Yates and Layne not agreeing with each other

[CDJack]

Going through this entire thread, you sure seem to know every tom, dick, and harry. Wether they be Harvard grads, Bikini Pros, best bros going to NYU, etc. etc. etc. Way too much bragging going on. All Im going to say is this, My buddy is a dentist. Went to school, and average Cs throughout school. Went to one of the best dental schools in the country. Are you saying just because someone doesnt get As, they are not bright or smart?? My friend been practicing dentistry now for over 15 years. Owns his own practice, $1.5M home.. has 4 cars Audi A8, Limited Edition Corvette, Escalade, and Range Rover. Not to mention he just remodeled his practice $500k, paid cash, and still has over $500k in the bank thats free and clear.. What you learn in school, isnt what you do in the real world, anyone that is successful will tell you that..

Anyone would love to be in Dorians shoes. I would take the advice of a former 6x Mr.Olympia, then from a guy with a degree you can do online at the Universtiy Of Phoenix..

It's not bragging...it's you guys forcing my hand by backing me into a corner and arguing with me. So i have to bring evidence to the table in the form of real people. And yes, I happen to have a lot of friends who went to good schools, and yes my wife and a bunch of her friends compete in bikini and one of these girl's husbands is a MP Pro and is friends with a bunch of other MP pros and BB'ing pros, so I happen to know a bunch of people in the industry too. I never said they were my best friends, except maybe my buddy from NYU and the guys I lifted and lived with in college.

And no I believe nowhere in any post did I say bad grades = stupid. In many cases it may just mean you are lazy or not a hard worker. And yes, many people end up successful even with bad grades. But tell me this, how on earth can your friend have gotten into one of the best dental schools in the country if he had Cs...? Something sounds fishy.

Funny observation...seems like very very few of the actual successful people in the NPC/IFBB spend any time on this forum. It's only a handful. Just a curious observation...

 

[richiec]

Yes so me getting a B in a class that I studied for so much means I didn't study right or something...lol. You don't get it man. When you go to an ultra competitive school, often times everything is curved. You're competing against the other students.

Never said you didn't study right, must be your reading comprehension. So an "ultra competitive" school grades solely subjectively since you are being graded on other students' performance, correct? Based on the above sentences, that would be your logic. If so, gotcha!

And btw, Harvard is EASY once you get in. I have plenty of friends who went there and nothing is curved. They are widely known for massive grade inflation. This is undergrad i am referring to BTW.


You dont realize how silly you sound because you've never been in any of these classes where even if you're smart and study hard, you may not do really well, because it's just that hard and you underperformed the people who did better. I dont know how else to explain this to you.

How do you know what my background in education is? I attended the most "prestigious" aeronautical university in the world, not the country, the WORLD! I've taken classes that most on here would never know existed. I am not a "brain" by any stretch of the imagination. However, when I applied myself (I had to learn what worked for me and what didn't), I was able to get good grades.


How is it ridiculous to say prestigious schools? The top schools get the best teachers, the most qualified and hardest working, smartest students, etc. It works the same in high school btw. Do you know how many kids i knew who had crazy 4.xxx weighted gpas coming into undergrad vs. my 3.7-3.8? Almost everyone...because of public school grade inflation. If i went to their school, I would have had a crazy GPA too, but the universities know that.

Constantly saying "prestigious" schools in and of itselfis a ridiculous comment imo. Ivy league schools tend to have a long history and only want the best students. Places like Columbia don't want the 2.5 gpa high school kids, who'd of thought that?! I went to a private school when I was younger also, they teach much more intensively than the public schools. You are also paying a good amount of money for that education.

You think a 3.7 GPA from some state school means as much as a 3.7 from an ivy league school? It obviously doesnt. That's because the ivy league school is harder, more competitive, etc. That's a reality.

When I was shot, I had a doctor from UF and a doctor from Duke. Duke is more well known for their medical field research/studies/doctors etc. Honestly made no difference, they were both great doctors. The only time I can see any difference in the school is in what you say below

Oh and btw, my best friend growing up went to NYU Stern business school. I was at a different school also studying business (finance and accounting). When I saw his exam material, it was basically all the easy and medium level questions from my exams. None of his problems were at the level of the more difficult ones on my exams, nor was his competition from other students nearly as hard. Needless to say, he had a higher GPA, but we got similar jobs.

I highlighted what I believe would be the difference in comparing schools. Studying at say USF compared to Columbia in a certain field will yield "better" teaching at the latter. As you said, they get the better teachers, they also pay them more and more is expected from the teachers. When we are talking engineering, there may be some slight differences, but as a whole, there won't be many. How was your friend able to get the exam out of the class? Was it a take home exam? Sounds odd to me that a college professor at any school would allow that

.

 

[CDJack]

I think I understand what you are trying to say, but god damn why do you have to come off as such and asshole douche bag? If you would chill out and stop with the holier than thou attitude people might be a little more receptive.

I don't think you can discount Dorian simply because he is a "genetic elite". He has experience training, dieting, drugging, competing at every level of bodybuilding up to and including the Mr. Olympia. I'd WAY rather hear what he has to say vs. someone like Layne Norton. Given the chance to be trained by dorian vs shelby(and I love shelby), I would pick Dorian every time. I think Shelby would too!

Bro you place way too much emphasis on education. I don't know if you were just brought up like that, if you're still young or what, but you have a lot to learn.

I swear to you I am a very humble person in real life. I don't talk to anyone about where I went to school. It seems that a number of forum members here have a very special knack at getting under my skin and putting my into a corner where my only response is to get upset and defensive. I don't see how you cannot see that. I start off very reasonable, never talking about myself, then 50 guys jump on me, start dissing me, and talking shit, backing me into a corner and forcing my hand. I wish someone could see how this is happening...

And yes, my parents didn't have a lot of money, but what they did have, the sacrificed the world for me to grow up with a great education because they believed that's what important and what would make me more successful and better off than them. My dad went into bankruptcy because he literally spent money on me that he didn't have. My parents lived their life to make mine better, and they value education. You can come up with all the example in the world of people who are wealthy without a good education, but if you are a betting man, you should bet on the odds of being successful from having a good education every day. The top job recruiters literally come to your school and recruit you on campus when you're at one of the top institutions. It's just so much easier to get your foot in the door. I don't think there's such thing as too much emphasis on education. It's one of the most important things you can give to your child to prepare them for success in life. It teaches much more than just the actual information learned in class.

 

[CDJack]

.

It was an old practice exam...i.e. an exam from the prior year that he gave out as practice...LOL. wow

I don't get most of your comments honestly. Do you understand what it means to be graded on a normal distribution? If I get 90% correct on an exam and the average was 90%, then you are in the middle of the distribution. Half of the people did better than you. A curved class would give you a grade that corresponds with that performance...i.e. in my school the middle of the distribution was set at a B. So I would have gotten a 90% and only a B. Was anyone else confused by this? I don't see how that is subjective.

 

[Delta]

I thought this thread was about Layne vs Dorian....

 

[CDJack]

I thought this thread was about Layne vs Dorian....

I tried keeping it to that too. I believe the first person to take it off topic was, phil with his re-pasting of an old thread I made, but I must be high.

 

[Kaladryn]

Actually, it was the train car example hehe

That is an example to help people understand it, not how he reach it, have you read any of his books?

 

[sloh]

Fair enough, just trying to say that you guys shouldn't immediately write Layne off lying about being natural. If you really break down his stats in terms of height and weight, it really IS NOT IMPOSSIBLE to get to his size and conditioning naturally.

As far as the bone structure goes, what I meant to say was that people like him with a wider waist and bigger joints have an advantage of registering a higher contest weight on the scale at a certain height compared to another person with a smaller waist/smaller joints. While it may look impressive on paper that they can weigh so much in contest shape at whatever height they are, the latter person would look bigger than they weigh.

Honestly if I saw him at the gym, I'd believe he's natural but again that doesn't mean anything. There are people with such shitty genetics that they barely look like that with using tons of gear. Then I know guys that could do a couple of partial reps, use a few substances in minute amounts, eat ok and look great. It's just so hard to tell. Also, on a side note, not picking on ya but, there is no such thing as big bone structure

 

[CDJack]

That is an example to help people understand it, not how he reach it, have you read any of his books?

lol i was kidding dude. Just a little test of how easily people are jumping on me here. Thought that was obviously a joke

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Yes

I think I understand what you are trying to say, but god damn why do you have to come off as such and asshole douche bag? If you would chill out and stop with the holier than thou attitude people might be a little more receptive.

I don't think you can discount Dorian simply because he is a "genetic elite". He has experience training, dieting, drugging, competing at every level of bodybuilding up to and including the Mr. Olympia. I'd WAY rather hear what he has to say vs. someone like Layne Norton. Given the chance to be trained by dorian vs shelby(and I love shelby), I would pick Dorian every time. I think Shelby would too!

Bro you place way too much emphasis on education. I don't know if you were just brought up like that, if you're still young or what, but you have a lot to learn.

Hence why I called him a spoiled brat......a wannabe control freak. Mr JACK I can read you like yesterdays newspaper......grow up man.. Ok, i'm out.

 

[JJoe156]

It's not bragging...it's you guys forcing my hand by backing me into a corner and arguing with me. So i have to bring evidence to the table in the form of real people. And yes, I happen to have a lot of friends who went to good schools, and yes my wife and a bunch of her friends compete in bikini and one of these girl's husbands is a MP Pro and is friends with a bunch of other MP pros and BB'ing pros, so I happen to know a bunch of people in the industry too. I never said they were my best friends, except maybe my buddy from NYU and the guys I lifted and lived with in college.

And no I believe nowhere in any post did I say bad grades = stupid. In many cases it may just mean you are lazy or not a hard worker. And yes, many people end up successful even with bad grades. But tell me this, how on earth can your friend have gotten into one of the best dental schools in the country if he had Cs...? Something sounds fishy.

Funny observation...seems like very very few of the actual successful people in the NPC/IFBB spend any time on this forum. It's only a handful. Just a curious observation...

So since my buddy average Cs in dental school, your saying he must not have applied himself, or he is just lazy? LMAO.. He is one of my most successful friends. He will tell you straight up, he went through school, and it was tough for him. If he didnt apply himself, he wouldnt have graduated, correct? I don't care if you believe me or not, he graduated from one of the best dental schools in the country. I have no reason to lie..

So because some of the most successful members of the NPC/IFBB dont spend time here, that is suppose to mean what exactly? Quite a few have a home, check out MD Forum.. So Phil H, isnt successful? What about Shelby? They both continue to grow with their work/business every single day.

And you dont need an education to be successful, I make more money then people with degrees, and all I have is a highschool diploma..

 

[JJoe156]

CDJack, lets here the name of this so called prestigious school you supposedly went too? Just curious..

 

[Mandingus]

I read almost all of this...st.fresno....bikini girls and var...now... What was this part about the things again?

Was layne norton trying to tell yates that his methods dont work?

 

[kingpeon]

I read almost all of this...st.fresno....bikini girls and var...now... What was this part about the things again?

Was layne norton trying to tell yates that his methods dont work?

Layne's saying that he has scientific evidence that HIT is inferior to the training method that he's researched. You gotta give him credit. It takes a lot of balls to flout a tried and true system that helped create a 6 time Mr Olympia.

I wonder if he thinks Yates would have hit his first Sandow years earlier if he had used Layne's 'Totally Ultimately Awesomer Better Than Everything Else" training system instead of HIT.

 

[tmuscle]

And btw, Harvard is EASY once you get in. I have plenty of friends who went there and nothing is curved. They are widely known for massive grade inflation. This is undergrad i am referring to BTW.

I have actually been told this to be true. Massive grade inflation occurs at top ivy league undergrad schools. Not too many people graduate with a sub 3.0 GPA i'm told, from these super prestigious ivy league liberal arts schools.

But I think it varies by school as well. I've known some people who went to a top university such as UC Berkeley who have a notoriously difficult and prestigious engineering program and barely graduate with a 2.8 and I know these guys are pretty genius, and then an idiot who went to some no-name state school who graduated with a 3.2 in the same engineering major.

The school I went to, for my major there is a 40% dropout/failure/majorchange rate because some guys just can't keep up, you just don't hear about them. And the curve I believe is set at a B- for the real core engineering courses like thermofluids, which is a 2.7.

Yet I don't know or heard of a single person who went to an Ivy league college who got a BA in Psychology or history with anything less than a 3.5. But then again those people were smart cookies to begin with, otherwise they wouldn't be there in the first place.

 

[CDJack]

So since my buddy average Cs in dental school, your saying he must not have applied himself, or he is just lazy? LMAO.. He is one of my most successful friends. He will tell you straight up, he went through school, and it was tough for him. If he didnt apply himself, he wouldnt have graduated, correct? I don't care if you believe me or not, he graduated from one of the best dental schools in the country. I have no reason to lie..

So because some of the most successful members of the NPC/IFBB dont spend time here, that is suppose to mean what exactly? Quite a few have a home, check out MD Forum.. So Phil H, isnt successful? What about Shelby? They both continue to grow with their work/business every single day.

And you dont need an education to be successful, I make more money then people with degrees, and all I have is a highschool diploma..

You didn't say the Cs were in dental school. Wasn't that obvious by my question when I asked how he got into a top dental school with Cs? Smh...

And no I absolutely would not call Phil successful. I can think of plenty other adjectives.

 

[CDJack]

I have actually been told this to be true. Massive grade inflation occurs at top ivy league undergrad schools. Not too many people graduate with a sub 3.0 GPA i'm told, from these super prestigious ivy league liberal arts schools.

But I think it varies by school as well. I've known some people who went to a top university such as UC Berkeley who have a notoriously difficult and prestigious engineering program and barely graduate with a 2.8 and I know these guys are pretty genius, and then an idiot who went to some no-name state school who graduated with a 3.2 in the same engineering major.

The school I went to, for my major there is a 40% dropout/failure/majorchange rate because some guys just can't keep up, you just don't hear about them. And the curve I believe is set at a B- for the real core engineering courses like thermofluids, which is a 2.7.

Yet I don't know or heard of a single person who went to an Ivy league college who got a BA in Psychology or history with anything less than a 3.5. But then again those people were smart cookies to begin with, otherwise they wouldn't be there in the first place.

Liberal arts at Ivy League schools is relatively very easy compared to science and business, usually because no curve.

UC Berkeley is not a top university.

Someone asked where I went...Wharton

 

[cal]

You really are clueless. And one of the most pompous self rightous people on this forum.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Yes

You really are clueless. And one of the most pompous self rightous people on this forum.

Yes he is.....and Cal, you went to a great Law School and I never ever see you bragging about it...........some people just learn tact and modesty early on I suppose..........some don't. CDJack seems like a typical Wharton grad much like Donald Trump....you can have your college if it pumps out peeps like you

 

[jaltb4k]

You didn't say the Cs were in dental school. Wasn't that obvious by my question when I asked how he got into a top dental school with Cs? Smh...

And no I absolutely would not call Phil successful. I can think of plenty other adjectives.

that statement is so completly absurd.....you should stop now while you have a shred of dignity left. most of these guys on this board will jump at a chance to set a self absorbed know it all in their place. you should stop now