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Water retention/ rhabdomyolysis

TimmyTrenbolona

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This will be a somewhat complex question, looking for input from vets / people with legit medical knowledge.
Background:
I've been using for 10 years, many hormones, a few competitions, this isn't a new hobby.
I'm 29.
For past 4 years or so I've been on tren 100mg and t3 (research grade) 25-200mcg depending on goal.
During this time I started to experience cramps all over in every muscle group. Tried everything to get rid of them. Only thing that worked was salt or sodium bicarbonate. Cramps would get so bad I'm muscles would year just reaching for a glass across the table. I'm lean but when I would cramp I'd take tbsp + of salt then retain water.
So Went to doctors...at this point I was 215-220lbs.
Results: high CK levels, rhabdomyolysis, HBP (150/100 usually)
Got on valsartan.
Dropped tren, added a small amount of npp to maintain, also dropped t3 to 25mcg.
Cramps seemed to get worse... Or at least didn't get better after a couple weeks. BP dropped to an ok level but fluctuated (130/80 to 140/100)
Gained weight to 230-235 on same diet.
Decided to drop npp and add test / tren at 50mg each rd. Dropped t3 completely for a couple weeks.
Cramps got better, didn't really track bp, but still had some cramps.
Decided to add research t3 back in slowly.. Cramps came back.
Went to doc for more tests, CK levels still high, GFR was low, high BUN, bp was (140/90), urine clear.
Referred to kidney specialist. Upped valsartan dose.
Still retaining water...
Past few days dropped everything.
Don't know what to do.
I assume all this shit is caused by long term high use of research T3..
I ordered some pharma grade t3 to restore normal levels eventually.

I want to clear out my system and slow get back on. Any advice/ ideas? Could this be all t3? It all seemed to start when I started it and seems to get better when coming off. Never had issues running just gear. I've noticed cramps get MUCH worse if I even took a tiny bit of research clen. I've researched rhabdomyolysis and it says it can be caused by HYPOthyroid mainly... And the only symptoms I have are cramps and high CK, no nausea or dark urine. It's all kind of confusing
 
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Galaxe

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High ck, high BP, retaining water... Sounds like kidney issues to me. Would definitely​ get full bloods done!!

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robertfhub

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What was the reading? Ive been having issues with Ck also. 200 to 2000 is considered mildly elevated. Mine fluctuate between 400 and 1000. My problem is caused by dehydration. Now I drink a minimum of 96 ounces of water plus whatever else I can. also I started sodium bicarbonate to help flush out the kidneys. Its going down now.
 

TimmyTrenbolona

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I forget exactly, I'll look... I think between 2000 and 6000.
If I drink enough sodium I can prevent them.. The issue is I have to sometimes drink gallons of water with it which makes me retain water and look like shit. Especially in low ab/back and ankles by end of day.

What caused you dehydration? Gear/ drug related?
 

Bio

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Did you ever do any other blood work over the last 10? I would follow Emeric's protocol for TRT and leave it at that for now...High BP, CK, etc and low eGFR...not good...especially for someone as young as you!
 
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TimmyTrenbolona

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Did you ever do any other blood work over the last 10? I would follow Emeric's protocol for TRT and leave it at that for now...High BP, CK, etc and low eGFR...not good...especially for someone as young as you!
Yes. Blood work before starting t3 was pretty typical.. liver enzymes slightly high, have NAFLD which is probably genetic, liver values are always slightly high but never get higher. Cholesterol 180, slightly below average hdl. Other than that no problems, CK normal, hemo normal, t4/t3 normal. And these tests in the past were done while I was on at least test and/or tren.
I'll look into that protocol, thank you
 

robertfhub

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I forget exactly, I'll look... I think between 2000 and 6000.
If I drink enough sodium I can prevent them.. The issue is I have to sometimes drink gallons of water with it which makes me retain water and look like shit. Especially in low ab/back and ankles by end of day.

What caused you dehydration? Gear/ drug related?
2000-6000 is not good for extended periods of time. My dehydration was caused by the diuretic I am taking. Combined with a busy schedule and training. But chugging water has helped a lot. It really sucks sometimes but I keep flushing those kidneys out.
I would definitely listen to Bio. Lay off a while and normalize. Then go from there.

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TimmyTrenbolona

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I will for sure. Thanks.
Would you guys agree that this is mainly contributed by the T3 or is gear playing a role i should consider too?
It's odd ANABOLIC steroids would cause a catabolic disorder.. that's why I'm thinking it's mainly t3 but don't want to assume gear has no role in it.
 

pesty4077

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When is the last time you had your Potassium levels checked?
 

bozo_the_rot

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About a month ago. They were normal
Why do you run t3 constantly?
And why didn't this scare you enough to stop everything and let your body try and find some balance?

Stick to 250-300 msg of test only until you figure all this shit out.
Wake up! You body is firing warning shots, in coming at you hard like this because maybe you can fix shit now before its to late....I'm around your age and I love this stuff too.....but if you don't have to be on stage anytime soon to satisfy a contract to earn money....why are you adding tren in when you feel that your out of the woods? Please wake up! Tren is one of the hardest compounds on your body, maybe the hardest.....and I can see that you want to blame it on the t3 so you can still juice......please re think some things. Dialysis is a miserable cross to bear.
 

TimmyTrenbolona

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I haven't stopped tren until recently because i didn't have a reason to suspect it, having used it so long with no issues until t3. I've stopped everything now but I'm interested in why, if any reason at all, tren or test or any aas would cause this. I know tren is "hard on the body" but what physically about it would cause increased ck/mygolbulin that would then cause these odd systemic cramps. Or perhaps it only exaggerated symptoms that otherwise wouldn't exist without T3. And what the hell is in research grade T3 that would cause this because I've seen close to nothing about pharmacutical t3 doing any of this.. infact, like I said, rhabdomyolysis is a symptom of hypo not hyper thyroid.. So something else is going on with it. Either it extremely misdosed or contains something that is just not ok with my body.
 

MrF884

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I had the EXACT same issues you're describing about the cramps. Mine were scary, like I thought if I turned in bed to fast I'd teat a muscle. For me, I dropped the tren, and after a month, I stopped getting cramps. I haven't touched tren sense and haven't had any cramping.
 

TimmyTrenbolona

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I had the EXACT same issues you're describing about the cramps. Mine were scary, like I thought if I turned in bed to fast I'd teat a muscle. For me, I dropped the tren, and after a month, I stopped getting cramps. I haven't touched tren sense and haven't had any cramping.
Thanks for your reply. And yes I know exactly what you mean.. I've turned in bed too fast and woke up my gf screaming in pain lol. Perhaps tren is involved, or just makes it worse.
Just can't wait till everything leaves my system.
 

bozo_the_rot

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Thanks for your reply. And yes I know exactly what you mean.. I've turned in bed too fast and woke up my gf screaming in pain lol. Perhaps tren is involved, or just makes it worse.
Just can't wait till everything leaves my system.
Perhaps when you add the Tren in, it sky rockets your strength and you tear down the muscle in a more efficient way and not recovering like you should. Also not hydrating like you should. Is your approach to recovery just as serious as the workouts?
 

heavyhitter

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A quick google search showed that muscle pain and cramps is often associated with hypothyroidism

Muscle and Joint Pain With Hypothyroidism

Hypothyroidism can result in a variety of muscle and joint-related symptoms. Most commonly, these symptoms are fluid retention, which results in the swelling of muscles, or swollen muscles that are pressing on your nerves. Some of the problems seen include:
general muscular weakness and pain, including cramps and muscle stiffness.
general joint pain, achiness, and stiffness, known as "arthropathy."

but im not sure how that correlates with the t3 usage
 

TimmyTrenbolona

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A quick google search showed that muscle pain and cramps is often associated with hypothyroidism

Muscle and Joint Pain With Hypothyroidism

Hypothyroidism can result in a variety of muscle and joint-related symptoms. Most commonly, these symptoms are fluid retention, which results in the swelling of muscles, or swollen muscles that are pressing on your nerves. Some of the problems seen include:
general muscular weakness and pain, including cramps and muscle stiffness.
general joint pain, achiness, and stiffness, known as "arthropathy."

but im not sure how that correlates with the t3 usage
That's the paradox. I got the t3 from the same vendors and lost and maintained weight on it originally. Then I switched to trt dosage and gained a bit to be expected... tried to increase dose again and no change, actually gained weight. You'd assume the research shit would be over dosed, not under. And I'm not weaker, I'm still able to get stronger and have no "pain" per say just cramps that are painful.
I dunno the pharmacodynamics of it to piece it all together. It'll be interesting to see the effect when I get my t3 I'm a normal range.
 

heavyhitter

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Was it the same bottle of t3 or a different bottle?
 

upeccmi

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I have CKD, considered stage 3. what was your egr # and what is ck that you reference? I was diagnosed with CKD back in 2011, been taking gear for 31 years now. My high blood pressure was what caused mine. My egr was 49 back in 2011 and now its up to 54. The ck I think you are referring to (creatine Kinase) mine was 5110 then. Doc though at first I had a heart attack and called me to go to the hospital, I reminded him of my size and he said it was high cause I work out so hard. I do go to a renal doctor every 4 months for blood work now to keep an eye on things and am on BP meds for the last 6 years and things are stable. I would say get more bloodwork and make sure your BP is under control
 

TimmyTrenbolona

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I have CKD, considered stage 3. what was your egr # and what is ck that you reference? I was diagnosed with CKD back in 2011, been taking gear for 31 years now. My high blood pressure was what caused mine. My egr was 49 back in 2011 and now its up to 54. The ck I think you are referring to (creatine Kinase) mine was 5110 then. Doc though at first I had a heart attack and called me to go to the hospital, I reminded him of my size and he said it was high cause I work out so hard. I do go to a renal doctor every 4 months for blood work now to keep an eye on things and am on BP meds for the last 6 years and things are stable. I would say get more bloodwork and make sure your BP is under control
I just requested the paper work from my doc today. The gfr # I don't remember but I remember he said "it's not good". Was your urine ever dark or clear? My yea CK is creatine kinase, I believe I've tested 2000-6000, I've had multi test in past few years. I haven't taken my bp in a couple weeks but I'm on 360 valsartan and last time I think I tested 140/80. They metoprolol and amdolopine on me but made me retain way too much water. I have hctz too but don't take it in fear of cramps, although i did take some to get rid of this sudden water gain and seem to be ok.. may start regularly once they stop altogether. I do stupid shit though like drink too much caffeine and take ephedrine to stay awake at work so I'll cut that shit out and start monitoring it. Any other suggestions in regards to getting blood pressure under control and/or getting rid of the water?
I've been considering giving blood, do you think that'd help?
 
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