if he were your own child, and in doing so, you would never place him in a position that would harm him. Good luck.

morepain · Sep 9, 2008

yes that is what i try to do each day, i have told her if she can get the courts to file abandonment on his biological father (who also has a criminal past and could be nothing but harmful to him) then i would jump at a chance to adopt him. I could care less about the money, i would happily pay support in exchange for knowing he will always be a part of my life. I guess as much as anything i need to vent...i am heartbroken and very depressed right now.

blackhole2 · Sep 9, 2008

morepain said:
yes that is what i try to do each day, i have told her if she can get the courts to file abandonment on his biological father (who also has a criminal past and could be nothing but harmful to him) then i would jump at a chance to adopt him. I could care less about the money, i would happily pay support in exchange for knowing he will always be a part of my life. I guess as much as anything i need to vent...i am heartbroken and very depressed right now.

Brother venting is great, it lets stuff out so you can have more space to think clearly.

IMHO you should talk to a lawyer and see what can be done legally in the sens e of making this situation not so one sided, right now it is: I feel like farting you = don't see the boy, I don't like your shirt = you don't see the boy, I have any problem and want to fuck someones life to feel good about myself = you don't see the boy - doesn't matter what is fair or better for the boy.

Maybe some professional help from a psychotherapist for the mother would be helpful as well, I guess what I am trying to tell you is: you are the weak link, understand it, vent with us but talk to the right people that can give you the right advice.

Good luck man.

J

morepain · Sep 9, 2008

i am working on that my friend, so far the way i understand it, she must first get teh rights of the biological father taken away due to abandonement before i could gain any custodial rights, as i said she is about to have another child and i know she is struggling, it is just sad that i reach out to help and i am cut off. Until of course she needs some bills paid.

mooshue · Sep 9, 2008

I have been in your shoes my man, i feel for you as i know exactly how your gut aches when she keeps the little guy from you. You literally feel sick.
I had to completely cut off ties with her after one of her drunken benders that left me getting calls from the school asking if i could come pick him up because i was the only number on file that answered for about a week. She completely dissappeared, childrens services was involved etc.. This really took a tool on my current relationship and my own biological son who had just been born. Basically i decided i didnt want that kind of life for my own son, no drunken fights or bullshit, no childrens services etc.. He was never going to know the bullshit that existed like it did with my ex wife.
I had been with those boys since the youngest one was 2 months old, they were 11 and 9 when i cut it off. The oldest, who was autistic, had a deadbeat dad who he didn't even meet until he attended his uncles funeral.

Thats my story in a nutshell to let you know you aren't alone. This is what you have to do for everyones sake, not just yours. It doesn't do the child any good to be kept from you and have you only get to be daddy when its convenient for her. I had a lawyer draw up a custody/adoption agreement, a straight up 50/50 split no money to anyone and i assume full responsibility as the childs legal father. All she had to do was sign or alter what she felt necessary. She refused and i didnt hear from them again until they were moving out of state. I simply explained to them that i was not legally their father and had no rights to see them, i was only allowed to see them when i was given permission and i loved them both with all my heart. I left them my phone number and email etc.. I do still hear from them, its been 2 years now since we cut ties. My life has never been better. There is nothing being held over my head ripping out my heart, destroying my girlfriend and sons relationship at home, those boys are doing great in their new setting as she seems to have cleaned up her act now or found some new sap to feed off of. Either way, it ended up better for everyone.
Sorry if i rambled on too much, i was trying to make it short and sweet, as you know this kind of situation is far from a short story.
Good luck my friend, just know there are other good guys out there who have gone, and are going through this very situation.

tomuchgear · Sep 9, 2008

it sounds like a crap ass situation to me bro. what your doing is awesome. talking to a lawyer will help with out a doubt but legal rights are legal rights. has she filed and any thing at all. maybe some form of couples counseling. lastly some times you have to walk away for a bit. i know that sounds cold. you have to think of what is best for that child. if she is making life that dificult think of what it is doing to the kid. take if from some one who knows giving up a child is the hardest thing you can ever do. i had to walk away from one a long time ago. call me a dick if you want but the mother of that child and i are like oil and wather with a touch of napalm. that women hates me. i pay my child support on time every month, and i pay more than the court orderd amount. i did what i hope is best for the kid. some times you just have to do what you feel is rite and hope it works out.

morepain · Sep 9, 2008

mooshue said:
I have been in your shoes my man, i feel for you as i know exactly how your gut aches when she keeps the little guy from you. You literally feel sick.
I had to completely cut off ties with her after one of her drunken benders that left me getting calls from the school asking if i could come pick him up because i was the only number on file that answered for about a week. She completely dissappeared, childrens services was involved etc.. This really took a tool on my current relationship and my own biological son who had just been born. Basically i decided i didnt want that kind of life for my own son, no drunken fights or bullshit, no childrens services etc.. He was never going to know the bullshit that existed like it did with my ex wife.
I had been with those boys since the youngest one was 2 months old, they were 11 and 9 when i cut it off. The oldest, who was autistic, had a deadbeat dad who he didn't even meet until he attended his uncles funeral.

Thats my story in a nutshell to let you know you aren't alone. This is what you have to do for everyones sake, not just yours. It doesn't do the child any good to be kept from you and have you only get to be daddy when its convenient for her. I had a lawyer draw up a custody/adoption agreement, a straight up 50/50 split no money to anyone and i assume full responsibility as the childs legal father. All she had to do was sign or alter what she felt necessary. She refused and i didnt hear from them again until they were moving out of state. I simply explained to them that i was not legally their father and had no rights to see them, i was only allowed to see them when i was given permission and i loved them both with all my heart. I left them my phone number and email etc.. I do still hear from them, its been 2 years now since we cut ties. My life has never been better. There is nothing being held over my head ripping out my heart, destroying my girlfriend and sons relationship at home, those boys are doing great in their new setting as she seems to have cleaned up her act now or found some new sap to feed off of. Either way, it ended up better for everyone.
Sorry if i rambled on too much, i was trying to make it short and sweet, as you know this kind of situation is far from a short story.
Good luck my friend, just know there are other good guys out there who have gone, and are going through this very situation.

thats what i don't know, can i actually assume parental role even though his "father" is still alive and technically has not given up rights?

morepain · Sep 9, 2008

and mooshue thanks so much for sharing that it helps more than you know

mooshue · Sep 10, 2008

morepain said:
thats what i don't know, can i actually assume parental role even though his "father" is still alive and technically has not given up rights?

The laws vary from state to state, but yes. There is a certain amount of time that can pass with no contact by the legal father. If you can prove that, its no problem. If you can also show no way to contact the father, you can do an uncontested sort of like an uncontested divorce when the other party cant be located or is unwilling to appear or sign. One of my best friends was able to adopt his step daughter the very same way. Then again the laws in Nevada may be a bit more laxed than the bible belt states so depends on where you both reside. It helps if hes never paid child support or has a warrent for never paying child support. Judges hate that shit.

Think hard about this one though, this will always, and i mean always keep this woman involved in your life. It will tax your current relationship, it will tax any biological children you haves relationship. If you and your partner are rock solid, go for it.

You are already at rock bottom if its anything like it was for me, so the worst that can happen is she just says no way and disappears. Best case she goes for it, you have scheduled visitation and legal rights and she can never fuck with you legally again. If she's as crazy and a user like my ex is/was, she will abandon the kid at your place, and then call the police to escort her to pick him up claiming that you took him and are not the father. Luckily for me, the school and children's services were on my side or id have been in some serious kidnapping shit!!!! Thats what did me in finally. I never assumed someone would be that vicious to use their children that way.

I have decided to never be involved with people like this again, man or woman. Anyone who would be willing to use their child as a pawn to hurt the other one has no place in my life. I made it very clear to my current girlfriend and mother of my son and she also agreed. She saw first hand how bad it hurts everyone. Since we dont really believe in marriage we have kind of a pre marriage nuptual agreement, if anything happends its 50/50 no support or alimony of any kind.

We have actually dropped a few friends of ours who split and started doing this. We would keep their kids while they would go out and get laid or whatever they do, come to find out the other party wanted the kids and she said no way and left them with us.

I lived in that abusive lie of a relationship for nearly 10 years if thats any help. I could probably write for days and days in this thread and still not cover half of the shit i've been through that i know you are going through right now. I know you are only a few years in, but it all hurts the same as you too feel like its YOUR child and theres not a damn thing you can do about it.
This thread and brining up some of the stuff is very painful for me even now years later.

Designbuilt · Sep 10, 2008

It will be tough to adopt the child, the first thing that you should do is talk to a good family lawyer.

I have the best in the business, his name is Kurt Muller, he works in Illinois,
but practices elsewhere, go to his web-site it has a section where he can answer questions and tell you what your options are.

Here it is:

**broken link removed**

He is pretty pricy, but well worth it. When my wife was having problems with her piece of shit ex-husband, who hired an attorney spent about 200k on his lawyers just to gain custody of her children then abandoned them with the grand parents this is who we used.

Eventhough you really don't have any rights now since you are not the legal guardian or blood related you may be entitled to some rights.

If that is the case it may be less painful if a judge entered an agreed order designating visitation rights, that way it's a set visitation, no arguments, no using the kids as negotiating tools, no bullshit.

You pick him up drop him off, you're there for the boy not his mother. Both of you are on with your lives and it's really the same situation as with an ideal divorce, when problems arise is usually when one of the adults has a problem with the other or is unhappy with themselves and uses the children as a bargaining tool.

It's a sad situation, because the only one who suffers is the kid, and that's sad as hell, I've been through it, my step children are 16 & 17 so that parts over, but when they were between 7-10 it was a lot of shit, the dad would go to their school and bother them during class, cops at the house all the time, shit, you don't have it that bad! Our case has over 150 motions and started with my involvement back in June 2000, it stopped for a while, now we still have a pending case this month! It's unbelievable, we've had 2 G.A.L's Guardian ad Litems and 3 attorneys each. Kurt is definately the best, I only left him briefly when I couldn't afford him, but he is very well worth the money. Anyway, under the section to contact him, shoot him an email, he will respond and give you good solid advice.

Good luck,

DB

morepain · Sep 10, 2008

Designbuilt said:
It will be tough to adopt the child, the first thing that you should do is talk to a good family lawyer.

I have the best in the business, his name is Kurt Muller, he works in Illinois,
but practices elsewhere, go to his web-site it has a section where he can answer questions and tell you what your options are.

Here it is:

**broken link removed**

He is pretty pricy, but well worth it. When my wife was having problems with her piece of shit ex-husband, who hired an attorney spent about 200k on his lawyers just to gain custody of her children then abandoned them with the grand parents this is who we used.

Eventhough you really don't have any rights now since you are not the legal guardian or blood related you may be entitled to some rights.

If that is the case it may be less painful if a judge entered an agreed order designating visitation rights, that way it's a set visitation, no arguments, no using the kids as negotiating tools, no bullshit.

You pick him up drop him off, you're there for the boy not his mother. Both of you are on with your lives and it's really the same situation as with an ideal divorce, when problems arise is usually when one of the adults has a problem with the other or is unhappy with themselves and uses the children as a bargaining tool.

It's a sad situation, because the only one who suffers is the kid, and that's sad as hell, I've been through it, my step children are 16 & 17 so that parts over, but when they were between 7-10 it was a lot of shit, the dad would go to their school and bother them during class, cops at the house all the time, shit, you don't have it that bad! Our case has over 150 motions and started with my involvement back in June 2000, it stopped for a while, now we still have a pending case this month! It's unbelievable, we've had 2 G.A.L's Guardian ad Litems and 3 attorneys each. Kurt is definately the best, I only left him briefly when I couldn't afford him, but he is very well worth the money. Anyway, under the section to contact him, shoot him an email, he will respond and give you good solid advice.

Good luck,

DB

THANKS SO MUCH for that at least i know i am leaving no stone unturned

morepain · Sep 10, 2008

thankfully she is not a drug addict or any of that crap, mostly she just can not move on with her life even though we never really got along. From day one it was mostly my sympathy for her situation, my ideal situation would be for her to just have some revelation and realize i have nothing but his best interests at heart and accept that sometimes the child is more important than her. As long as she keeps putting herself first and using him against me by attacking me emotionally i am screwed.

tattoojr · Sep 10, 2008

This is going to come from another angle and not one that you probably want to hear. If the mother is in another relationship with a male role model/figure it may be better for the child if you back out. I'm not saying it will be easy but I have friends that adopted a child at birth (while the biological father was in prison) and raised him for several years. Then all hell broke loose with the father trying to get the son, then the mother (after signing away her rights) siding with the father and then getting the kid back to raise with her new baby, and a different man. Kids are amazing beings and they can adapt to all kinds of things, but if theres too much going on they won't know what is supposed to be .If that makes sense. After what I've seen with this couple and other men that I know, trying to man up and do the right thing, seeing the financial(sp) and emotional strain and pain. I would ,in that position step away from this and let the couple know that you will be available for the kid if needed to talk to him, but would cut all finanicial ties( Mom and B/F need to step up) and then seek some counseling for myself and focus on my biological kid and make sure that kinda crap don't happen to him. J.R.

Designbuilt · Sep 10, 2008

tattoojr said:
This is going to come from another angle and not one that you probably want to hear. If the mother is in another relationship with a male role model/figure it may be better for the child if you back out. I'm not saying it will be easy but I have friends that adopted a child at birth (while the biological father was in prison) and raised him for several years. Then all hell broke loose with the father trying to get the son, then the mother (after signing away her rights) siding with the father and then getting the kid back to raise with her new baby, and a different man. Kids are amazing beings and they can adapt to all kinds of things, but if theres too much going on they won't know what is supposed to be .If that makes sense. After what I've seen with this couple and other men that I know, trying to man up and do the right thing, seeing the financial(sp) and emotional strain and pain. I would ,in that position step away from this and let the couple know that you will be available for the kid if needed to talk to him, but would cut all finanicial ties( Mom and B/F need to step up) and then seek some counseling for myself and focus on my biological kid and make sure that kinda crap don't happen to him. J.R.

Also excellent advice. But it will be tough, if nothing else just be a friend to the boy, because having two dads always complicates things, you know that, there will always be a sorta competition.

And that's not fair to any of you, I know you love the kid, I love my step children and the few years that we lost them, had no contact at all was hard, but we did it for everyone's own good,
But you know what? They are grown up and everything turned out fine, because it always will, it has to. Now It's up to you to decide how to proceed.

And best of luck bro, hope it works out for the best!

I will post my story later this week it may make you feel better to see how fked up our situation was, that's why people watch Springer.

DB

morepain · Sep 10, 2008

tattoojr said:
This is going to come from another angle and not one that you probably want to hear. If the mother is in another relationship with a male role model/figure it may be better for the child if you back out. I'm not saying it will be easy but I have friends that adopted a child at birth (while the biological father was in prison) and raised him for several years. Then all hell broke loose with the father trying to get the son, then the mother (after signing away her rights) siding with the father and then getting the kid back to raise with her new baby, and a different man. Kids are amazing beings and they can adapt to all kinds of things, but if theres too much going on they won't know what is supposed to be .If that makes sense. After what I've seen with this couple and other men that I know, trying to man up and do the right thing, seeing the financial(sp) and emotional strain and pain. I would ,in that position step away from this and let the couple know that you will be available for the kid if needed to talk to him, but would cut all finanicial ties( Mom and B/F need to step up) and then seek some counseling for myself and focus on my biological kid and make sure that kinda crap don't happen to him. J.R.

i hear you brother, fo rnow i am the only male role model in his life. I know that i may have to face the pain of that changing at some point. I know sometimes things are bigger than me and i guess if it is God's will than i will be a part of his life. If it is not than i have to trust God will protect him.

thebrick · Sep 13, 2008

Wow, I feel bad for you. Its a tough situation that a bitter person is punishing others because she is unhappy. You are a great man to be in this little boy's life. I would talk to a good lawyer and see what your options are. I would imagine these vary from state to state.

Even in a worse case situation, this young man will remember and could very well come back into your life on his own one day. Make sure he can find you.

morepain · Sep 14, 2008

thanks brick...have no doubt i will always be there for him in whatever capacity i can...i ask God everyday to show me the path he intends so that i may follow it.

wrought · Sep 16, 2008

So lets see.... you dated a woman for about two years, then broke up and are now financially supporting a child that is not yours while she goes off and gets pregnant by another man... and you're actually engaged to another woman, but are broken up about the original woman not letting you see the kid....

Geez, that's not fair to you, your fiance, the kid, or the other woman and her new baby dady.... I appreciate that you want to be there for the kid but you've really got to step back and assess this. If the woman and this new guy make a life with their new child he will take the role of the older kid's dad too and you will be the 3rd wheel that screws things up. Imagine if you had a baby with your fiance and her old boyfriend kept showing up trying to see her other kids (that weren't his), awkward.

I say stay at arms length, be supportive if the kid contacts you and let him know that he can contact you if he needs to, but otherwise move on with your life, focus on your new relationship.