Cloudy GH Is this normal?

[janoshik]

So all peptides that are always cloudy are to be thrown away?
Since they appeared on the tables they have always been cloudy

I dare to say I've had more peptides and brands of them on hand than most people and I can assure you it is not normal.

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

Do not use Norditropin FlexPro pens where the growth hormone solution is cloudy or discoloured.

https://www.hpra.ie/img/uploaded/sw...7f7096456.000001PIL PA0218.040.011.170308.pdf

GENOTROPIN MUST NOT BE INJECTED if the solution is cloudy or contains particulate matter. Use it only if it is clear and colorless.

https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2016/020280s088lbl.pdf

DO NOT INJECT Serostim® if the reconstituted product is cloudy immediately after reconstitution or after refrigeration (2-8oC/36-46o F) for up to 14 days.

https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2006/020604s035lbl.pdf

Every pharmaceutical GH producer tells you not to inject their product if cloudy. There are roughly a dozen brands of generic GH on PM whose quality is close to pharma and which do not ever appear cloudy upon reconstitution.

So why the hell would you continue to buy from a source that can't meet this very basic quality standard. I think I know which source you are talking about. Back in April their GH was tested on another forum with less than 95% purity and more than 6.8% dimers and other aggregates.

 

[Reno911]

So yours is cloudy too from the source? I thought I got a bad batch. I feel not too worried now. But is it okay to inject eventhough its cloudy? if IGF-1 level is tested out very nicely I will be okay with it because it wont ruin my prep. I just worried its cloudy so it wont have any GH in it (degraded) which will affect my contest prep. haha I just ate chicken with sriracha sauce and its all in my nail lol.

Based on what Jano said I would probably err on the side of caution and listed to his advise.

 

[xman78]

Sigma Aldrich is one of the world's greatest exponents in the production of analysis peptides


https://www.sigmaaldrich.com/life-s...technical-resource/solubility-guidelines.html


Solubility Guidelines for Peptides
Improper solubilization can potentially result in loss of the peptide/protein and result in failure of the experiment. When available, the solubility information may be found on the product information page or on the Certificate of Analysis. If the solubility information is not known, there are at least three fundamental requirements in selecting a solvent to dissolve the peptide or protein prior to use.

Select the solvent that effectively dissolves the protein.
The solvent has to be compatible with the experimental application.
The solvent should not react with or promote degradation of the protein.
Additionally, it is always a good idea to test the solubility of a small portion of the sample before dissolving the entire sample, and to choose an initial solvent that can be easily removed by lyophilization. This enables recovery of the peptide/protein from the solvent.

Determining Solubility Characteristics
Before adding any solvent to the lyophilized peptide, it is important to evaluate the amino acid composition of the peptide as a preliminary tool in understanding the solubility characteristics of your peptide. The number and types of ionic charges in the peptide determine its solubility in aqueous solutions. In general, the more charged residues the peptide possesses, the more soluble it is in aqueous solutions. In addition, peptides generally have more charges at pH 6–8 than at pH 2–6. It is for this reason that peptides are better dissolved at near neutral pH. Among the many exceptions to the rule are peptide sequences that are very hydrophobic and those that tend to aggregate. While the hydrophobicity of the sequence is the primary cause of aggregation, peptides can also aggregate or "gel" through extensive hydrogen bonding network. The guidelines below are used to determine if the peptide is basic, acidic or neutral.

Assign a value of -1 to each acidic residue (D, E, and C-terminal COOH).
Assign a value of +1 to each basic residue (K, R and the N-terminal NH2).
Assign a value of +1 to each H residue at pH<6 and zero at pH >6.
Count the total number of charges of the peptide at pH 7 (all D, E, K, R, C-terminal COOH, and C-terminal NH2).
Calculate the overall net charge of the peptide.
Dissolving Approach for Charged Peptides
Based on the above guidelines, proceed to test the solubility of the peptide using the following strategies:

If the overall net charge of the peptide is negative, the peptide is considered acidic. If the peptide is acidic, and/or if the total number of charges of the peptide at pH 7 is greater than 25% of the total number of residues, add a small amount of 0.1M ammonium bicarbonate to dissolve the peptide and dilute it with water to the desired concentration. Make certain that the resulting pH of the peptide solution is about 7 and adjust the pH as needed.
If the overall net charge of the peptide is positive, the peptide is considered basic. If the peptide is basic and the total number of charges of the peptide at pH 7 is between 10–25% of the total number of residues, add a small amount of 25% acetic acid to dissolve the peptide and dilute it with water to the desired concentration.
If the overall net charge of the peptide is zero, the peptide is considered neutral. If the total number of charges is greater than 25% of the total number of residues, use the strategy described in section 1. If the total number of charges is between 10–25% of the total number of residues, use organic solvents (see below).
If the total number of charges of the peptide is less than 10% of the total number of residues, the use of organic solvents is recommended.
Note: it is important to dissolve the peptide completely in the initial solvent (such as acetic acid, acetonitrile, DMSO or DMF) because the rate of dissolution of the peptides into these solvents is usually higher than in a water/solvent mixture. If the water/solvent mixture is used first to dissolve the peptide, you may end up adding a much larger than necessary amount of nonaqueous solvent to your peptide sample.

For any solvent used, the maximum concentration of the initial solvent will depend on the tolerance of your assay against that particular solvent. Before trying stronger solvents, it is necessary to sonicate the peptide solution to confirm that the peptide is insoluble in the solvent. Sonication enhances solubilization, breaking the solid peptide into smaller particles. If, after sonication, the solution has gelled, appears cloudy, or has visible particulates, the peptide has not dissolved completely but is suspended. At this point, a stronger solvent is necessary. If the peptide does not dissolve, lyophilize and remove the volatile buffer solution. Once the sample is dry, alternative solvents can be tried on the same sample.

After the peptide is dissolved in the initial solvent, especially those dissolved in organic solvents, dilute the peptide by slowly adding (dropwise) the peptide solution into the buffered solution with gentle but constant agitation. This is to prevent localized concentration of the peptide in the aqueous solution, which can potentially result in precipitation of the peptide. The added benefit of this strategy is that the possibility of precipitation can be visually monitored and acted upon accordingly.

Dissolving Approach for Hydrophobic/Uncharged Peptides
The above recommendations based on the charged nature of the peptide will likely be inadequate for dissolving peptides containing more than 50% hydrophobic residues in their sequence, neutral peptides with less than 25% charges, and/or peptides that has less than 10% charges. Under these conditions, the use of organic solvents is recommended, such as acetonitrile (ACN), dimethylsulfoxide (DMSO), or dimethylformamide (DMF).

Note: peptide sequences containing Cys (C) and Met (M) are unstable in DMSO.

Addition of chaotropic compounds such as guanidine hydrochloride or urea can facilitate in breaking up hydrophobic interactions or reduce the "gelling" of peptides by disrupting hydrogen bonding network. Again, the concentration of the initial organic solvent or chaotropic reagents will be dependent on the tolerance of your assay system.

 

[Tkfkdgou21]

Will update when the source replies, It's cloudy but I'm getting the effects of it so maybe its not fake. I'm full and having vivid dreams and deep sleep. Do anyone knows if the amount of bac water when mixing matters? I want to mix with 0.7ml (its 140iu gh) to safe my bac water but it became so cloudy that it makes me worry, if I mix with 1.4ml its not that cloudy. I'm worried that if i mix with too little water the gh powder with not mix correctly so it became so cloudy. Does it really matter?

 

[xman78]

Will update when the source replies, It's cloudy but I'm getting the effects of it so maybe its not fake. I'm full and having vivid dreams and deep sleep. Do anyone knows if the amount of bac water when mixing matters? I want to mix with 0.7ml (its 140iu gh) to safe my bac water but it became so cloudy that it makes me worry, if I mix with 1.4ml its not that cloudy. I'm worried that if i mix with too little water the gh powder with not mix correctly so it became so cloudy. Does it really matter?

Try to put 1.5 ml of distilled water, since your vial are from 14 iu. I asked a peptide manufacturer, he said that cloudiness is a problem of pH of the solution, does not problem purity or degradation.

 

[xman78]

To analyze the purity, you can send a sample to the guys who here on the analysis forum, along with Mr. Janoshik. If it is less than or equal to 95% then according to my personal opinion is not good, spend money for a gh > 98% purity

 

[Tkfkdgou21]

Try to put 1.5 ml of distilled water, since your vial are from 14 iu. I asked a peptide manufacturer, he said that cloudiness is a problem of pH of the solution, does not problem purity or degradation.

Do you boil the distilled water or inject it right away to the vial?

 

[xman78]

Do you boil the distilled water or inject it right away to the vial?

Buy pure distilled water sterilized in the pharmacy, and mix 1,5ml in vial, there is nothing to boil

 

[Tkfkdgou21]

I think the GH is real but its just cloudy, i feel pumped, veins everywhere in my triceps , having vivid dreams but who knows, you lose water after 1-2 weeks off gh, so idk if its from the GH or bcs I'm off the gh. Thanks everyone for the information, learning a lot in this forum. Was worried because its my first time seeing cloudy GH after years of using just blacktops and it was clear. And the rep from the sponsor is willing to pay for testing in Janoshik, he will send his vials to jano soon.

 

[shirleydengknightlab]

I just bought GH bluetops from quite popular source here and every GH I mix is cloudy and not clear. I mix with bac water and I always mix blacks with it and its crystal clear so the water may not be the cause. I always release vacuum, and inject to the walls. I mix it with 0.7ml as the GH is 140iu and its so cloudy, I tried mix with 1.4ml and its less cloudy.

Is amount of water when reconstituting matters? Like the minimum of water to get the dose.
Will cloudy GH work? Because I'm in prep and I don't have enough money to buy other GH kits.

Here is the pic. I've used blacktops for years so its weird for me to see other color gh. I've contacted the source and she said use sterile water because it does not contain salt.

suggest don't use it

 

[timsmith125]

I just bought GH bluetops from quite popular source here and every GH I mix is cloudy and not clear. I mix with bac water and I always mix blacks with it and its crystal clear so the water may not be the cause. I always release vacuum, and inject to the walls. I mix it with 0.7ml as the GH is 140iu and its so cloudy, I tried mix with 1.4ml and its less cloudy.

Is amount of water when reconstituting matters? Like the minimum of water to get the dose.
Will cloudy GH work? Because I'm in prep and I don't have enough money to buy other GH kits.

Here is the pic. I've used blacktops for years so its weird for me to see other color gh. I've contacted the source and she said use sterile water because it does not contain salt.

it's unnormal , ask your supplier change it

 

[Boss302123]

I dont care how real it was, if it was cloudy like that I wouldn't be putting it in me. Every brand of gh I have used was clear after it settled.

 

[Tkfkdgou21]

it's unnormal , ask your supplier change it

The supplier doesnt respond, she just ask me to use sterile water or check serum test. The rep of the sponsor is planning to send vial to Janoshik. He claims he will. But I think the supplier wont do anything to solve the problem soon, and it's quite popular source here. Makes me sad people who buy 15-20kits, lucky I only bought 4 kits to try.

 

[Tkfkdgou21]

I dont care how real it was, if it was cloudy like that I wouldn't be putting it in me. Every brand of gh I have used was clear after it settled.

Maybe because I put little amount of bac water in it? If i put less its more cloudy but if put 1:1 ratio its not that cloudy. I put 1:0.5 ratio (14iu:0.7ml). People in the sponsor says its cloudy but their igf came in good and I think some are mixing with 1.4ml so they dont realize it is cloudy. At first I didnt realize it when I mix with 1.4ml then my bac water was gonna run out soon so to safe my bac water I mix my 14iu with 0.7ml and suddenly it was so cloudy like in the picture.

 

[Boss302123]

The supplier doesnt respond, she just ask me to use sterile water or check serum test. The rep of the sponsor is planning to send vial to Janoshik. He claims he will. But I think the supplier wont do anything to solve the problem soon, and it's quite popular source here. Makes me sad people who buy 15-20kits, lucky I only bought 4 kits to try.

That sounds like some shitty customer service. It like they are not even trying and dont give a flying f what happens as long as u go away. I dont care if that tested rp be some of the best gh ever I dont think I would want to do business with them

 

[Tkfkdgou21]

That sounds like some shitty customer service. It like they are not even trying and dont give a flying f what happens as long as u go away. I dont care if that tested rp be some of the best gh ever I dont think I would want to do business with them

Yes and from their perspective I have few posts so they might think I want to scam them, so I feel bad to ask for refund or replacements. I'm lucky I just bought 4 kits. Just lesson learnt and will just stay with TP's blacktops.

 

[spartan]

Everytime I mix it comes out crysal clear. With multiple different suppliers over the years. So I would have to go with the majority and say do not use it. Sorry brother but this is your body we are talking about, and I would not want you to experience any long term health issues for a bad batch. Not worth it ever. Plus at least you only got 4 kits to trial and not 10 or 20 which would be a major financial pinch! I know 4 is nothing to sneeze at but still it could have been worse. Lesson learned stick with sponsors who have always come through for you in the past. If its not broke don't try to fix it. lol I am really anxious to know who the sponsor is just saying...…

 

[Tkfkdgou21]

Everytime I mix it comes out crysal clear. With multiple different suppliers over the years. So I would have to go with the majority and say do not use it. Sorry brother but this is your body we are talking about, and I would not want you to experience any long term health issues for a bad batch. Not worth it ever. Plus at least you only got 4 kits to trial and not 10 or 20 which would be a major financial pinch! I know 4 is nothing to sneeze at but still it could have been worse. Lesson learned stick with sponsors who have always come through for you in the past. If its not broke don't try to fix it. lol I am really anxious to know who the sponsor is just saying...…

I always used TP's blacktops but recently he had little problem with some batches so I tried other source because I needed GH as fast as possible (was running out) and TP had a problem so I know his delivery will be a little slower than usual to solve the problem for people who got the bad batches.

 

[w8tlifterty]

By details here and there, I'm guessing I am using the same source as you. Mine mix up just fine w 1ml. Cloudy for an hour or so, but then crystal clear. I last ordered probably 4 months ago but have a couple new batches coming now. Will report back. My results have been as good as to be expected at this price point. If the rep says he will test, he will. He has stood by his word consistently w me. I trust him. My guess is, they will be slightly off the 14iu mark, but 98%+ and a relatively acceptable dimer %. We'll see... for the price of bronze, I don't expect gold.