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reasoning behind your style of EATING...

"Dr" Intesnity you should change your name to DR repetition or something like that? as you ask the same questions over and over again.
Why?
The answers you recieve will differ greatly depending on the "guru" you ask-whether it be Palumbo, Skip, Dante, John Meadows, Hany Rambod, etc...

nobody can map out ten years of training and diet and supplementation for you as -it will change dramatically as you go along-no plan can be carved in stone.
Follow a basic plan of stayin lean getting stronger and larger progressively in small steps adjusting diet and supps as you go vs these huge gaps of beating the nail in the wood and stop wasting time over analyzing re analyzing and questioning everything you do.
The most important thing is to listen to your body and follow your genetics and metabolim.
 
"Dr" Intesnity you should change your name to DR repetition or something like that? as you ask the same questions over and over again.
Why?
The answers you recieve will differ greatly depending on the "guru" you ask-whether it be Palumbo, Skip, Dante, John Meadows, Hany Rambod, etc...

nobody can map out ten years of training and diet and supplementation for you as -it will change dramatically as you go along-no plan can be carved in stone.
Follow a basic plan of stayin lean getting stronger and larger progressively in small steps adjusting diet and supps as you go vs these huge gaps of beating the nail in the wood and stop wasting time over analyzing re analyzing and questioning everything you do.
The most important thing is to listen to your body and follow your genetics and metabolim.

THANK YOU!!!!

:cool:
 
THANK YOU!!!!

:cool:

Massive G, Lenny, B-boy i think you are looking at this in a wrong way too damn seriously, this what i have to say, you are all taking the with some negativity attach to itself... something is bothering you about me. Now please Listen to what I have to say so that you understand my deeper intentions

I am Med Student and I have been training for the past 9 -10 years competed one 3 years back, i do not have great genetics that i could say i`ll comepete internationally or something, More so BodyBuilding is a hobby i have learnt quiet a bit from you people and others here and there and self taught, been my own guinea pig,
But with all the experience I have attained in these 9 years , I can say this for my self
1. I know Exactly How to Weight train and I am happy with my style of weight training love my training style... my training gives the appropriate results as what i expect from.( This does`nt mean that Gustavo Badell will like it too he has a different style
2. Diet :- I know how to diet exactly to gain muscle offseason I can prepare myself for precontest. I do keto diet and even if I am 20 percent BF I can get to 4-5 percent in 18-20 weeks with minimal muscle loss , (BUTprolly Phil Hernon May not like it the way I did it… he has a different approach a more efficient one than mine, AND NO MATTER WHAT he would never recommend it to any one.)
3. AAS:- I have been doing AAS for the past 6 years I do “Testosterone only cycles” I started with 500mg/test per week the conventional style and I know how to use AAS to achieve mass or getting ripped. (Craig titus may not approve of it) I was 190 lbs at 5 feet 8 inches with around 10 percent body fat (my arms measured 17 inches, could Incline Bench 265-275 x 8 nothing special). That time I decided to increase my dose, my food, so from 500mg/week I went to 1000mg-1500mg/week for maybe 2 years (4 months On And 4 months off protocol) on “testosterone only” cycles and 4 months back I was at my Best that is 232 lbs 8 percent body fat(super health) with 18.6 inch cold to 19 pumped(maybe i`ll cross 19 this year..lol). My same incline bench press has gone up to 345 x 8 I am just super happy of my achievement, I my Squats went from 315 x 8 to 455 x 12………

But this does not prove that my particular approach towards AAS is correct….. Now if B-boy had been TRAINING me HE PROLLY would have made me reach to the Goal faster, maybe with Less AAS use. SO WAS MY APPROACH THE RIGHT APPROACH OR THE WRONG ONE? who knows?

4. So What amount of "CALCULATED RISK" I need to take to reach up the goal in my mind, I will say I am not disappointed of myself body building wise. Health is good (evident from blood work) But i want to improve more.... why not? Me trying to get better at my "GAME" is no crime.

5. You can give me a intermediate bodybuilder for an year and i have to train him, do diet, AASwise totally prep him, I can promise He would not be disapponited by the results he gets, when preparing under my eye, but if Dante, Phil Hernon Massive G Tenny or B-Boy were to exchange places with me he would have got even better results .
Now what does this Convey to you?... i`ll tell you ? you people are SIMPLY more efficient than me,

IF B-boy had time to spend with warren Branch or Jay Cutler or Ronnie Coleman or Dorian Yates what would you discuss with them?
America`s foreign policy ? Global warming , treatment of Parkinsonism? No not at all , probably you will try to gain some more knowledge from their body building experience TRAINING, DIET, AAS PHYSIQUE CRITIC , pre CONTEST PREP etc etc etc(even though B-Boy himself knows a lot about it already “His own style). Why would you do that? To SIMPLY increase YOUR EFFICENCY as bodybuilder, its human nature to learn more about the things that matter to him a lot as in your case its (Bodybuilding) , it’s the Basic Human Nature to Attain more knowledge Especially about the thing that interests him a lot, or else if the person does not have the curious nature for something he loves or is important to him.

That would simply mean you don`t care for any room for improvement for something you love So much, But there is nothing that cannot be imporved,….. had there been something that cannot be improved it would be perfect, and there is nothing that is perfect (except the Almighty if you believe in him). All we HUMANS CAN DO IS TO keep MOVING TOWARDS EXCELLENCE(a never ending journey until we cannot do it any more.
I simply put up such silly but basic concept threads with “learning different Styles from you people who are better than me ” just to increase my efficiency as a body builder. Its like sharpening my axe every time I cut a tree rather than a person who never sharpens his axe and prolly some day he will not be able to cut the tree)

So prolly any one who tries to improve will look into diffferent ways to improve, No one can be casual bodybuilder and be come ronniecolemann

so for that very reason i want to learn the" EAT WHEN HUNGRY APPROACH" ...and will be hiring phil hernon ...just to learn more... there is nothing more to it. I WAN TO LEARN 5 DIFFERENT WAYS TO SKIN A CAT, i do know 2 different ways... BUT WANT TO LEARN ANOTHER style PHIL HERNON`S STYLE..."THE GROWING INTO THE SHOW". IS THERE ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT?
Hope you understand

GOOD MORNING TENNY!
 
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dr. intensity, your thread was a good thought provoking idea, and i was going along fine till you for some reason wanted to take the time to poke at someone you obviously have some sort of problem with (mr. champion). If you would have left the personal attack out, this would have been a great thread, but you decided to take an awesome thread and sling mud with it. TOO BAD. :confused:


next time keep the great idea, loose the personal attacks.

just my .02cents
 
O yea i would choose john but he would have progessively went up to those calories, depending on how his body is reacting to dietary changes.
 
dr. intensity, your thread was a good thought provoking idea, and i was going along fine till you for some reason wanted to take the time to poke at someone you obviously have some sort of problem with (mr. champion). If you would have left the personal attack out, this would have been a great thread, but you decided to take an awesome thread and sling mud with it. TOO BAD. :confused:


next time keep the great idea, loose the personal attacks.

just my .02cents

sure i never actually do the personal attack thing, this was the first time..(of course not anybody on this thread).... however b-boy i am sorry for it, i`ll make sure not to repeat this name calling personal attack, Sorry once again to lenny Tenny Massive G and others .
 
sure i never actually do the personal attack thing, this was the first time..(of course not anybody on this thread).... however b-boy i am sorry for it, i`ll make sure not to repeat this name calling personal attack, Sorry once again to lenny Tenny Massive G and others .

Now that this is out of the way., perhaps we can get back to this thread. It was/is a good one, for me anyhow.

It was a good read.

Chip
 
sure i never actually do the personal attack thing, this was the first time..(of course not anybody on this thread).... however b-boy i am sorry for it, i`ll make sure not to repeat this name calling personal attack, Sorry once again to lenny Tenny Massive G and others .

no need for apoligies

:)
 
Lets continue with the discussion,
Considering the General Caloric Formula for a 200 lean body mass guy, is
(LEAN BODY MASS) X 17.5 (usually work most) is in our case we need to feed 200 lbs guy around = 3500 calories/day.

Meal Plan 1
Meal 1 Protien 60 gram,15gram fat and 90 grams complex carbs

Meal 2 Protien 60 grams, 15 grams + 60 grams carbs

Meal 3 (Pre workout) 60 gram protien +75 grams carbs

Meal 4 (Post Workout) 60 gram protien + 75 gram dextrose

Meal 5 Protien 60 gram,30gram fat

Meal 6 Protien 60 gram,30gram fat,

PROTIEN = 360 GRAMS = 1440 CALORIES
FATS = 90 GRAMS = 900 CALORIES
CARBS = 300 GRAMS = 1200 CALORIES
TOTAL CALORIES = 3540 caloires/day.

MEAL PLAN 2
MEAL 1 60 GRAM PRO+30 GRAM FAT

MEAL 2 60 GRAM PRO+30 GRAM FAT

MEAL 3 60 GRAMS PRO + 30 GRAM FAT

( 100GRAMS OF COMPLEX CARBOHYDRATES 30MINS BEFORE WORKOUT)

MEAL 4 60 GRAMS PRO + 75 GRAMS DEXTROSE

MEAL 5 60 GRAMS PRO + 30 GRAMS FAT

MEAL 5 60 GRAMS PRO + 30 GRAMS FAT
PROTIEN = 360 GRAMS = 1440 CALORIES
FATS= 150 GRAMS = 1360CALORIES
CARBOHYDRATE = 175 GRAMS 700CALORIES
AGAIN = TOTAL CALORIES = 3500.

1. Now both the meal plans provide 360 grams of protien
2. Carbohydrate intake in meal plan 1 is 300 grams, however in the meal Plan 2 carbohydrate intake is 175, especially around the Preworkout to fill up the glycogen in the muscles. (100grams complex carbohydrate)
3. 75 grams of simple carbs post workout time where insulin receptors are highly up regulated

Now there are people who eat alot of carbohydrates example Dorian Yates, Jay Cutler.... however ther are many who are High protien, Moderate to High fats and Low carbohydrates ( Seth feorece, Dave Palumbo)

-lipogenic potential of carbohydrates are one of the main cause fat gains during offseason.
-But glycogen filled muscles are needed for high intensity training
- post workout carbohydrates are mandatory ( we cannot do anythhing about it)

but for the sake of glycogen filled muscle consuming extra carbs is likely to cause fat storage.
So in that condition consuming Carbs 45 mins before workout is enough for providing us the energy me need perform heavy workouts.### my point is if a person can perform 345 X 8 INCLINE BENCH PRESS (with 100 grams of complex carbohydrate meal 30mins prior training) his bench press 345 x 8 will still be the same if he ate 250 grams of carbohydrates before training)....?

Consuming fats with most the time 5 meals/day will serve us 3 purposes
1. Minimal effect on Insulin (insulin leading to glycogen storage and then fats storage)
2. Protien sparing effect.
3. Provides Energy to the resting muscle tissue.

this strategy may work for both Carbsensitive individual as well as a Non Carbohydrate sensitive meal.

please share your opinion for the carbohydrate consumption timing.
 
It might help if you tried to summarize what you're saying dr, your text resembles pages out of a book instead of internet forum posts.
 
i am sure you guys must have noticed some unsual things start happeneing when it comes to doses.
EXAMPLE A:- Now the usual stats of a begginner who wants to do AAS are 170 lbs 5 feet 8 inches almost 16 inch arms lol (80 percent times) is adviced Testosterone E,C or Sustanon 250mg x 2 weekly for 10 weeks.

what is the actual dose Total dose/Bodyweight? = 500/170 = 2.9 mg/lbs.
if we use the same 2.9mg/lbs 200lbs body = 580mg/week
so for 220 lbs guy it becomes 640mg/week
so a 250 lbs guy needs = 750mg/week

Now Dave Palumbo Advises the "same cycle" to a 170 pounder to 240 bodybuilder
ie 1000 mg Testosterone and 600mg Deca/Boldenone + 1000mg sustanon +225 mg tren A

EXAMPLE - 2 1000mg test and 600mg deca = 1600mg/week/in any bodybuilder
a 200 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1600mg
a 210 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1680mg
a 220 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1760mg
a 230 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1840mg
a 280 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass= 2240mg

1.now a guy who does 3mg/kg will require a very small increment in doses...look at the above example at 170 lbs the guy made great gains, and if he keeps the same ratio of 3mg/kg then at 250mg he will only need 750mg/week
which is just a 250mg bump.

2.lets assume the guy a 200lbs guy who DID PALUMBO CYCLE
AT 200 LBS he needed 1600 then after 80 pounds of muscle
only needs to bumps the dose by 640mg. .... at every 10 pounds on 80 extra grams of AAS is needed.

-when this is the case why do we judge some ones doses by "body weight" or muscle mass. some just speak with no basis its like a 200lbs should go 750 -850mg/more than enough
225-1000mg is enough and 250 lbs--2500 is just fine (arguement of androgen receptor proliferation duet to increase muscle mass is non sense...no person can have so many androgen receptors that it becomes less for the body to grow, no one actually will ever come to know how many androgen receptors does he have.


IN MY OPINION THE HORMONAL REQUIREMENTS FOR MUSCLE GROWTH SHOULD DO NOT DEPEND ON THE MUSCLE MASS OF THE PERSON,

OR HORMONAL REQUIREMENTS WILL VARY TO A VERY INSIGNIFICANT DEGREE ON THE BASIS OF MUSCLE MASS.
its the cycle planning that is needed, and the point of diminishing returns doses wise that should be established


what do you think guys?
 
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It might help if you tried to summarize what you're saying dr, your text resembles pages out of a book instead of internet forum posts.

i assure you its all coming from my head, but many people do post long posts....bigger than mine....i guess..i am the unlucky one.. or probably u dont like what i write.. i am just explaining my point, so i needed to write more....
anyways i`try writing less.
 
Wasn't slamming you Dr I, just the fact that I have seen this post over and over again...one of these days I am going to write up a critical mass thread and outline how I got the mass and figured out to keep it and all the mistakes I made that hindered gains over 20 years...diet drugs training recoup stress injuries sides etc...but from that you guys will see how hard it is to follow a plan and then make adjustments along the way and once you learn -what you respond best too-foods, training style exercises, ergogens, it really gets easy down the line.
 
Wasn't slamming you Dr I, just the fact that I have seen this post over and over again...one of these days I am going to write up a critical mass thread and outline how I got the mass and figured out to keep it and all the mistakes I made that hindered gains over 20 years...diet drugs training recoup stress injuries sides etc...but from that you guys will see how hard it is to follow a plan and then make adjustments along the way and once you learn -what you respond best too-foods, training style exercises, ergogens, it really gets easy down the line.

would love to see that massive g!! ill b waiting!!!
 
Wasn't slamming you Dr I, just the fact that I have seen this post over and over again...one of these days I am going to write up a critical mass thread and outline how I got the mass and figured out to keep it and all the mistakes I made that hindered gains over 20 years...diet drugs training recoup stress injuries sides etc...but from that you guys will see how hard it is to follow a plan and then make adjustments along the way and once you learn -what you respond best too-foods, training style exercises, ergogens, it really gets easy down the line.

would pay for this lol
 
It might help if you tried to summarize what you're saying dr, your text resembles pages out of a book instead of internet forum posts.

sorry Moen this will be my last long post and a very long one,

just trying to share my opinions with you guys:-

my point is about ESTABLISHING "WHEN TO INCREASE YOUR DOSE" and DIET in a SEQUENTIAL PROGRESSIVE MANNER

There should be a sense of progression and sequence in utilizing AAS and Diet. As bodybuilders we are always on a journey to create more and more (contractile protein..lol)

Just to explain my point of view
1. Let`s start with a Basic formula (sake of simplicity) Now let`s create a Standard (hypothetical) for calculating Calories of LEAN BODY MASS x 18.
So now we`ll start with calculating calories for 200lbs 210lbs 220lbs 230lbs 240lbs and 250 lbs it comes down to;- the calculations below, 200 Lean Body Mass x 18 calories = 3600 Cal
1. 210 Lean Body Mass x 18 calories = 3780 Cal
2. 220 Lean Body Mass x 18 calories = 3960 Cal
3. 230 Lean Body Mass x 18 calories = 4140 Cal
4. 240 Lean Body Mass x 18 calories = 4320 Cal
5. 250 lean Body Mass x 18 calories = 4500 Cal

2. If u Carefully look at the “Total Calories consumed” you will find that only 180 calories are needed increased to the previous diet a Bodybuilder Gains 10lbs Pure muscle (900 gram contractile protein)

3. Why am I telling you this? As we know (Creating 1800grams of Contractile protein) or 20 lbs muscle growth will be a phenomenal difference.
But people over-emphasize their diet, Example as a 170 pounder starts consuming the amount of food as that of a 240 lbs guy would eat will gain more muscle?...i don’t think so..
And If he was consuming a 220 or 230 lbs Bodybuilder`s diet.. will he gain more muscle…. I don’t think so?

4. If u think (just for the heck of it) a 170 pounder will gain More by eating a 240 bodybuilder Diet, then will he gain less muscle if he consumed a 230 lbs Body builder diet, In my opinion the 170 pounder should only do the 1700 x 18 calories = 3060 calories/day, but if plateaus at 175lbs then by increasing calories will only lead to FAT DEPOSITION.

5. OVER DOING MACRONUTRIENTS For example for a 200lbs guy 200grams of Fats and 800grams carbohydrates are protein sparing, and he is gaining muscle as well as fat, now if the same guy did 100grams of fat and 400grams of carbohydrates, they will have “ the same protein sparing effect as compared to the macros above. so overdoing protien macros will lead to fat gains.

6. Even though a lot of amino acids are available to the muscle cell of a natural bodybuilder but after 2-3 years of solid training, the amount of hormone/muscle cell becomes less. So this lowered Hormonal stimulus is not sufficient to influence the DNA for gene transcription to create more Actin and Myosin.

7. Now this is the time to administer AAS, compensating for the low hormone/muscle cell ration and on top of it, Bombarding the muscle cell androgen receptors which reach the muscle cell nuclei attaching to the hormone response element and gene transcription leading INCREASED SYNTHESIS OF ACTIN AND MYOSIN by utilizing all available the amino acid it needs .

8. Plateau = no progressive lifting is happening = No muscle gains. Now it~s more of an Hormonal Issue ( if he is natural then a basic 400-600mg/testosterone with get the job done, if he was “On cycle” then he will have to increase the dose.)Once he reaches 180 lbs then he should eat 180 x 18 = 3240 calories/day with the same cycle + 80mg extra.)

OVER ALL MY VIEW IS
1. One should not over-expect from a diet.

2. If some 200 lbs guy needs 3600 calories, His protein intake should be 2grams x 200 = 400 grams =1600 calories and rest of the calories from carbohydrates and healthy fats

3. If the person who is doing the above 2 points and still plateaus at some point then it has almost nothing to do with the diet (no increase in calories needed) it is the efficiency uptake of Amino – Acids by HORMONAL MANIPULATION.(phil hernon taught)

4. AAS only increases the efficiency of your “personal DNA” if Mr A creates 5units of muscle growth AAS may lead to 25 units of muscle growth.
But Mr D already had the natural availability of 10 units of muscle growth On AAS administration he is creating 50 units of muscle growth..

SIMILARLY WITH AAS
EXAMPLE:- AFTER ESTABLISHING THE STANDARD (HYP0THETICAL ) 1000mg test and 600mg deca = 1600mg/week FOR A 200lbs guy.
a 200 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1600mg
a 210 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1680mg
a 220 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1760mg
a 230 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1840mg
a 240 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=1920mg
a 250 lbs guy x 8mg/lean body mass=2000mg.
again dose is upped by 80mg/10lbs of muscle gain

Significance :- usually a bodybuilder gains 100 pounds of muscle or (9000 grams of contractile protein ) from the starting to the end of his carrier which may take 5 year or 10 years. People bump up calories and doses too early. On average 10 pounds of muscle/year

RESULT/Conclusion :- THE NEED TO INCREASE CALORIES AND DOSES IS VERY LESS, ONCE YOU HAVE ESTABLISHED YOUR CALORIC INTAKE, then if u dont progress its the hormone or to some extent training, It may be needed may be “after a year” and that too, at very low extent as you can see above
FOR AAS -80mg/10lbs /
FOR CALORIES – 180CAL/10LBS

Lastly why do we eat and administer AAS ? So that we can outperform our own previous weeks performance which will lead to muscle hypertrophy. But this cannot be done every week for 52 weeks therefore “cycle planning” is very important, 4months on 4 months off and again 4months on, And I think a person will respond to the minimal(500) to moderate (1500mg) doses while eliminating instant gratification.

My main reason to create this thread was to create an Efficient way or a Sequence of progressive diet and Progressive AAS use.

NOW PLEASE READ IT, I WROTE IT WITH A LOT OF ENTHUSIASM

(This will be my last long post... just for moean)
Dr Intensity..
 
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The reason i am writing contractile protien WHEREVER I MENTION THE WORD MUSCLE THEY EITHER THINK I AM TALKING ABOUT 90GRAMS OF PROTIEN IN A POUND OF MUSCLE....OR I AM TALKING ABOUT 1 POUND OF MUSCLE WHICH IS WATER 70PERCENT 20 PERCENT PROTIEN _+ 10 PERCENT LIIPIDS.....is because there was a huge debate at the other site.. WHAT IS A MUSCLE? ...LOL
figuring out ....

HEY MASSIVE G,
THIS IS FOR U AS YOU SEEMS TO SCIENTIFIC PERSON, SO A TOKEN ON FRIENDSHIP WITH YOU.


AS OF NOW MY BEST ONLINE BUDDY(DANTE TRUDEL) DOES`NT SEEM TO POST MUCH THESE DAYS...MASSIVE G IF YOU MEET HIM THEN CONVEY MY REGARDS TO HIM AND HIS FAMILY.....

What amount of Calories are needed to create a muscle,
or Energy cost to create a pound of muscle? one was talking in terms fat free mass gains of 30 lbs are easily availiable in a 30 day period.

while the other guy was talking in terms of protien synthesis, high amount of energy is needed for the numerous process that occurs at the time of protien synthesis .... example sulfonation, lipidation ubiquitinaion and million other such process of Modifications etc

so its likeTHIS
written by a DR. phd in cellular biology.
First of all, the cost of making a pound of muscle is NOT the same as the calories per pound of muscle. Calories per pound of muscle varies between about 700 and 1500 calories, depending on its fat percentage. This is probably what ¾ of the people think it costs to make a pound of muscle. Sadly, it’s flat wrong. It costs a lot more to put this complex and highly organized piece of molecular machinery together than it does to take it apart. Nevertheless, guru mike Arnold has stated unequivocally that it costs 800 calories to make a pound of muscle.

To start with, theoretical calculations are way off. Some too large, some too small. Some theoretical calculations require only 4 moles of atp to make 1 mole of protein. However, this is only the cost of forming the peptide bond between two amino acids. There are a zillion other costs involved with muscle synthesis: there is rna transport, translational regulation costs, costs for correct folding of a large fraction of polypeptides, costs for vesicular transport for membrane proteins and secreted proteins, costs for phosphorylating many proteins (which must be paid over and over again) for various functions integral to getting them to the right place and integrated into the muscle, costs for glycosylating proteins with sugars (this can get very expensive), costs for a zillion other modifications, from sulfation to lipidation to ubiquitination. In summary, creating a pound of muscle requires a multitude of energy expenditures that are not correctly accounted by theoretical calculations.

Therefore, I bring you the empirical calculations we have. These measurements have not been done with human flesh for obvious reasons. While respiration has been measured in whole humans, you cannot get an accurate cost of protein synthesis in muscle without taking out a big hunk of tissue and chemically blocking everything else that costs energy, thereby revealing the cost of synthesis. To my knowledge, they have not done these kinds of ex-vivo respiration experiments in humans.

So they have done it in calf muscle and pig muscle. Pig muscle is probably the better model and here’s what they find: the cost varies widely between about as low as 2300 calories per pound to 8500 calories per pound (see Pennevis and Houlihan, 1992; see Adeola et al, 1989). I’ve the Pennevis and Houlihan values for mmol atp per gram of protein synthesized and calculated it every way it could reasonably be calculated, and that is the lowest range I get.

I do have a great human example wherein humans trained for 6 months with and without human growth hormone. They were fed the same and there was no difference in caloric intake, and the GH group got 6.3 pounds extra lean body mass and lost 2.64 lbs more fat. They ate a mean 2660 calories per day with a mean body weight of about 72 kg (158 lbs). If we assume the most mike-friendly situation that the extra “lean body mass” is fully accounted for by the difference in fat loss, then the lean body mass cost was over 1500 calories per pound.
But here’s the punchline: Not a single pound of it was actually muscle, by their measure. No change in muscle synthesis, no change above controls in strength, nothing. 6 lbs gained, zero muscle, at a cost of 1500 calories. The study is Yarasheski et al., 1992, in the Journal of the American physiology society.

It is possible to gain a pound of muscle a day.

If you are a 20 kg (44 lb) adolescent pig given an ad libitum diet of 7000 calories per day (Adeola et al., 1989, british journal of nutrition). That should make everyone realize how laughable 32 lbs of muscle is in 39 days with 1200 calories above bmr in adult humans.

A reasonable calculation of a 20 kg pig’s basal metabolic rate is 800 calories per day. That leaves 6200 calories per day. The average fat mass was calculated at 27%. 1.8 lb per day were gained. Lean body mass accounted for 73% of the gain. There are 3500 calories in a lb of fat, so you can calculate the calories to make the 1.31 lb of muscle (73% of 1.8). That value is 2928 calories per day over.
This is in line with the atp calculations of Pannevis and houlihan, which were 2300 to 8500.

The other big problem trying to gain muscle is that muscle protein is also continually being degraded, so that the net production in an adult human is just a tiny bit more than the net loss. Steroids are well known to enhance synthesis, but there is no evidence that I know of that they inhibit breakdown.

Keep in mind also that high protein diets have two effects: They increase muscle synthesis, but they also increase thermogenesis, so that a typical bodybuilder would be on the high end for cost of muscle making. This is well-known and studied, and I thank layne for bringing it up.


let me know your opinion guys
Thanks
Dr intensity.
 
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wow

Dr. Intensity i love ya bro!
but you have managed to single handedly take all of the fun out of the JOURNEY of building muscle lol!

no body exists in a vaccum. genetics, stress, money, time, health, etc etc all have influences on routine and appetite and strength and etc etc. so unfortunately as much as we might all like to sum up muscle building into a mathematical equation we cannot.

the most effective way i have learned to build muscle is by getting a macro ratio that is conducive to your goals and then over time up hormones. thats really about it. the up in hormones will cause strength which will up metabolism which will in turn boost hunger which will up muscle gains which will boost strength which will up metabolism etc etc etc i found that as i got bigger i ate more and as i got leaner i ate more.
i might be wasting my breath here but i just want to remind everyone that it really is a simple process in the grand scheme of things.
proper food+proper training+proper drugging= proper muscle gains

there are no absolutes tho. no equation that can be applied to everyone. too many other factors.

to answer the original question.
i think those two guys on that dose would look amazing similar. thats enough juice to keep gains/metabolism very high and so even the one eating more carbs will still be lean. only difference is the one eating more carbs may feel better cuz he has more carbs while the other one might be feeling a bit more deprived. hypothetical of course. impossible to know.
-JS
 
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i assure you its all coming from my head, but many people do post long posts....bigger than mine....i guess..i am the unlucky one.. or probably u dont like what i write.. i am just explaining my point, so i needed to write more....
anyways i`try writing less.

Not meant as a personal attack on you dr!
 

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