Shoulder problems/ joint scope. Is this just inevitable or what?

[abolish the weak]

Getting to that point where my left delt AC joint just hurts alot. I went to the Dr. about a yr ago and got a Cortisone shot, and had X-rays. He told me I'd eventually need it scoped because the joint did not have as much room to move freely anymore, he termed it "impingement injury" I went lighter and easy for awhile, eventually was able to go heavy again briefly. So now the fucker is coming back, hurts like a bitch to sleep. almost any way I sleep it hurts. I sleep on my stomach and my arm is extended and delt gets stiff/sore, on my back the weight of my chest drives back into my delt and hurts, on my side... forget it!!! Other side, now the delt folds over and the arm hangs. Very annoying. How much strength in the long run would a scope take away? I know its a simple outpatient procedure, but is this something that will never let me bench w/ 400 lbs again? Should I avoid it at all costs and work through it? I am 28 yrs old for the record. Thanks anyone who can chime in

 

[Jarconis]

have you seen a chiro that does ART?

 

[abolish the weak]

have you seen a chiro that does ART?

Not yet, just orthopedic guy. What exaclty is ART?

 

[smootheavy]

Not yet, just orthopedic guy. What exaclty is ART?

Active Release Therapy...

I had/have the same injury...was told by doc surgery was inevitable...went to a chiropractic-kinesiologist and he worked with me a bit, gave me some phys-therapy exercises and I healed it myself...I dont really have probs with it anymore BUT pre injury I could press a little over 400...since the injury (4 years ago) I havent pressed more than 335 without "feeling" it (feels like the AC joint is going to explode)

HOWEVER, I am not a competative lifter so I havent really pressed the issue...pun intended BTW I am a competative MMA fighter and it hasent hampered my performance in my sport at all

 

[abolish the weak]

Active Release Therapy...

I had/have the same injury...was told by doc surgery was inevitable...went to a chiropractic-kinesiologist and he worked with me a bit, gave me some phys-therapy exercises and I healed it myself...I dont really have probs with it anymore BUT pre injury I could press a little over 400...since the injury (4 years ago) I havent pressed more than 335 without "feeling" it (feels like the AC joint is going to explode)

HOWEVER, I am not a competative lifter so I havent really pressed the issue...pun intended BTW I am a competative MMA fighter and it hasent hampered my performance in my sport at all

Good to know, thanks a bunch.

 

[mrshoulders]

I have the same prob bro only I think I have a supraspinatus tear...Had an MRI and am going to the ortho Dr on Mon. I am at the point where I don't care what they need to do, just fix it

 

[Chrisco915]

I have the same prob bro only I think I have a supraspinatus tear...Had an MRI and am going to the ortho Dr on Mon. I am at the point where I don't care what they need to do, just fix it

I think the same way.

How long have you had the injury. Chances are if you have been milking this for a period of time and it continues to come back.......then how long are you willing putting of the inevitable? Chances are, even with ART, you may not recover as well as you would if you just had the scope and ran the full recovery and rehab. Depends what you want to do.......in 6 months do you want to be back to your old self or still trying to find a way around the scope and not lifting the way you want to?

 

[jrs]

I was to a point where I couldn't lift my arms overhead. I completely stopped training. Iced. Had Active Release Therapy done. Ultrasound and chiropractic work. Stretching and heat. Swimming and ROM work. Cortisone and Anti Inflammatories. At the time, there was NO info about this procedure. Fortunately for you, I had both shoulders scoped.

I had impingement and degeneration in both AC joints. After so long I couldn't take it anymore. I could barely take a shower at this point. Everything hurt so bad from the degeneration and wild inflammation. I had one shoulder scoped, and 3 months later the next.

My only regret is not having it done sooner. In one month pre-op both shoulders I had full range of motion, and in 2-3 months I was stronger than I had ever been.

If it's structural impingement and degeneration, NOTHING besides surgery will fix it. You'll only be wasting time and money. Trust me, I know. Go talk to a sports ortho.

 

[Armageddon]

Bor I have the same problem and when the joint gets that way it can develope bursitis. This is when the tendon(tendonititis) get inflammed but the joint has developed little spurs in it and it cuts away at the tendon. Do the ART therapy and chiropractic care. I've had this problem since 1999 and refuse to have surgery. I don't care what anyone say your shoulder will never be the same!! Mine happend from a football injury but can just happen over time from heavy weights. I'm dealing with this right now as we speak, if ya don't stay on top of it, it comes back and flares up.
I had 2 buddies on my team with the same problem, they both elected for the surgery. Orthopedic told them NO PRESSING MOVEMENT AND NOTHING OVER HEAD!!! Said to try very very light. Well 1 of them thought he felt better and came back and played. Next game he blew the other one right out. They shaved an Inch off his collar bone on both sides and now his shoulders droop more and he can't pick up over 45 lbs for chest or shoulders. Proves to me that I should keep up with the ART and never, never have surgery unless it is utterly necessary!

 

[jrs]

Bor I have the same problem and when the joint gets that way it can develope bursitis. This is when the tendon(tendonititis) get inflammed but the joint has developed little spurs in it and it cuts away at the tendon. Do the ART therapy and chiropractic care. I've had this problem since 1999 and refuse to have surgery. I don't care what anyone say your shoulder will never be the same!! Mine happend from a football injury but can just happen over time from heavy weights. I'm dealing with this right now as we speak, if ya don't stay on top of it, it comes back and flares up.
I had 2 buddies on my team with the same problem, they both elected for the surgery. Orthopedic told them NO PRESSING MOVEMENT AND NOTHING OVER HEAD!!! Said to try very very light. Well 1 of them thought he felt better and came back and played. Next game he blew the other one right out. They shaved an Inch off his collar bone on both sides and now his shoulders droop more and he can't pick up over 45 lbs for chest or shoulders. Proves to me that I should keep up with the ART and never, never have surgery unless it is utterly necessary!

If they take an inch off.. you will have severe problems. It's a matter of a few centimeters. Make sure your doc knows his shit!

Your shoulder will never be the same after the INJURY. Not after the TREATMENT. I'm stronger than I was before, and I was very strong at that point too. I can't do behind the neck presses, but then again, I never could before. That's it. I'm glad I didn't go through years of misery and lack of progress. 10 steps backward, got the surgery and jumped way ahead and never looked back.

 

[abolish the weak]

If they take an inch off.. you will have severe problems. It's a matter of a few centimeters. Make sure your doc knows his shit!

Your shoulder will never be the same after the INJURY. Not after the TREATMENT. I'm stronger than I was before, and I was very strong at that point too. I can't do behind the neck presses, but then again, I never could before. That's it. I'm glad I didn't go through years of misery and lack of progress. 10 steps backward, got the surgery and jumped way ahead and never looked back.

interesting, I had a guy at my gym trying to convince me to go and get the scope done now, because I'm only 28 yrs old. He said the younger you are the better, not to wait. My biggest issue with the damn thing is when I sleep. There is no comfortable way to sleep. This thing used to be worse, and then it DID get better over time. I cut out heavy military pressing and now do nothing more than 45 lb dumb bells over hea, but yes I still bench with over 400 lbs. Anyways, this is a good thread response, thanks to all you guys

 

[Chrisco915]

interesting, I had a guy at my gym trying to convince me to go and get the scope done now, because I'm only 28 yrs old. He said the younger you are the better, not to wait. My biggest issue with the damn thing is when I sleep. There is no comfortable way to sleep. This thing used to be worse, and then it DID get better over time. I cut out heavy military pressing and now do nothing more than 45 lb dumb bells over hea, but yes I still bench with over 400 lbs. Anyways, this is a good thread response, thanks to all you guys

I guess it really comes down whether or not you want to be continually limited. You mentioned it came back.........chances are it will continue to do so.

I had a ACLscope on my knee when I was 19 and then the other knee when I was 32........huuuuuuuuuuuuuge difference in recovery time(2 months verses 6 months). It really is not that big a deal surgery wise........in and out in 4 hours. No issues since.

 

[cjjrwe]

I have the same issues and will be getting surgery in the next 8 weeks, I went through all the other BS and nothing really worked. I know 7 or 8 guys that had the same surgery and everyone recovered better off than they were before, all remain highly active (athletic level) and most lift weights without issues, so after two plus years of suffering I opted for getting scoped. Good luck.

 

[GoneForFuckinEver4]

I have the exact same thing going on in my left shoulder! Last year, when it first happened I went to my doctor and he said it looks like I have a tear in my rotator cuff and he sent me to a Ortho. The Ortho Doc then tells me that my shoulder joint has inflammation and prescribed me a medicine called "MOBIC" (for inflammation of the joints) after like 2 weeks of taking this medication the pain disappeared completely and I was able to get back to my hard, heavy workouts with no problem.

But now, almost a year later the same exact shoulder pain has returned again and doing the same thing as before, messing up benching where's I usually do 225lbs for 25 reps, now I can barely do 12-15 reps cause of the pain and it's even worst on the Incline Bench! This time, I'm really thinking the scoping procedure is the only way to fix this and to prevent any future problems with it.

 

[Armageddon]

i'm glad surgery worked out for you guys, but it's just not for me. I tore my knee up last fall, not too bad but enough to need surgery. I feel there is a big difference between the 2 surgeries. I tore my cartiladge ring and it folded over and prevented me from straightening or bending my leg comepletely, I also tore the miniscus. They did surgery within 3days of a doc visit. I was back on the field within 3 weeks, busted my ass in rehab to get the range of motion and flexability back. So I know all about the surgery aspect.
There is alot that goes into the maintanence of a shoulder injury. If it is something like bursitis that you have there are things that can be done to control it and many of it was stated here already. Once your feeling better you still need to keep up on it and not forget because your feeling better. I bet if everyone that had relief due to the art therapy would have went back for occassional visits in a years time the injury would still be under control. eating habits affect this type of injury as well. I'm no doctor but I have been dealing with this type of severe injury since 1999 and it actually started back in high school in the middle 90's. So I have figured a few things out with it in this time frame. We all think we eat healthy but the bodybuilder diet really isn't the best in overall healthy and recovery. Once I added more fruits/veggies/ alittle carbs with the protein it really helped.
I just think there are alternatives to going under the "knife" lol

 

[Big_Truck]

Active Release Technique is useful post surgery for re-gaining mobility and breaking up adhesions.

Pre surgery it would be a waste of money, if you actually have serious problems that would make you believe you need surgery is the answer.

 

[Armageddon]

Surgery isn't always the answer. There are alternatives to it that may take alittle more work. Surgery is a neccessity when all other avenues have been tried.

 

[Chrisco915]

Surgery isn't always the answer. There are alternatives to it that may take alittle more work. Surgery is a neccessity when all other avenues have been tried.

I actually agree with you both. There is no black and white....right or wrong answer. It is all a matter of individual preference, patience and personality. I would have to ask myself if I want to patiently explore other avenues outside of surgery and dedicate myself to putting in the time to give it a real try. How much time am I willing to invest in alternate courses before choosing surgery if it ends up being necessary? Am I the type of person who can wait it out to see if the alternatives pan out before actually deciding on surgery? in the end if I need surgery......did I give up a year or 6 months trying other methods that didn't work? It really depends on what you're willing to give time wise to avoid surgery. If it ends up you don't need surgery....excellent! But if you do....are you going to be okay with the lost time of not being your best? That head slapping moment of...."I can;t believe I wasted all that time and still need surgery". It is just a matter of perspective really.

 

[jrs]

I actually agree with you both. There is no black and white....right or wrong answer. It is all a matter of individual preference, patience and personality. I would have to ask myself if I want to patiently explore other avenues outside of surgery and dedicate myself to putting in the time to give it a real try. How much time am I willing to invest in alternate courses before choosing surgery if it ends up being necessary? Am I the type of person who can wait it out to see if the alternatives pan out before actually deciding on surgery? in the end if I need surgery......did I give up a year or 6 months trying other methods that didn't work? It really depends on what you're willing to give time wise to avoid surgery. If it ends up you don't need surgery....excellent! But if you do....are you going to be okay with the lost time of not being your best? That head slapping moment of...."I can;t believe I wasted all that time and still need surgery". It is just a matter of perspective really.

This is exactly what happened to me. Like I said, I tried EVERYTHING in EVERY combination over the course of almost a year and a half. I lost everything I had ever gained in the gym and had to work to gain it all back.

** NOW, IT DEPENDS WHAT THE EXACT INJURY IS

those who suffer this condition from a seperated AC joint have a much lower chance of recovery. full open procedures have much less recovery rates than the arthroscopic route. removing too much bone means trouble.

I personally was glad I had surgery and was just done with the pain finally and I was able to resume training. The recovery time was NOTHING now that I can train as I wish, instead of always being so careful and still having the pain off and on no matter what. And if you keep the pain with you for whatever reason, and it never goes away, you have to understand that it won't magically get better.

 

[mrshoulders]

I was to a point where I couldn't lift my arms overhead. I completely stopped training. Iced. Had Active Release Therapy done. Ultrasound and chiropractic work. Stretching and heat. Swimming and ROM work. Cortisone and Anti Inflammatories. At the time, there was NO info about this procedure. Fortunately for you, I had both shoulders scoped.

I had impingement and degeneration in both AC joints. After so long I couldn't take it anymore. I could barely take a shower at this point. Everything hurt so bad from the degeneration and wild inflammation. I had one shoulder scoped, and 3 months later the next.

My only regret is not having it done sooner. In one month pre-op both shoulders I had full range of motion, and in 2-3 months I was stronger than I had ever been.

If it's structural impingement and degeneration, NOTHING besides surgery will fix it. You'll only be wasting time and money. Trust me, I know. Go talk to a sports ortho.

x2...amen bro