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Worst drugs for heart, in your experience

Type-IIx

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The above means that the cells lining the inner wall of capillaries and the muscle cells involved in constricting and dilating blood vessels are responsive to testosterone and analogues causing blood vessels to constrict. Remember that your diastolic blood pressure is the outward force on your capillary walls. If those walls constrict (tighten) the pressure rises = hypertension. Makes meds like ARBs seem fairly uniquely useful to users of steroids.

Apoptosis (cell death) caused by reduction of electrolytes or electrolyte signaling to cell tissues. It's a push pull relationship. There is oxidative stress (oxidation) and antioxidant activity (why people take antioxidants). We need both. However, too great a shift to one or the other is not necessarily a good thing. But we know that excessive oxidation caused by many things including stress, training, environmental pollutants is not good. So people overdose the hell out of antioxidants (also not necessarily a good thing). There are free radicals and reactive oxygen species (ROS) that are produced inside cells. Also important in killing damaged or malfunctioning cells.

Mineralcorticoid Receptor (MR) but I don't need to explain why reduced Na (sodium) absorption is bad.

Here's an example of where oxidation is necessary. I intend to do a more in-depth write-up on glucocorticoids, adrenaline, and nor-adrenaline and AAS. This is actually a very complicated bodily process that is impossible to summarize in a few words. Get anxiety on steroids? That's from adrenaline. You get the idea.

The sigmoid function is a mathematical function and creates a curve that starts out relatively flat, rises steeply, then levels off. The curve resembles an "S" so it is called a S-curve. Put simply, this means that what are commonly considered weak steroids whose dose respondent curve is relatively weak until dosage is increased to where the AR and MR begin to be more saturated have a more pronounced effect which then levels off. As opposed to most AAS which just straight line right up the graph as dosage increases. This was new information to me. Not the calculus, but rather the S-curve with certain compounds.

The stronger the compound, the more heart stress. But what @Type-IIx typed above is a wealth of information and there's a lot to unpack there. This is great information for AAS users to know. He shoudn't be chastised for it. Jeeez....
Bill Roberts wrote extensively in Dan Duchaine's Dirty Dieting Newsletter (you may be able to find some free copies gathering electronic dust on the internet) about the presence (or lack thereof) of a sigmoidal S-curve in AAS dose/response (dose vs. ΔLBM), indicating that dose/response was, for some AAS, not modulated solely by the AR. This led him to a hypothesis that some AAS are synergistic. It comports with my own understanding. He was light-years ahead conceptually, but did err in his classifications, due merely to lack of identification of the mechanisms that confer synergy (e.g., aromatization as a discrete mitogenic & myogenic process; increased autocrine/paracrine IGF-I & satellite cell responsiveness; glucocorticoid modulation).

The discussions and works of authorship surrounding AAS used to be scintillating, sophisticated, engaging. These days, apparently, there's less appetite for curiosity and independent learning. BuT eInStEiN cOuLd ExPlAiN iT mOrE sImPlE.
 

OuchThatHurts

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Bill Roberts wrote extensively in Dan Duchaine's Dirty Dieting Newsletter (you may be able to find some free copies gathering electronic dust on the internet) about the presence (or lack thereof) of a sigmoidal S-curve in AAS dose/response (dose vs. ΔLBM), indicating that dose/response was, for some AAS, not modulated solely by the AR. This led him to a hypothesis that some AAS are synergistic. It comports with my own understanding. He was light-years ahead conceptually, but did err in his classifications, due merely to lack of identification of the mechanisms that confer synergy (e.g., aromatization as a discrete mitogenic & myogenic process; increased autocrine/paracrine IGF-I & satellite cell responsiveness; glucocorticoid modulation).

The discussions and works of authorship surrounding AAS used to be scintillating, sophisticated, engaging. These days, apparently, there's less appetite for curiosity and independent learning. BuT eInStEiN cOuLd ExPlAiN iT mOrE sImPlE.
It's my fault. I should have just emailed you. Then I wouldn't have had to deal with the personality disorders, delusions of grandiosity, et al. It's like an asylum sometimes. There is most likely synergy with compounds, and absolutely positively synergy between AAS and peptides. I read dirty dieting all the time bc nobody talked about these things back then. And you dared not ask.
 

[email protected]

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Thats the sad thing about the BB community.Instead of thanking for a scientific answer to a topic people get flamed because they did not explain it in "everyones language".If i dont understand a certain paragraph i google for it to see what it means.
I am not a biggest von of type-IIx as person since he flamed me on another board for an answer to a simple question and acted like ive recommended what the user was asking.
Nevertheless, his posts are excellent. And even if it was just a bunch of studies put together and copy&pasted (which i am sure it isnt).. he took the work and did it. Nothing to the flamed for..
 

NEMSZ

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@NEMSZ OK hotshot, name one concept that Einstein put into terms that you were able to understand, and explain it to us.

I wasn’t going to reply, but I’m on the toilet so I’ll take a couple minutes out of my day;

The only thing that leads me to believe you might possibly not be a fraud is that you have absolutely dog shit level social skills and ability to take a joke; you’re either a fraud or a really intelligent autistic kid that does nothing but read this bullshit all day..

I run 3 businesses and don’t make any money on a bodybuilding forum, this is just a hobby to me, and I’m here to learn..

I threw in some joking matter that was taken out of context; I even told you “not being negative” and “don’t take this the wrong way” as well as a few “lol’s” and “lmao”

If you actually had any confidence in yourself, you would’ve taken it as a compliment that you’re a really smart dude… But the fact you act like a little pussy, leads me to believe otherwise..

My 4 year old niece has thicker skin than you..

It's my fault. I should have just emailed you. Then I wouldn't have had to deal with the personality disorders, delusions of grandiosity, et al. It's like an asylum sometimes. There is most likely synergy with compounds, and absolutely positively synergy between AAS and peptides. I read dirty dieting all the time bc nobody talked about these things back then. And you dared not ask.

Now there’s you;

What can I say? Other than it’s hilarious how you tout your psychological skills and profession; it’s very clear you have a superiority complex… You don’t know a damn thing about me.. You’re a mod on a dying bodybuilding forum..

I’ve seen you literally disrespect members, cursing at them and name calling etc and whenever they fire back, you’ve banned them… I’m actually surprised you didn’t ban me for what I said earlier.. You’ve done it to me before..

You must have been one of these simps out here that got bullied, didn’t have the balls to stick up for yourself then decided on a dead end psychological career to self analyze and figure out why you’re such a…. nevermind lol… Then picked up steroids at 30 years old to finally make something of yourself on the outside because you know you’re absolutely nothing on the inside…

How big of you, Mr. Mod God, to always talk shit and disrespect members knowing that you have that little red “ban” button at your disposal and you control at least SOMETHING in life, even if it’s on the internet..

If you had a problem; mr psychology, wouldn’t a better method have been to try to defuse the situation and bring people together instead act like a baby yourself?? Hmmmm.. You’re part of the problem..

As I said, you think I’m dumb?? Fair enough, I have no problem admitting, for many things, I have a lot to learn… I have a complex? You’re here claiming to know everything lol 😂

But pull the papers out; let’s compare our lives and accomplishments…

If you’re right, and you get to be you, and I’m wrong but, I get to be me….. Then I guess being wrong is ok…

Thats the sad thing about the BB community.Instead of thanking for a scientific answer to a topic people get flamed because they did not explain it in "everyones language".If i dont understand a certain paragraph i google for it to see what it means.
I am not a biggest von of type-IIx as person since he flamed me on another board for an answer to a simple question and acted like ive recommended what the user was asking.
Nevertheless, his posts are excellent. And even if it was just a bunch of studies put together and copy&pasted (which i am sure it isnt).. he took the work and did it. Nothing to the flamed for..

Aaahhh… Leave it to a group of bodybuilders to be the most emotionally fragile people on the planet..

Maybe if you guys would actually read, and not take everything so damn seriously; you’d all be happier in life..

I didn’t say anything wrong, in fact, I was giving buddy a compliment, which is what I was more inclined to believe until he acted like such a pussy about it..

I come here, as a hobby, when I can, to learn what I can… If you have time to come on here and scroll for hours to then have to Google for 3 hours what someone could easily say in 2 Fucking sentences then by all means, go for it my friend…

I do choose to prioritize other things, though.. No one was flaming anyone…

Hope you have a Good day, gents 🫡
 

NEMSZ

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PS: Don’t delete my posts like you do to many people you argue with when you ban them… At least let people judge for themselves the whole conversation.
 

Type-IIx

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PS: Don’t delete my posts like you do to many people you argue with when you ban them… At least let people judge for themselves the whole conversation.
Well I absolutely agree that Ouch should leave your posts to fester and rot in the turgid arrogance that they so manifestly out their author as embodying. Entirely deluded by your egomaniacal and bombast insistence for recognition (oOo entrepreneurial and financial whiz-kid), your words just attest to the ugly character and malignant personality that they shat their way out of.
Thats the sad thing about the BB community.Instead of thanking for a scientific answer to a topic people get flamed because they did not explain it in "everyones language".If i dont understand a certain paragraph i google for it to see what it means.
I am not a biggest von of type-IIx as person since he flamed me on another board for an answer to a simple question and acted like ive recommended what the user was asking.
Nevertheless, his posts are excellent. And even if it was just a bunch of studies put together and copy&pasted (which i am sure it isnt).. he took the work and did it. Nothing to the flamed for..
Thanks bro, now despite your not even liking me, we can commiserate over NEMSZ's truly phenomenal unlikeability.
 

OuchThatHurts

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PS: Don’t delete my posts like you do to many people you argue with when you ban them… At least let people judge for themselves the whole conversation.
Of course I'm not going to delete them. You just proved my point. You want to see my accomplishments? Just look around the board. I've been forthcoming in posts along with pics. Now you say you were joking after being a complete prick now with this backtracking BS. Makes me laugh. And if you're half my age and worth more than me, unless you're a dot com multimillionaire, you inherited wealth because.. look I'm not getting into it.

You just insulted even more members. You ARE going to get banned for sure. But just wanted you to know that I've never banned vet members before but you gotta go. You got what you wanted. Now go play the victim somewhere else.

You'll be back.
 

[email protected]

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Aaahhh… Leave it to a group of bodybuilders to be the most emotionally fragile people on the planet..

Maybe if you guys would actually read, and not take everything so damn seriously; you’d all be happier in life..

I didn’t say anything wrong, in fact, I was giving buddy a compliment, which is what I was more inclined to believe until he acted like such a pussy about it..

I come here, as a hobby, when I can, to learn what I can… If you have time to come on here and scroll for hours to then have to Google for 3 hours what someone could easily say in 2 Fucking sentences then by all means, go for it my friend…

I do choose to prioritize other things, though.. No one was flaming anyone…

Hope you have a Good day, gents 🫡

maybe its not us that is the issue here but your self-awareness?
It is not his duty to give out free information. He does this because he wants to. Maybe there are ulterior motives like selling ebooks but who cares, he gives out free information.
Maybe if you asked friendly if he could help you to understand a certain paragraph he would - or he wouldnt, i dont know.
But instead you come over quite offended that he did not write in terms that you would have understood. No wonder he reacts like he did (but he didnt flame, he just told you he doesnt care if you dont get it)
and after that part you were the one that started the insults.

As i said, i have had my problems with him. but not over him posting in complex terms. I have no reason to defend him but in this case you are the issue.
and now go on and insult me, i guess i can live with it
 

marssel

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I have no formal schooling.
 

PRorER

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Clen made me feel like my heart was pumping out of my chest once I built up to 120 mcg. Did it work? yes, were the sides worth it, not really
 

alfresco

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There. You just summarized it.

Whoever said this to you is a complete idiot. Try explaining Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle to a 6yr-old. Have fun with that. Biochemistry is the same deal. Someone once told me that the best way to understand something, is by being forced to teach it. What specifically do you want explained to you and maybe I can dumb it down for you into more, "tren bad, testosterone good" type language.
In laymen’s terms (me) . . . The very act of measuring something effects the measurement.

Correct?
 

alfresco

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Is it that you can either know the position or the speed of an atom but not both at the same time? Or am I thinking of something completely different haha
👍

I think you got it.
 

jeroendebleser

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Why are you guys always bickering back and forth? Is "roid rage" real after all?

Just chill and let us all learn and get along along the way 😊
 

OuchThatHurts

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Is it that you can either know the position or the speed of an atom but not both at the same time? Or am I thinking of something completely different haha
Yes! And the closer you get to knowing a particle's velocity, the further you get from knowing its exact location and vice vs. It's as if the universe itself has rules that prevent us from knowing too much about it. We've hit several of these "roadblocks". Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle, Quantum Entanglement, Bell Inequalities, dark matter and energy, even gravity. Makes me lean toward intelligent design vs happenstance.

Now back to our regularly scheduled program... drug-related heart problems.

Cabergoline is not a steroid but it also has been shown to cause heart valve problems with extended use and higher doses. (i.e. valvular thickening and regurgitation)
 

jeroendebleser

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Probably TREN as far as AAS are concerned and (high dose) T3 as far as other items are concerned.

But we're all just guessing really.
 

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I must say that I believe I just read an extremely long and angry post from a man on the shitter. Content aside and staying out of it, the perceived image alone brought me a much needed smile.

To get back on topic, tren, clen, t3 in the higher range, and personally caffeine.

I still love occasionally throwing in a baby dose of Tren and do appreciate t3, but I’m a hyper reactor to heart related sides. Unlike some, I’m also blessed with the hair of a platypus so can blast mast comfortably.

The human body is a weird thing. Compounds that are great for some are horrible for another. Regular labs, occasional imaging, a journal for HR/BP and also simply listening to your body will tell you a great deal more than a bro review. Even studies we like to throw around will state things like “86%”. That still leaves 14% which off the hip I’m going to say is likely approaching about a billion people.

Worst possible drug for your heart? Probably stress and lifestyle choices if I had to guess. While respecting the forum, I’ll say I can think of 3 big drugs that were considered “rec” until very recently. Bio, I 100% agree with you and understand fully what your post was saying about forum rules, and while I already know the whys, I do think it’s important to consider that really anything which impacts sleep, eating habits, or even something that releases certain drugs to be naturally emitted is very much a piece of the puzzle. Not intending to “straw man” you, as you said nothing to contradict, simply stating that if the rule book were tossed out the window, I think the asshole that cut me off on my way to work impacts body, fitness, and heart health.
 

Cerberus777

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Most athletes,especially those who enter an anaerobic zone have enlarged hearts. Even without AAS they just make it worse. Some Dr's are reconsidering if it's a bad thing. I'd worry more about lipids, glucose sensitivity and blood pressure.
 

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