Why?

[b-boy]

Why don't more 212 bodybuilders enter the open division? People think Dorian Yates was on of the best Mr. Olympians ever yet small little Shawn Ray pushed him a couple times.
Hers is 1996 Mr Olympia where Shawn Placed 2nd place at 5ft7 206lbs.

 

[b-boy]

2023 Mr Olympia top 10 had like 3 former 212 guys and 1st and 2nd place were formal 212 bodybuilders.

Shawn Ray didn't need to be 220 something or 230 something to battle the giants he was only 206 in that 1996 Mr. Olympia.

 

[CorgisOnTren]

Iain Valliere pointed out recently in a podcast that 212 is really the only the division that is the exact same as another but with a “handicap”, no other different criteria that sets them apart from open besides their weight (and height in reality). Got me thinking…

 

[TheOtherOne55]

I agree. Props to John Jewett for making the jump.
Question for everyone — where would Shaun and Keone have placed in the Open class at the Olympia?

 

[b-boy]

I agree. Props to John Jewett for making the jump.
Question for everyone — where would Shaun and Keone have placed in the Open class at the Olympia?

Wow damn good question. If Keone would bring Shaun's conditioning who knows? I don't think Shaun would have cracked the top 10, Regan Grimes has improved tremendously since Shaun beat him at Legion.

 

[Quadlife]

Iain Valliere pointed out recently in a podcast that 212 is really the only the division that is the exact same as another but with a “handicap”, no other different criteria that sets them apart from open besides their weight (and height in reality). Got me thinking…

accurate

 

[b-boy]

5ft2 (like Shaun Clarida) but 200 fucking pounds. This motherfucker was legendary

 

[b-boy]

^^^ Momo would fucking beat the black off Clarida. He would have destroyed the 212 class. Imagine him with 2023 conditioning (his conditioning was top notch for back then).

 

[bbxtreme]

I think a lot of guys used to say judges preferred taller guys in the open. Which may have been the case a few years. But now we have a 5,6 Mr. Olympia who was the former 212.

Then you have Nick one inch taller competing at 260 which is the same as Cutler use to come in at. Brandon is up there as well.

Lee Priest was really the last shorter bodybuilder to make a huge impact on the open stage along with Shawn.

I think a lot of guys just don’t want to push the health envelope to reach the size it takes to be competitive. It’s cut down and struggle for the 212 and risk those health implications or push up another 10-20 pounds (if not more) to do enough to hang with the open guys now. This was Flex Lewis’s dilemma. In the end we saw what he chose.

Very few have Nick or Derek’s size capability in terms of genetics. I think those who do should jump into open now that it’s being judged more fairly for shorter guys. But for those who don’t is it worth pushing the envelope… that’s a personal choice IMO.

 

[CorgisOnTren]

accurate

Totally off topic, but was that you on Paul’s podcast recently?

 

[b-boy]

I think a lot of guys used to say judges preferred taller guys in the open. Which may have been the case a few years. But now we have a 5,6 Mr. Olympia who was the former 212.

Then you have Nick one inch taller competing at 260 which is the same as Cutler use to come in at. Brandon is up there as well.

Lee Priest was really the last shorter bodybuilder to make a huge impact on the open stage along with Shawn.

I think a lot of guys just don’t want to push the health envelope to reach the size it takes to be competitive. It’s cut down and struggle for the 212 and risk those health implications or push up another 10-20 pounds (if not more) to do enough to hang with the open guys now. This was Flex Lewis’s dilemma. In the end we saw what he chose.

Very few have Nick or Derek’s size capability in terms of genetics. I think those who do should jump into open now that it’s being judged more fairly for shorter guys. But for those who don’t is it worth pushing the envelope… that’s a personal choice IMO.

My point is 206lb Shawn Ray hung with Dorian Yates one of the best to ever do it, he beat Nasser and Dillet and Ruhl and many other HUGE MOTHERFUCKERS.
These 212 guys don't have to be 220+ lbs to compete with these guys, when Clarida is ON POINT he makes 3rd place Sampson look like a fat guy.

 

[gauge22-v2]

5ft2 (like Shaun Clarida) but 200 fucking pounds. This motherfucker was legendary

One of my favorites. RIP Momo

 

[bbxtreme]

My point is 206lb Shawn Ray hung with Dorian Yates one of the best to ever do it, he beat Nasser and Dillet and Ruhl and many other HUGE MOTHERFUCKERS.
These 212 guys don't have to be 220+ lbs to compete with these guys, when Clarida is ON POINT he makes 3rd place Sampson look like a fat guy.

I agree, but after Shawn and Lee the judges started rewarding the taller competitors IMO. Hell they even incentive guys to do it by having the class.

I’ve heard Hany talk about how they should drop the class as all these classes are ruining the sport of “bodybuilding”.

Guys like the Derek’s, Shawn’s, Claurida, and Lee Priest should all compete in the open IMO or do both if they want.

 

[buck]

If judges could ignore some ones size and just judge them solely on their physique then more smaller guys would go open. But it that were true and people were not looked favorably on as they are bigger then there would be no need for a 212 class to start with. But the heavier guy will always have an edge and win. Just human nature.

 

[bbxtreme]

The other thing I’ll add is 4X Mr. O 212 winner sounds a lot better than 3rd, 4th, 2nd and 5th place Olympia open winner.

Human nature is to go for the perceived easier target to win. Everyone wants to be numero uno.

 

[Marvin Martian]

Why don't more 212 bodybuilders enter the open division? People think Dorian Yates was on of the best Mr. Olympians ever yet small little Shawn Ray pushed him a couple times.
Hers is 1996 Mr Olympia where Shawn Placed 2nd place at 5ft7 206lbs.

And Shawn had what I think was one of the best builds ever. I never felt like he looked out of place with the big guys.
Hell man - it’s not like you are 300# and you have always looked like a freaking beast!

 

[hawkmoon]

IMO the creation of the 202 and then 212 classes sucked these people out into a division where they could be more "visible".
More classes equals more revenue for the NPC and IFBB, but not necessarily better bodybuilding.

 

[Marvin Martian]

I think the fact that bodybuilding can (should) be an optical illusion has escaped many younger cats. There is no scale on stage and a SHREDDED - awesome proportion 205 will beat a bloated looking mishmash of freaky body parts 100% of the time - if the judging is correct

 

[pickapeck]

Why don't more 212 bodybuilders enter the open division? People think Dorian Yates was on of the best Mr. Olympians ever yet small little Shawn Ray pushed him a couple times.
Hers is 1996 Mr Olympia where Shawn Placed 2nd place at 5ft7 206lbs.

Yeah he is pretty but he is on a good day 5'4" with low hips. He needs 5 inch lifts to bang a 5'6" woman from behind standing up. Ass Lee Priest. He saw it... and he fucking lost and bitched about it for 28 years. Fuck him and the Shetland pony he rode in on.

But he use to be handsome. Now he has swollen feet like a 19 year old whore on birth control and Chinese food. I have no ill feelings towards short people but if he was a woman his bottom lips would drag on the ground. Oh wait.. he bitches like an old Eastern European grand mother. Look for snail tracks.

 

[pistonpump]

Ha

Yeah he is pretty but he is on a good day 5'4" with low hips. He needs 5 inch lifts to bang a 5'6" woman from behind standing up. Ass Lee Priest. He saw it... and he fucking lost and bitched about it for 28 years. Fuck him and the Shetland pony he rode in on.

But he use to be handsome. Now he has swollen feet like a 19 year old whore on birth control and Chinese food. I have no ill feelings towards short people but if he was a woman his bottom lips would drag on the ground. Oh wait.. he bitches like an old Eastern European grand mother. Look for snail tracks.

Hate lee priest much?

What do u guys think about height class instead of weight? 5'8" and under or something like that I think that might be better then the 212 cap