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reasoning behind your style of EATING...

dr intensity

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Hi guys,
Let`s have some healthy discussion on different views of people with different opinions and approaches on the Dietary aspect of our game (Bodybuilding)
Consider this as a hypothetical Scenario

A 202 lbs competitor(john) at 4 percent is cloned and another exactly identical 202lbs competitor (Danny) at 4 percent body fat is developed.

Now john is on a diet of 4500 calories
Protein = 450 grams = 1800 calories
Carbohydrate=450grams = 1800 calories
Fats = 100 grams = 900calories

is on a Sustanon 250 “pyramiding dosed” cycle of 12 weeks
week 1 250mg/week
week 2 500mg/week
week 3 750mg/week
week 4 1000mg/week
week 5 1250mg/week
week 6 1500mg/week
week 7 1750mg/week
week 8 2000mg/week
week9 2250mg/week
week 10 2500mg/week
week 11 2750/week
week 12 3000/week

however, the clone Danny
is on a diet of 3200 calories
with Protein=450grams= 1800 calories
Fats = 100grams = 900calorie Carbohydrate = 125grams = 500calories (pre and post workout)
With the same pyramiding dosed cycle

week 1 250mg/week
week 2 500mg/week
week 3 750mg/week
week 4 1000mg/week
week 5 1250mg/week
week 6 1500mg/week
week 7 1750mg/week
week 8 2000mg/week
week 9 2250mg/week
week 10 2500mg/week
week 11 2750/week
week 12 3000/week
(* They progressively lifted for the 12 weeks…no plateau occurred all n all progressive lifting) Both are eating 450grams of protien
questions

1. will they gain equal amount of muscle? why
2. will John achieve greater muscle mass than Danny or vice versa? why
3. Is calorie surplus over-rated?

4. In the longer run may be john and Danny both want to compete at 225 lbs...who out of the 2 will achieve it faster.?


The purpose of this thread is to differentiate the opinions of
-people who
advocate Calorie Surplus and advocating 6000 calories and 7000 calories and do not worry about excess body fat. etc

- people who believe in "lean gains are possible" eating only that what is required.


please share your reasoning behind your "STYLE OF THE GAME"
####### please concentrate on muscle gains only ...please dont discuss Health or Doses /SIZE]

WHO OUT THE 2 WILL GAIN MORE LEAN MUSCLE TISSUE--- AND IF U think JOHN GAINS MORE MUSCLE TISSUE THEN BY HOW MUCH?

IF HE GAINS 2 POUNDS MORE THAN DANNY, IS IT WORTH IT?

AND IF HE GAINS 10 POUNDS MORE THAN DANNY ...THEN IT IS CERTIANLY WORTH IT.


THANK YOU
cheers:)
 
Last edited:

PHIL HERNON

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Well

John will die of heart disease and kidney failure much earlier...............heck, he may even have a blood clot on the plane ride to the show.
 

dr intensity

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John will die of heart disease and kidney failure much earlier...............heck, he may even have a blood clot on the plane ride to the show.
why so?

you don`t believe in calorie surplus? is it so?

i believe in your eating approach"eating when hungry" right now i am poor (no money to pay you)..., although in another 6-8 months i`ll be making you my teacher......i know i will win the "best student award from Phil hernon training institute"......BEST training and eating style

i`ll pay an extra sum of money just to learn...how to post in riddles..lol?
 

Creation

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hard to say with so many different variables but imo the more carbs will have much more muscle growth overall
 

dr intensity

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hard to say with so many different variables but imo the more carbs will have much more muscle growth overall
no variables every thing is same.

genetic response to drugs
genetic reaponse to training

even protien intake is the same 450 grams of protien....only difference is PROTIEN SPARING NUTRIENTS.


what is you rationale behind extra carbohydrates = extra muscle growth....protien sparing effect?

insulin driven amino acid to muscle cell..?. or more carbs more hydrated muscle cells...?
 

dr intensity

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i dare all you forum great forum members of this great site
and especially
Big A
DOGGCRAPP
homonunculus,
Johnny Smiles
Magnum,
MightyJohn,
BigChef,
Shelby,
chris250,
buselmo
and one and only B-boy

to give your opinion....lol:D
 

reebokrunner456

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i believe in your eating approach"eating when hungry"
For some that may be true, but that approach is definitely NOT for everyone. If I lived by that rule, I'd LITERALLY consume 5,000-6,000+++ calories per day (and fyi: i'm a gal). :eek: :(
 

Lee Salado

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I think since they're both identical, the same thing will work for both of them.

The reason for the variety of diets/training regimes is the variety of people.


And I think what Phil was saying is excessive calories + drugs = health problems.

Since they are the same except for their caloric intake, the one consuming the excessive amount of calories will be likely to see problems sooner.
 

dr intensity

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for the Calorie Surplus believers if you think that john who is eating 4500 calories a day that john may gain more muscle than Danny who is eating 3200 calories...

lets say Danny gains 10 lbs of "lean muscle tissue" ?

So how much More muscle will John gain than Danny?
2lbs "lean muscle tissue"
4lbs "lean muscle tissue"
8lbs "lean muscle tissue",

assuming if john gains 2 pounds more than danny`s 10 pounds,
So john gains total 12 pounds "lean Muscle tissue" is it worth eating 4500 calories.
is John Paying just too much for so less?

Can john gain 7-10 more pounds than danny = total 17-20lbs ...if yes... then certainly justifiable.?

what do you guys think?
 

chemistery-brain

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i think that everything in excess will lead to more health problem so more food= more digestif system stress, but i think that when you take 3 gram of test you have enough stress on the body to worry about than the 500 extra calorie...
 

PHIL HERNON

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Well

For some that may be true, but that approach is definitely NOT for everyone. If I lived by that rule, I'd LITERALLY consume 5,000-6,000+++ calories per day (and fyi: i'm a gal). :eek: :(
And if you needed 5-6 thousand calories a day? Understanding the concept is the first step.
 

PHIL HERNON

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Exactly

i think that everything in excess will lead to more health problem so more food= more digestif system stress, but i think that when you take 3 gram of test you have enough stress on the body to worry about than the 500 extra calorie...
This is like a person stranded in the ocean worried about rain..........
 

buselmo

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they will both gain the same amount of muscle, and they would've both gained more muscle if they took the protein and cals down a notch... yes, took it down a notch...

john will gain more fat than danny, but both will look retardedly fat (they're both only on test, right? no gh or t3... right?)

both their waists will grow, but john will look pregnant.

john will lose more mass dieting down for a contest, since he thinks he needs to eat 4500 cals to gain weight when he's around 200 lbs.

both of them will not gain the optimal muscle mass they could've gained on their cycle because they felt sleepy and lethargic during their training sessions due to having 5 lbs of food in their stomachs.

and as phil said... john will die of a heart attack on the plane to the contest, and his friends and family will blame it on the gear, and not for eating like an obese fuck.
people tend to forget that a normal human being will gain fat eating a little over 2000 cals... and don't kid yourself and think that iron banging for 45 minutes burns more than 300 cals

4500 cals at 200 lbs... must have around 3 billion tapeworms in his his damn intestines... even if he did, he'd still get fat... lol!!
 

gt1

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good question, and good answer buselmo :headbang:
 

EDED

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they will both gain the same amount of muscle, and they would've both gained more muscle if they took the protein and cals down a notch... yes, took it down a notch...

john will gain more fat than danny, but both will look retardedly fat (they're both only on test, right? no gh or t3... right?)

both their waists will grow, but john will look pregnant.

john will lose more mass dieting down for a contest, since he thinks he needs to eat 4500 cals to gain weight when he's around 200 lbs.

both of them will not gain the optimal muscle mass they could've gained on their cycle because they felt sleepy and lethargic during their training sessions due to having 5 lbs of food in their stomachs.

and as phil said... john will die of a heart attack on the plane to the contest, and his friends and family will blame it on the gear, and not for eating like an obese fuck.
people tend to forget that a normal human being will gain fat eating a little over 2000 cals... and don't kid yourself and think that iron banging for 45 minutes burns more than 300 cals

4500 cals at 200 lbs... must have around 3 billion tapeworms in his his damn intestines... even if he did, he'd still get fat... lol!!
ahhah funny reply

'retardedly fat' lol
 

tenny

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your talking about a few hundred grams of carbs difference here

who really cares........

and anyway......you'll be suprised how a person can adapt
to certain eating styles and diets

then some cant

its all relavant.......is this a trick question???

:eek:
 

S2N

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Good question. We will never know the answer because we dont know what their genetic responce to diet, training and suppementation is
 

alpmaster

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Both will feel like absolute shit, John will also look like shit. Gyno will look like ringpops inside their tits.




OP, what the hell is your obsession with 3g of test?
 

kid1dakota

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your talking about a few hundred grams of carbs difference here

who really cares........

and anyway......you'll be suprised how a person can adapt
to certain eating styles and diets

then some cant

its all relavant.......is this a trick question???

:eek:
That was my first thought Tenny and especially in an active person that is carrying a good amount of muscle mass.You post this referring to a person diseased,elderly,inactive this could be an issue.

Some of these questions are really just splitting hairs in the grand scheme of things.

Dr. Intensity I like you brother and your a smart eager to learn young guy,but your getting "paralysis of analysis". Your looking for "the secret" and there isn't one.
Not to offend anyone but,D.I. you are waaayyyy more intelligent and know mountains more about the body,physiology,nutrition than some of the folks you are asking this question to.
 
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