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Evaluating Safer Use Models

(Peter Bond, personal communication Aug 3 2021)

I believe that trenbolone metabolites are the primary factor given the acute change without concomitant changes to eGFR & notably, the odor or scent. It's got a chemical smell to it. But it's not the sole etiology. These other factors, rhabdo, dehydration, antidiuresis, are all contributing as well.
I've never had my urine darken on tren and I've used high doses. What would you attribute that to? Good genetics? Proper health supplementation? Robust constitution?
 
I've never had my urine darken on tren and I've used high doses. What would you attribute that to? Good genetics? Proper health supplementation? Robust constitution?
Individual metabolism (genetic factors), good hydration, good training volume basically.
 
There definitely are guys who seem totally resilient to Tren. I have a bodybuilder whose lipids came back PERFECT, I mean, OUTSTANDING, after running Tren (acetate, then hexahydrobenzylcarbonate) at a moderately high dose for 12 weeks. I gave his wife a mood & anger questionnaire weekly. He was totally unaffected besides blowing the fuck up physically and strength-wise. No nightsweats. Then, there's guys at the total opposite end of the spectrum. I coach a guy in-person who at 100 mg weekly becomes a total cunt personality-wise, danger to society, sleep goes haywire, so does RHR, et cetera per his Whoop data. If I had any say in his protocol (unique circumstances) he wouldn't use tren.
 
There definitely are guys who seem totally resilient to Tren. I have a bodybuilder whose lipids came back PERFECT, I mean, OUTSTANDING, after running Tren (acetate, then hexahydrobenzylcarbonate) at a moderately high dose for 12 weeks. I gave his wife a mood & anger questionnaire weekly. He was totally unaffected besides blowing the fuck up physically and strength-wise. No nightsweats. Then, there's guys at the total opposite end of the spectrum. I coach a guy in-person who at 100 mg weekly becomes a total cunt personality-wise, danger to society, sleep goes haywire, so does RHR, et cetera per his Whoop data. If I had any say in his protocol (unique circumstances) he wouldn't use tren.
We do exist apparently. Besides a tiny bit of extra sweating, pretty much nothing else. No BP/HR increase, no negative mood changes, no sleep disturbances, no impaired digestion, no darker urine, no obvious effects on lipids...the funny thing is, 15 years ago I used to experience most of these sides at LOWER doses. Go figure.
 
Can you expand on this and it’s link to lighter or darker urine?
Sure, moderate training volumes are the "Goldilock's zone" for gains. Excessive training volumes cause all sorts of bloodwork parameters to go haywire, from (of course, this one's unavoidable) creatine kinase and creatinine, to AST, ALT, and eventually, (direct) GFR, reflecting actual decrements to kidney function. Notably, very high protein diets increase actual (direct) GFR. Basically, rhabdomyolosis occurs when volume is increased either relatively too rapidly and when volume is just absolutely too high. Rhabdo occurs on a spectrum. Rhabdo causes tea-colored urine because of myoglobinuria, basically, death of muscle fibers that leak into circulation.

I have had guys who worked as general laborers and trained daily (seven days a week, every week, 2 - 3 h sessions) come in to me remarkably fucked up and losing muscle. Just getting them to moderate and use appropriate exercise selection led to tremendous improvement.
 
I've never had my urine darken on tren and I've used high doses. What would you attribute that to? Good genetics? Proper health supplementation? Robust constitution?
I've only had dark urine on tren that's been over cooked.
 
Just to clarify - we aren't talking necessarily traditional dark urine (ie problems generally), just a noticeable amount of additional color holding hydration constant. Lots of people notice it. Widely reported. Bloods are fine. Some dip in HDL and small rise in ALT but often in range or just a few pts out. Oddly I'm sensative to water for BP and tren has actually brought my BP down a few times. Never seen it go up once but highly individual.

One can certainly drink more water and produce clear urine BUT concern here would be if tren did directly impact something and damage was happening - simply diluting the output so one offsets or doesn't see color doesn't mean it's no longer happening. Most conventional answers are as TYPEII said but figured I'd get his take as we were close to subject and I'd never heard him opine.
 
The dark urine wasn't due to how it was cooked.
I was young, it was made from pellets. And my urine was dark orange. Now I don't get any discoloration. Kidneys are good, so whatever it was, didn't harm them.
 
Trenbolone is yellow because it is aromatic and absorbs visible light in the blue and violet range and in the high red range but reflects light in the yellow range around 400 nm. The more it cooks the more it oxidizes and the more protons it loses making it more unsaturated and reflect more of the yellow and orange region.
 
Those things might all be true and yet have absolutely no relevance whatsoever to urine color.

Adam eats a package of Twizzlers.

Twizzlers are red because *oOoOoO UV light range*

Does Adam then piss red, you fucking moron?
I don't think @pickapeck was making any reference to urine color, just the color of the tren in the vial.
 
Those things might all be true and yet have absolutely no relevance whatsoever to urine color.

Adam eats a package of Twizzlers.

Twizzlers are red because *oOoOoO UV light range*

Does Adam then piss red, you fucking moron?
Beets turn urine red. So there's that.

Why don't you take a break from social media platforms for awhile.
 
Beets turn urine red. So there's that.

Why don't you take a break from social media platforms for awhile.
Worst I ever had was from Diindolylmethane. POTENT

Was like being on a gram of tren, drinking no water, and eating asparagus
 
Those things might all be true and yet have absolutely no relevance whatsoever to urine color.

Adam eats a package of Twizzlers.

Twizzlers are red because *oOoOoO UV light range*

Does Adam then piss red, you fucking moron?
It depends on the amount of trenbolone metabolites that are in each volume of urine, how it is conjugated and how much of the unsaturated system is left or modified and what is the modification. It could conceivably affect the color of urine but also I speculate there are other factors that contribute and could, for instance, be related to the use of trenbolones. Conjugates of many drugs are excreted in the urine.
 
No enlarge herat here

On for 20 years since i was 18, im 38 now

Just did test last week and im happy cause i was sure i have it
I have an enlarged chamber, the doctor who got my test asked if I was an athlete(he’s never met me) my blood work for the last 3 years nothing has been out of range. Doses are low. But unfortunately when I was young I was dumb, chronic high blood pressure, 2g of tren. Just stupid stuff. But also could be the fact I’ve been over 250 for a decade, last few years I’ve been over 275, usually 285-290.
 

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