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o/t God

lucian

Featured Member/ Kilo Klub
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our friend oc brought up my god bless signature.
heres whats going on.
i come from a religious family. i havent been practicing for a long time. but every time something bad happens to me i ask god why and how to fix it. thats very selfish. then in october something happened to my dad and he wound up in the hospital. and my friend had a heart attack and was in the hospital. at tha time without even thinking i asked god to watch over them. and he did. they both got better and oi realized i always come back to god for answers not just for selfish reasons. i do believe and am doing better to find my way. i have spoken with freinds and have been living a better and fuller life thinking about god and others. so still i cuss sometimes, i still make wrong decisions but the ay i see it is its all for a reason. not sure what it is but thats ok. i know not everyone believes and its your choice. but the signiture on my posts is so he watches over all of us.
thanks for listening.

god bless
lucian
 
Although I didn't come from a religious family, I have done the SAME thing many times. And you know, I think it works.
And thanks for calling me a friend, even though I think you're being a little sarcastic, lol. I am always honest, and there if the chips are down.
Thank you, and sorry again Luc.
 
Although I didn't come from a religious family, I have done the SAME thing many times. And you know, I think it works.
And thanks for calling me a friend, even though I think you're being a little sarcastic, lol. I am always honest, and there if the chips are down.
Thank you, and sorry again Luc.

wasnt trying to be sarcastic just trying to be funny to make something of a joke after the other thread.
if i wear the st christopher medal my mom gave me i have good luck and am happy. if i dont wear it for a while everythig goes to crap.
makes you wonder......

god bless
lucian
 
As a child I went to church with my family. I never really understood the teachings and so forth. As a young adult I chose not to attend church because I didn't want to live my life by any ones standard. I was selfish and wanted to do what ever I felt like and that mostly consisted of sins. I soon became chemically addicted. I have since turned my life and will over to the care of God. He has done for me what no human could. Today I try to live by a different standard.
 
I think many times people, including myself, turn to God (or whatever word they use to describe God) almost habitually. I think some of the language that is used in speaking and discussing spirituality has been tainted in our culture to the point that most people recoil the very moment they hear words like Jesus, God, spirit, Allah, Jehovah, angel, etc. I think it's pretty apparent the length and extent to which the government, media, and scientific community has gone to smear the words and practice of religion and spirituality. I'm not talking about religions though. I'm talking about spirituality. What can you do though? It was a very well organized and well financed smear campaign and it was very effective.

Anyway, I think it says something about a person. When I see this, I usually think that I'm looking at an individual who, in his or her way, is aware of the presence (which is key) of the great power in and around them - power and strength they can draw on when they or someone they know (or anyone for that matter) is down or suffering.

I can say this: I believe I'm an intelligent man and I am extremely skeptical. I put little faith in stories people tell but I can tell you that spirituality is good medicine. In fact, if you want even scientific evidence of the power of it, just look around a little and you'll find plenty of good material, studies, and anecdotal support. I have a ring of prayer beads with me all the time. I don't use them as a good luck charm or a crutch. I use them because I gain strength from the use of them. It's often insulting to my intelligence when a person will question me about them in a demeaning way. I sometimes feel it's demeaning yet I sense that they likely don't even realize what they are doing. Almost sometimes implying just in their tone that you are somewhat delusional , unintelligent, or even crazy to put faith is such things. It's kind of funny really. I don't use them because they DON'T work! Why would I waste my time?

There has never existed an atheistic culture that did not believe in any God or gods or worship so-called "higher powers" but I prefer to think of them just as powers, like us, because to call them higher, makes us lower yet we are all connected and one and the same. Even remote peoples that have had little contact with the outside world for a long time have spiritual and usually religious practices. Sometimes they're actually pretty inventive too. In my opinion this shows a need, in the human, to live a spiritual life. A part of you was designed to behave this way or to be aware.

It's the awareness that I think you are describing Lucian.
 
I liked reading these posts.

The notion of there being a God is something that I've struggled with since I was a kid.
Its always the hypocrisy of religions and the fact that I just dont 'get it' that turns me off.

I'm always keen to hear others views though and in no way is my mind closed.

Respect to you Lucian and HOP :)
 
Michelin, if you look, seriously, you'll find it.

I struggled a long time with this stuff. I come from a family where all the women were Christians and the men were all Farm boys, "To manly" to rely on such a crutch.
I always figured it's the stronger person who can put their faith in those things that they CANNOT readily see. We're allowed to see what we need to see( in proper timing) and society has done a great deal of smearing, "The Book".
We live in a society of finger pointers and drive thru philosophies. If it's not the answer we want, we manipulate and discredit. Fact is, bad things happen for a reason, and so do good things. The timing isn't ours so we always question it.

I always would question every little thing and realized (spiritualizing)....you know what? You can't do that. You'll drive yourself insane. Being the Lord is just, he is going to allow people to make good decisions and bad decisions without much if any interference. I guess what I am getting to is I used to have some bad days and always questioned why things never got better and always looked up to shake my head. It dawned on me the problems stemmed from me. Im still human, though a Christian, I still have the same temptations as everyone else. If I make, or anyone else around me makes bad decisions it's going to effect myself, friends and family. The power is there to get through turmoil, not sidetrack reality.
 
wasnt trying to be sarcastic just trying to be funny to make something of a joke after the other thread.
if i wear the st christopher medal my mom gave me i have good luck and am happy. if i dont wear it for a while everythig goes to crap.
makes you wonder......

god bless
lucian

Belief is a powerful thing. In keeping, if St. Christopher keeps you safe, so be it.

God is different things to different people. For me, God is hope.
xoxo
LKG
 
ask and thou shall receive! god is within all of us and wants us to ask for help and guidance. don't forget to give thanks and praise in the way you live and treat others. god is always there and it becomes very apparent, in times of despair, that you are not alone. the power of prayer has pulled me from the depths of a hopeless incarceration back to a normal life with a beautiful family and great job.
 
THE MEANING OF LIFE...........abridged

I am so thankful to find the Philosophers in this group.

I was on a real quest in my college days to understand the basic differences in the world views of various paradigms. The view of the meaning of life is different from the Orthodox Jews, Catholic, Protestant, Islamic, and Hindu, Satanists and Wicca, Voodoo, etc. I studied them all.
The Philosophers too, from Descarte to Nietche.

Can there be any way to know?
At the moment of death,
will there be this flash of recognition and understanding of all things?
Will we be caught up into the many arms of Shiva?
Will the God of Moses have a good rumbling laugh like the sounds of distant thunder, and then reveal all in a sweep of his garment?
Or we will simply wink out of the realm of sentient existence and become creatures of more radiant stuff.
Pure energy.
In complete oneness with the radiant energy
of the primal, unending mantra and prayer.
The hum and rustle of the machinery within and without the universe.
(Insert the name of your chosen diety here)


Is the basic nature of humanity to seek out the answers of the patterns we see. Our own fear and uncertainty in this life...
the very origins of Angels in this darkness below.
What if all of us, blind and stumbling towards oblivion...
Are all after the same thing?
 
OUCH, That was a really good post. I tend to live the same way, not exactly sure what it is I pray to, God or a higher power, but that word "aware" is spot on. I am aware that there are higher powers at work around me daily, I often look to the heavens and talk to God. I sit in awe at the vastness of the universe and the nature of it's power. it holds influence over many people around this globe. I marvel at the beauty and serenity it can bring to one as you wonder the why and how. So yes, aware that there is a greater force at work you betcha.

I have not been to a church in several years, I hold no single denomination of religion, but the house of God is just that, a place where you can go and speak your mind, ask for help and tompray for others, it holds a special feeling when you walk through those doors and kneel before the ALL Mighty! The last time i was in a particular church was during a very trying time in my life, I asked for help, I cried and when I left after about 45 minutes, I felt as though a great load had been taken from me, from the inside. In the end I truely believe I was given the help I asked for, So I believe!!
 
We have to put labels on everything - a label such as a word. We all know, or at least those that have loved, the the label or word "love" does not really give you a good abstraction or realization of what love really and totally is. In fact, when asked to describe what love is, people often have difficulty. They may say, "Love is when you care for someone so much that..." and then go on to give you not an objective definition of the word but merely their own personal experience of "love". Other people reading the person's definition may even think, "That's not what I think love is!"

Love is just a word. Like God is just a word. Just like love is so much more mysterious and unfathomable than the label, God (and many other words too) share the same lack of enlightenment.

Interestingly, if you look at the words of God when he allegedly spoke to Moses on Mt. Sinai, God himself cannot put a single word or name on himself which is very curious. Read the below and in bold:

"Jahveh (Yahweh) is one of the archaic Hebrew nouns, such as Jacob, Joseph, Israel, etc. (cf. Ewald, "Lehrbuch der hebr. Sprache", 7th ed., 1863, p. 664), derived from the third person imperfect in such a way as to attribute to a person or a thing the action of the quality expressed by the verb after the manner of a verbal adjective or a participle. Furst has collected most of these nouns, and calls the form forma participialis imperfectiva. As the Divine name is an imperfect form of the archaic Hebrew verb "to be", Jahveh means "He Who is", Whose characteristic note consists in being, or The Being simply."

If that conversation actually took place then whatever it was that spoke to Moses did not want to be named or maybe could not be named and simply chose to address Himself (or Itself) as "I am" - or as named: "The Being".

It gets even more complicated too. Just as the word "love" really doesn't do the reality of love justice, so it would appear that many words do not pay homage to the subjects they describe. And not just words either. Try to paint "love". Make an image of love. You could not do love justice by any image you could create. Similarly, "The Being" warned Moses about attempting to make images of Itself. Of all ancient deities, Yahweh is uniquely abstract. All other gods could be carved or painted as an image or idol. And the "Being" is also very insistent not only on his ineffability but also on his singularity and that any other god is a "false god". Most of us have heard, "Though shalt not make unto thee any graven image..." Ever wonder why this omnipotent being would say that? Why shouldn't people make an image of this being? The reason, in my opinion is there is nothing we can create, whether stone or paint or whatever, can be an image of this Being. You can't carve love out of a piece of wood and you can't create an image of what we call God out of anything that I can think of. To do so would be to base our image of God on our own human precepts. Wouldn't it be an insult or bring about a feeling of disgust if someone attempted to depict true love out of animal parts? How can you make an image of the "Being" (the "I Am") out of something like sticks or stone or paint?

Just a few thoughts on a Monday night. Nothing for debate. I enjoy contemplating these things. I've come to realize that to truly know God and the nature of God comes with the very harsh realization that God is ultimately unknowable. That is not to say that you cannot relate to God or that you cannot find yourself in God's friendship, just simply that we are not intelligent enough to understand the full scope of the Being that is God - not all that dissimilar to the way we can't truly understand love - only be aware of it's presence. Or the way we can't truly understand the true amount of a googleplex. We can see the word and we can even represent the number but we can't understand the size of it. It is simply an abstract concept.

LOL.... maybe this whole post is an abstract concept.
 
Interesting post OUCH. Food for thought :)
 
Very interesting posts. I define spirituality as the relationship each of us have with God or our higher being. Its the constant communication. I try to live a very spiritual life. I talk to God all day long. Thanking Him, asking for His help, etc... Of course He doesn't verbally communicate with me, but I look for His answer in other ways. People He introduces in my life, situations that may arise, etc... Sometimes money even lands on my doorstep. Has happened to me countless times. I also give back by volunteering, attending church, etc.
Unlike most people, I don't ask God to save someone I know if their life is endangered. That would be selfish of me. Instead I ask God to take away this person's suffering. Either call them home to Heaven or physically allow them to heal. Death is inevitable. My belief is that I cannot even begin to understand God's logic or his rational. Often times people ask why does God allow suffering in this world? I don't have the answer, except to say that it brings other people closer together who whitness the suffering. The question I always ask is, "What are You trying to teach me or society in general from this event?" Its not enough to ask once and you must ask the right question.
My personal testimony, is that it has completely changed my life 180 degrees. I don't judge others, even non-believers, or those that criticize my belief. I am living a life in much less fear than I once had. No longer afraid of death, no longer afraid of what people think of me, no longer afraid to communicate with others, etc... The very basic emotion of fear often makes choices for us that are not always logical or what we would ordinarily desire.
There is no point in arguing about whether there is or isn't a God. God can neither be proved nor disproved as we learned in philosophy class. I think different parts of the country share different beliefs, and am happy to say that I am surrounded by Christians where I live. Look at the statistics, in this world believers in religion far outway non-believers.

These are just my views and opinions...
 
We have to put labels on everything - a label such as a word. We all know, or at least those that have loved, the the label or word "love" does not really give you a good abstraction or realization of what love really and totally is. In fact, when asked to describe what love is, people often have difficulty. They may say, "Love is when you care for someone so much that..." and then go on to give you not an objective definition of the word but merely their own personal experience of "love". Other people reading the person's definition may even think, "That's not what I think love is!"

Love is just a word. Like God is just a word. Just like love is so much more mysterious and unfathomable than the label, God (and many other words too) share the same lack of enlightenment.

Interestingly, if you look at the words of God when he allegedly spoke to Moses on Mt. Sinai, God himself cannot put a single word or name on himself which is very curious. Read the below and in bold:

"Jahveh (Yahweh) is one of the archaic Hebrew nouns, such as Jacob, Joseph, Israel, etc. (cf. Ewald, "Lehrbuch der hebr. Sprache", 7th ed., 1863, p. 664), derived from the third person imperfect in such a way as to attribute to a person or a thing the action of the quality expressed by the verb after the manner of a verbal adjective or a participle. Furst has collected most of these nouns, and calls the form forma participialis imperfectiva. As the Divine name is an imperfect form of the archaic Hebrew verb "to be", Jahveh means "He Who is", Whose characteristic note consists in being, or The Being simply."

If that conversation actually took place then whatever it was that spoke to Moses did not want to be named or maybe could not be named and simply chose to address Himself (or Itself) as "I am" - or as named: "The Being".

It gets even more complicated too. Just as the word "love" really doesn't do the reality of love justice, so it would appear that many words do not pay homage to the subjects they describe. And not just words either. Try to paint "love". Make an image of love. You could not do love justice by any image you could create. Similarly, "The Being" warned Moses about attempting to make images of Itself. Of all ancient deities, Yahweh is uniquely abstract. All other gods could be carved or painted as an image or idol. And the "Being" is also very insistent not only on his ineffability but also on his singularity and that any other god is a "false god". Most of us have heard, "Though shalt not make unto thee any graven image..." Ever wonder why this omnipotent being would say that? Why shouldn't people make an image of this being? The reason, in my opinion is there is nothing we can create, whether stone or paint or whatever, can be an image of this Being. You can't carve love out of a piece of wood and you can't create an image of what we call God out of anything that I can think of. To do so would be to base our image of God on our own human precepts. Wouldn't it be an insult or bring about a feeling of disgust if someone attempted to depict true love out of animal parts? How can you make an image of the "Being" (the "I Am") out of something like sticks or stone or paint?

Just a few thoughts on a Monday night. Nothing for debate. I enjoy contemplating these things. I've come to realize that to truly know God and the nature of God comes with the very harsh realization that God is ultimately unknowable. That is not to say that you cannot relate to God or that you cannot find yourself in God's friendship, just simply that we are not intelligent enough to understand the full scope of the Being that is God - not all that dissimilar to the way we can't truly understand love - only be aware of it's presence. Or the way we can't truly understand the true amount of a googleplex. We can see the word and we can even represent the number but we can't understand the size of it. It is simply an abstract concept.

LOL.... maybe this whole post is an abstract concept.
I too like to ponder such things as who or what is God, what would "the being" or I am look like. If we go by the writing of the old testament i recall there being mention of humans being created in "His" image! So would it not be fair to assume that "I am" might take on Human form? or a reasonable likeness thereof? I often wonder about the dead sea scrolls!! We have known of their exsistance for some time now, but we still have not got much translation out of them. From what I remember they are said to redefine some of our teachings of God and Jesus. Now for the conspiracy theory. Could the Catholic church have squashed the translation of them because they contained some radical explanation of our modern version of religion, heaven and hell? Would it have changed our view of the church and religious system we know of so much?? Much the same way the church and governements around the world would deny the proof of extra terrestrial life! Let's face it, if either the theory of evolution or the exsistance of life outside of our galaxy can be proven, then religion as we know it just got the boot!! Where would it lead us then???

Food for thought!
 
I too like to ponder such things as who or what is God, what would "the being" or I am look like. If we go by the writing of the old testament i recall there being mention of humans being created in "His" image! So would it not be fair to assume that "I am" might take on Human form? or a reasonable likeness thereof? I often wonder about the dead sea scrolls!! We have known of their exsistance for some time now, but we still have not got much translation out of them. From what I remember they are said to redefine some of our teachings of God and Jesus. Now for the conspiracy theory. Could the Catholic church have squashed the translation of them because they contained some radical explanation of our modern version of religion, heaven and hell? Would it have changed our view of the church and religious system we know of so much?? Much the same way the church and governements around the world would deny the proof of extra terrestrial life! Let's face it, if either the theory of evolution or the exsistance of life outside of our galaxy can be proven, then religion as we know it just got the boot!! Where would it lead us then???

Food for thought!

This is fun isn't it? I like to ponder such things as well. However, I feel that man does not have the capacity to figure out who/what is God.
Three things.
1.Our Galaxy is the Milky Way. It is filled with over 100 Billion stars and planets. This we know. The Milky Way Galaxy is also ONE of over 100 Billion Galaxies that exists. Scientists know this. Scientists also know that the Odds of the "Big Bang" theory taking place is a very rare event. I don't know the numbers but recall you have a much better chance at winning the lottery.
I believe life does exist somewhere/someplace. Who's to say God didn't create this? Also, who's to say life doesn't exist in a parallel universe according to String Theory?

2.Albert Einstein's theory of E=MC^2. Einstein theorized that every atom is composed of 99.98% Energy and .02% Mass. Interesting isn't it? Talk about efficiency. You only need .02% Mass? So everything we see, touch, hear is 99.98% Energy. Amazing. Where did this Energy come from? What is this Energy? Einstein believed it was God.

3. I read a book recently about one man's experience in what he believed was Heaven. "90 Minutes in Heaven." This man was involved in a car crash and died and tells of his experience in what he believed to be Heaven.
He tells it better than I could.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ElnQUVkWsQ
 
True. Billions of stars in billions of galaxies and that's just in the observable universe. Remember that well over 90% of the matter and energy even in our universe in not observable. The universe is a good example because we cannot understand it's size. We can ponder it's size and become philosophical, and some have even claimed to accurately measure it's weight but even when you see it written down, you can't fully appreciate the immensity of billions upon billions of stars stretched across spans of such great distance that even light would take millions or billions of years to reach.

So let's face it, the universe is too large for us to understand fully. Why is it so surprizing that many other things are as well? At some point, you have to just put it down and say, "Wow, that's really large and awesome." I guess what I'm trying to say is that to truly comprehend God, you might have better luck trying to count the stars in the sky.

Regarding God appearing as a man or something "man-like" it would seem necessary for a power or being that is far beyond our understanding to appear or communicate with us in a way we would understand. Being made "in the image of God" is something we don't fully understand on any intelligent level other than what has been handed down through generations mostly through religious cults and groups. Personally I think it just simply means that, like God, we have the ability to make our own choices and be aware of our existence. We also have the ability to create. Remember now that you (yes, you reading this) also have the ability to say, "I am". Because you are aware that you do exist. I don't know why you exist or why I do or for what purpose humans were made to have this ability but we do. In that sense, we are like God in that we know we exist. Of all the matter in all the worlds in all the galaxies that we know of, no other form or formation of matter can make such a claim as, "I exist. I'm me."

I don't believe much in conspiracies but it is possible that there is and are conspiracies that mislead the masses but people of intelligence would quickly see these ruses and go another way so I don't worry about that too much. Regarding the Catholic church that was mentioned specifically, I've read the Catechism of the Catholic Church and from what I saw, it seemed only to tell a person how to be a kind and loving person. Nothing malevolent about it. Why a person should need to be told how to love is still bizarre but nevertheless, some people just may need it.

There is much difficulty in trying to discern such things because we are very likely dealing with beings that exist in more dimensions than we do. For instance, our dimensions are length, width, and depth (and time). What if these beings existed in length, width, depth, inside, outside, with, without (but in an existence without time). We can see in our own physics that certain particles seem to pass in and out of existence. Where do they go? Where are they coming from when they return?

The other thing I'd like to mention is collective intelligence. A termite by itself has no intelligence and can accomplish little or nothing. A million termites can create structures that even man would have difficulty creating. Bees in a swarm certainly behave differently than when alone. Every cell in your body is independent of the others but when you add them all up, the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts. If that's the case, and we can observe that on a small scale than perhaps even the planet as a whole has some type of rudimentary consciousness. Or what about the universe? We are part of the universe. We are aware that we exist. Can't we then say that the universe itself knows it exists? Your foot doesn't know it exists but your brain knows it does.

Just some more random thoughts. Questions of my own that only seem to create more questions.

One last thing I want to mention is the relationship between cause and effect. Every effect has a cause. Nothing comes to be or happen without something that caused it. If you go back to the beginning of our universe (if it had one) than something had to cause the effect (in this case, the effect being our universe). Maybe there where a million events that led up to the cause and effect, the creation and expansion of our universe but nevertheless, there had to be an initial cause. Something that was not caused by something else. What do we know about this initial "cause". Well we know it could not have had a beginning. Because then whatever was before it would have been the cause. So this initial cause would have had to have always been. Do you see what I'm saying? So this first cause, this first thing was not begotten by anything but rather simply always "was". I always think of this when I hear the words, "as it was in the beginning, is now, and ever shall be..."

For what it's worth anyway...
 
AHHHH funny you mention cause and effect, kind of like action and reaction. Like the butterfly effect, go back and change something and the ripples soon spread to far reaching effects, so the cause would be like the big bang........which if true sent billions of ripples through time and space, which then had the effect of creating worlds and possibly life. Was the big bang the result of perhaps this higher power we call god, and his cause created the effect of life?? These may just seem like ramblings to those that do not subscribe to such theories but as you stated OUCH, where do those little particles actually go to when they disappear, what is the cause? and what is the effect of them reappearing seemingly out of thin air?? They obviously must displace time and space because they exsist. But why do they do this? Quantum physics has been bashed by many of the scientific community as nothing more than wild specualtion and crazyness by some twisted intellects with nothing better to do. But they might have said the same of Einstein. Or Newton when he tried to explain why we do not float off into space. I personally love quantum physics and the questions it raises, one of such questions may very well be the exsistance of GOD!! Being or energy? Particle that has the ability to transfer or transport from one dimension to another? Or simply the word used to explain the unexplainable? One thing I do know or believe myself is that there are many occurances that I certainly have no explanations for or events that simply defy logic and explanation. Is this the work of GOD? Or I am?
 
It would be depend on which God you were talking about.

AHHHH funny you mention cause and effect, kind of like action and reaction. Like the butterfly effect, go back and change something and the ripples soon spread to far reaching effects, so the cause would be like the big bang........which if true sent billions of ripples through time and space, which then had the effect of creating worlds and possibly life. Was the big bang the result of perhaps this higher power we call god, and his cause created the effect of life?? These may just seem like ramblings to those that do not subscribe to such theories but as you stated OUCH, where do those little particles actually go to when they disappear, what is the cause? and what is the effect of them reappearing seemingly out of thin air?? They obviously must displace time and space because they exsist. But why do they do this? Quantum physics has been bashed by many of the scientific community as nothing more than wild specualtion and crazyness by some twisted intellects with nothing better to do. But they might have said the same of Einstein. Or Newton when he tried to explain why we do not float off into space. I personally love quantum physics and the questions it raises, one of such questions may very well be the exsistance of GOD!! Being or energy? Particle that has the ability to transfer or transport from one dimension to another? Or simply the word used to explain the unexplainable? One thing I do know or believe myself is that there are many occurances that I certainly have no explanations for or events that simply defy logic and explanation. Is this the work of GOD? Or I am?

The God(s) of the Old Testament or the God/Energy/Life Force which created the Universe. We are talking about two different things here.
 

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