Just sad to see the 90's and 2000's bodybuilders continually going thru this

[kinglewy]

I agree about the cigs and Big Macs but you forget the biggest one: Alcohol, Why don't they put up a sign in every liquor store about how many people have died/ families and lives ruined?

I agree. One thing that often gets overlooked in regards to steroids is that for the most part users have their lives together. I only talk to a few guys here where I live about it that juice (Cleveland's not a huge bb'ng place like Florida/California/Jersey) but everyone that I know is financially stable and has there lives in order. No one is stealing from mom and dad to buy their next bottle of test lol.

I have yet to see any other type of drug abuser that I can say that about. Alcoholics,crack users,heroin addicts, all of their lives are a complete mess. I for one would rather juice and live a productive life and accept the risks rather than be involved in any other addiction.

 

[red5150]

We have several health supplement threads including a couple I started and many I have contributed to. In them, I have provided tons of info...as well as many other intelligent bros. Dante and Emeric have even given a run down of stuff. I don't think we need another thread, but Dante giving us an in depth article here would be fantastic. Mike too, if he wants.

I see your point and lord knows you call people out for slothness and redundancy, but a sticky titled Heart Stack or something like that with an outline of supps and approximate dosages would be awesome and invaluable. A concise here it is Ubiquinoil xxxmg, K2 xxx mcg, Red Palm oil 2 tablespoons, pomegranate juice 4-9 oz, etc day would be fantastic. I've been trying to compile a list with dosages myself rather than standing at the supplement cabinet and just ramming 2-4 pills down of 15 different bottles. I feel like that seen of Big Lou in pumping iron.

 

[Bio-hazard]

I did the extreme abuse thing, realized wtf, Im big but I dont have a mouses fart of a chance in a hurricane of being a pro.
Now I use peps, OTC, stuff and try like hell to supplement my HEALTH.
I have more pills geared towards, cholesterol, BP, liver, heart etc...than ever before.
I did the insansity, now I cant use gear at all, but eventually Ill be able too, but looking forward Ill never do more than 750 mg of test.
WHY?
Im 260 now in decent shape, not contest ready but shit good by most peoples standards.
I dont need to be 290-310 anymore, what good is that going to do me?
I want to train, look good but more importantly FEEL GOOD.
At this weight I can sleep with no apnea by BP is under control and my acitvity level during the day is high, I dont feel like shit from lack of sleep or schlepping around an additional 40 lbs.
So what If Im weaker and cant throw around big lbs, that doesnt mean shit to me any more, I kinda get a kick out of having a 21 inch arm curling a 25 lb dumbell and squeezing the shit out of it.

Overall, I need to do better with daily supplements towards health and have a better diet. You should come on down to a nice lean fit 220 like me... trust me, the women love it :wink-wink: nudge nudge lol

 

[kscowboy]

You will see much more coming, especially from this generation.

He said he was going to collect his thoughts and then let everyone know.

I will tell you this--there are a LOT of very helpful supplements out there one can use to maintain cardiovascula health, which is by FAR the most important bodily system we need to keep an eye on as steroid using BB'rs.

I consider supplementation for to be absolutely essential for a long-term steroid user. You might be suprised at how many great supps are out there today--many with an impressive body of clinical research validating their effectiveness.

David Dearth = quadruple bypass surgery

Good morning y'all
WOW. I'm alive. Man I've never experienced anything like a quadruple bypass open heart surgery. Scariest thing in my life. Plus I had some complications..... Plus I actually woke up during my surgery. All in all though I made it through. I'm really weak but nothing some good rehab and hard work won't fix. I can't even begin to tell you all what you mean to me with all of the love and prayers and support you sent me here on FB. Of course I should have expected it because I have the greatest people on my wall in all of FB. Getting a little worn out so once again, thank you, I love you and wish nothing but peace and love to all of you



===============================================

Since everyone here cannot have serious doubt screw up their belief system when they are juicing....and you must present an argument to let you continue on juicing.... let me start the following posts for you

a) He must have had a genetic predisposition
b) He probably ate like crap
c) My brothers's uncle's barber's mailman dropped dead at 38 of a heart attack and he wasn't a juicer so there
d) {All the Young guys in forum}= Better to go out with a blaze of glory doing what you wanted and have a full life looking jacked than .....(15-20 years later) "holy shit that came quick I want to live!!!!!"

Me: I don't know what its from. I just know this. I know that there is a scary amount of bodybuilders and wrestlers dying from 34 to 55 years of age...like so much so that you forget all the guys who died until you really research and think about it. I have my wishful thinking theories that could really be fact....things like "sleep apnea in bodybuilding that is rampant but most people do nothing about" ,<--GIGANTIC PROBLEM....things like "the old timers did absolutely jack crap about estrogen and when you walk around with extremely high estrogen for years...you are asking for serious problems"<---ANOTHER HUGE PROBLEM....things like "these guys never got bloodwork and could have fixed a lot of problems that were off"......and then the truth of the matter which is painful to think about but lets get down to brass tacks......

How come in every other sport there are people who retire and its very rare to see baseball players and runners, and basketball players etc etc etc dropping dead of heart problems from 35-55 yet in bodybuilding with an abundance of cardio and supposed clean eating (way way better nutrition than virtually any other athlete) the deaths are becoming way too numerous?

Don't worry there are many guys reading this thread right now who just love juicing...their lives are built around juicing...they would feel worthless and like a nobody if they didnt have their juicing.....who are not happy that im screwing up their day with selfdoubts of "dammit am I hurting myself"?

Again I don't know the answer.....but I think we need to seek out the answer/s.

I feel bad for these young 20 something kids thinking grams and grams and Bostin Loydism cycles wont hurt them..... Life might come crashing down hard on you in your mid 30's, not your forties and fifties like these guys.

I know this has been discussed several times in the past but can each of you give your thoughts on why the 60's, 70's and 80's guys seem ok but the 90's and 2000's guys are dropping at an alarming rate or at least having major health problem. Could it be the use of more powerful and exotic steroids like Tren or Halotestin or is it the huge push within the past 20 years for everyone to use big dosages of slin and HGH. Or maybe the purity of the drugs back then compared to now. I realize monitoring your health is key as well as getting regular blood work done but i doubt the bodybuilders of the 70's and 80's that are fine today, did more health monitoring. There has to be one or two key elements that are making these guys have so many issues.

Phil i would like to hear what your opinion is on this as well.

 

[warlock]

I know this has been discussed several times in the past but can each of you give your thoughts on why the 60's, 70's and 80's guys seem ok but the 90's and 2000's guys are dropping at an alarming rate or at least having major health problem. Could it be the use of more powerful and exotic steroids like Tren or Halotestin or is it the huge push within the past 20 years for everyone to use big dosages of slin and HGH. Or maybe the purity of the drugs back then compared to now. I realize monitoring your health is key as well as getting regular blood work done but i doubt the bodybuilders of the 70's and 80's that are fine today, did more health monitoring. There has to be one or two key elements that are making these guys have so many issues.

Phil i would like to hear what your opinion is on this as well.

People are going to keep doing steroids. What I find the craziest is the amount everyone seems to be taking nowadays. Those guys back in the 70's and 80's built great physiques with a ton less gear. What were they taking? What dosages??

 

[kscowboy]

People are going to keep doing steroids. What I find the craziest is the amount everyone seems to be taking nowadays. Those guys back in the 70's and 80's built great physiques with a ton less gear. What were they taking? What dosages??

Totally agree with that. I am on Dr prescribed TRT at only 200mg ew and i look and feel the best i ever have. It really showed me the small amount i actually need compared to the higher dosages i used to run. Now obviously I'm not as big but I'm bigger, stronger and better than 95% of the people i see around here. SO I'm good with that.

 

[ryanbCXG]

Be great if you also put a thread together, a lot of people would follow it.

This for Mike A

And looking forward to Dante's post

 

[ALLEX]

I know this has been discussed several times in the past but can each of you give your thoughts on why the 60's, 70's and 80's guys seem ok but the 90's and 2000's guys are dropping at an alarming rate or at least having major health problem.

Tough to put a finger, but a few things come to mind.

- Carrying more body weight - How heavy was Arnie?
- More stressful life.
- Living in an era of stimulants and energy drinks - Kids used to smoke a blunt to chill. Now they take an ecstasy and stay awake 72 hours dancing to electronic music.
- More and more insulin and HGH = Bigger guts

 

[red5150]

Tough to put a finger, but a few things come to mind.

- Carrying more body weight - How heavy was Arnie?
- More stressful life.
- Living in an era of stimulants and energy drinks - Kids used to smoke a blunt to chill. Now they take an ecstasy and stay awake 72 hours dancing to electronic music.
- More and more insulin and HGH = Bigger guts

Arnold 235 @ 6'2" and what maybe 6%?
Branch 240 ish + @ 5'7" and sub 4% I'm guessing?

Did guys balloon up back then in ther off season or would they take time off and hit the pedal hard for contest?

 

[NY Muscle]

I LOLd when I saw this last year near me. I'm also in FL. Where are you IN FL?

Went to Disney now in port saint lucie west visiting parents. The gym is pretty nice. Fucking spotless and big. Reminds me of a Vegas style gym.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk 2

 

[NY Muscle]

In addition to all the healthy goodies I take I was rhinking about adding one more.

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000H84VZA?pc_redir=1411062002&robot_redir=1"]Himalaya Herbal Healthcare HeartCare/Abana, Heart Regulator, 240-Vcaps, 500 mg:Amazon:Health & Personal Care@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/71EhvLb9jLL.@@AMEPARAM@@71EhvLb9jLL[/ame]

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk 2

 

[Bio-hazard]

Arnold 235 @ 6'2" and what maybe 6%?
Branch 240 ish + @ 5'7" and sub 4% I'm guessing?

Did guys balloon up back then in ther off season or would they take time off and hit the pedal hard for contest?

If we go by rough basics that for every 1" of height is 9/10lbs of bodyweight... then If we bring Arnold down to 6' tall he would roughly be a competing 5/6% @215lbs.

That said, If we bring Branch up to 6' tall and add 50lb of muscle for the size difference he would be about 290lb...

Further more, almost all bodybuilders go heavier in the offseason so these body weights would only increase. So yes, weight alone can wreak havoc on the health of a body. Add in steroids in absurd dosages, alcohol, rec drugs, hgh with crazy high amounts of Tbol, Drol, Dbol, Winny... and you're body is struggling to fuctions daily.

 

[ALLEX]

Did guys balloon up back then in ther off season or would they take time off and hit the pedal hard for contest?

See if that answers your question:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uerFZ2Z42nc"]Young Arnold Schwarzenegger in Brazil - YouTube[/ame]

 

[pesty4077]

For all you young guys who think you are invincible. I am 54 and that age will come a lot faster then you think. Most of the younger crowd is in denial, we are all abusers with AAS, that is a fact. Why do we really need them? Medical purposes? Few of here fit that description. Nah, we like to see how far we can push the envelope. In the 70's and 80's, very few guys who competed in local shows that I know, would go over 1000 MG total. Too us, it was taboo to go over that amount. Now a days, I understand why they say AAS is addicting, it is. You can be in denial all you want, but that is the truth.

I just shake my head when I see ignorance when guys say I don't care about living long, just want to be big now. That is a fool. In my 50's, I am enjoying life more then ever. I feel great and want to now live another 30 years. I look at taking 750 MG of total gear like that is a big amount. At 2-5 Grams, that is insane to think you will live long. All for what? A trophy? I have boxes of them and they won't matter much when you get older or worse off dead. In life, you priorities will change. BB is not going to consume you. You will take a deep breath and be happy you are alive every day. You will appreciate your family, friends more and the fact you have a good life.

The problem here is and I can relate to it, when you are younger, you won't realize these things in life that are really important, Some will ultimately pay the price. You do know you actions effect others too? Being self center seems to be more then ever now a days. I hope for your families sake, you guys at least pay attention to guys like Dante, Mike, Emeric. These guys are decent people because they are concern about human life. They are not here to entertain you, but to educate you in life. I think now I will thank God for a beautiful wife, good children, great friends, successful business, stress free life. These are my priorities in life anymore.

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

Can you let the man gather his thoughts like he mentioned? He didn't dangle it in front of us teasing us with information he is going to withhold or charge for...he just needs some time to write it out. Trust that it's coming.

Im going to have a full stacked day of meetings today so I know I am not going to get to this today. This is going to take me a lot of time and rambling to write up....a little bit overwhelming since I feel im going to have to cover almost every gamut of everything so it all fits together. Im trying to figure out how I write this as it concerns cycling, bloodwork, and how people are using stuff because that matters incredibly as it pertains to all this

Two things I will be suggesting to people if they want to start looking in to them is

a) Citrus Bergamot (myriad of benefits including HDL raise by up to 44%)

b)Vitamin k2 (especially the MK-7 version but the mk-7 and mk-4 versions together might be the best bet)--you want to talk about something that looks like it can stop calcification and plaque and actually reverse it...here you go

 

[garcia]

To The OP, I Think That Was A Very Timely And Well Thought Out Attempt To Have People See Further Than The Section Of Forest They Are Currently Lost In. U Always AdD Valuable Content To This Board.

Sorry For The All Caps Thing. Always Happens On This Site

 

[Knight9]

Im going to have a full stacked day of meetings today so I know I am not going to get to this today. This is going to take me a lot of time and rambling to write up....a little bit overwhelming since I feel im going to have to cover almost every gamut of everything so it all fits together. Im trying to figure out how I write this as it concerns cycling, bloodwork, and how people are using stuff because that matters incredibly as it pertains to all this

Two things I will be suggesting to people if they want to start looking in to them is

a) Citrus Bergamot (myriad of benefits including HDL raise by up to 44%)

b)Vitamin k2 (especially the MK-7 version but the mk-7 and mk-4 versions together might be the best bet)--you want to talk about something that looks like it can stop calcification and plaque and actually reverse it...here you go

I can't tell you how many guys laughed at me and told me I'm an asshole when I started recommending I force heart help. Now maybe they'll listen to you with this citrus bergamot mention. It or something very close to it is the ingredient in that product.

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

Im also assuming the person reading does not have

Factor V Leiden or

the Prothrombin gene mutation

so please pertain anything I suggest that could effect clotting (Vitamin K2) to yourself...I know Emeric would have to be careful about certain things he supplements because I believe he has factor V Leiden (If I remember correctly...I might be wrong Emeric)

 

[TheOtherOne55]

how come the 70's and 80's bbr's seem to be ok?

could it be that maybe there is toxic chemicals that are in the powders coming out of china and that the 70's and 80's guys relied more on human grade gear?

NOPE...probably the sick amounts of Insulin and GH that guys in the 90s and 2000s LIVED ON.


Now that I've seen people I know personally have EXTREME health issues from GH...It's completely changed my mind on the drug. I never touched it and never will.

 

[Omega-Red]

Hi Chaps,

I am not Dante or anything in that league, but this has brought about great discussion to be honest, i thought it would be great to share experiences that has helped us REMEDY issues, i experienced a shock when i started getting blood examinations, my HCT and hemoglobin where at 58 and 19 on a very small amount of AAS and my HDL was trashed. I had a very bad diet, my blood pressure was pretty high, i suffered fairly bad breakouts on cycle and would also have high resting heart rate with quite a lot of sweating.

Since then i have remedied every single factor, irrespective of weather i am blasting or cruising my health markers are within normal ranges, my bp is great and my resting heart rate low, my cholestoral is great.

My diet outline looks like this:-

wake up:- 2 fresh lemons in warm water with a super greens mix plus 500mg green tea capsule. I also take serrapeptease at and natokinasse, which really helped with hct.

40-70mins cardio

with each meal i consume around 10-15 g of fibre. this is from veg, fruit and phys-ilium husk. I also consume 15g of good fats from oils, nuts and omega 3 eggs.

On top of this i take two "detox" health shots a day, which consist of parsley,kale,celery,cucumber,beets,lemon and watermelon.

Supplementation wise i consume :- 200-300mg ubiqiounol, 200mg resversatol, 1500mg 95% turmeric, 6mg Astaxanthin,k2 mk7 200mcg, NAC, 25mg viagra (this is now in the UK recognised as heart health treatment and recommended by doctor)

I also have around 2oz of 100% dark chocolate per day as an anti-oxidant.

I am VERY intrigued what Dante has to say. so far the above has served me very well and i just wanted to share it is all.

I also keep my estrogen levels in check all year, i blast for 8 weeks on using 2 compounds or at the most 3 in one go, doses between 750-1250mg ish total, no orals, i usually increase my cardio during this time to keep blood pressure under control. I use fast acting compounds so when i cruise i am actually cruising and do not have high hormone levels from slower acting esters.

I cruise with 25mg proviron per day , 20mg prop per day , 10mg extremstane per day. this was recommended by my doctor.

Again to finish this I am no expert, i have mainly worked with my own blood work and tried things to get everything in order for myself, i cannot wait to what the guys like Dante and Emeric who work with HUNDREDS of bodybuilders do to keep their health risk factors as reduced as can be.