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Performance Based

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For sure brother I haven’t seen your SM stuff but glad you served and are alive and got all your shit still attached. You fuckers op tempo was insane so mad respect. I never get guys getting mad either I enjoy the convo as well and on the high end science shit you clearly know more than me and I’m pretty well versed. Happy Veterans Day as well. Don’t let that ball hit the ground 😄.
Gonna make me blush baby. Cheers mate.
 

marssel

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@marssel

Didn’t want to quote the whole thing mate - replying on my phone. Big fingers, little box, little hair left to pull out, etc.

The BUDS stuff that just came out - they are not administering anabolic tests. Human performance project is inundated throughout the entirety of the NSW organization. Bi weekly bloods are done for everyone from BUDs, white roll, green team and Dam Neck as well as a myriad of other factors.

Guys are shooting for 900-1100 scores to avoid secondary testing. There was also a study that came out a few years ago across all selection events individuals with scores of like 875+ has a 80ish percentage change of graduating across the board. Guys are hedging themselves.

Your post actually brings up a different conversation completely - youth and side effects. Back in the day I would regularly run a gram of tren and 500 test, I could make all requirements. I ran that legitimately getting ready for selection and it had no deleterious affect on cardiovascular output.

Now at 35 tren even at 100mg has a severely negative impact on cardiovascular output. It could be coupled with the fact that I am 215-220 now vs. 180. I wish I was as meticulous with my data then as I am now.

Avoiding the inter service rivalry I would say there are only three organizations on this planet that specialize in DA - the command, cag and ground. Anyone looking at white side SOF as assaulters is very far off track. We all have our specialties.

Been working with some recon guys at NASAs NBL the past two years. They all put me to shame in the water. Which raises a more severe question, why the fuck does anyone still run the mk25…


Love hearing you shout out Recon (and ANGLICO) respect from each other matters more than fame in fact fame has hurt y’all more than anything. Including that bullshit about the use of CS in training as a form of hazing. After dude died and his mom went full bullshit mode I got in a lot of heated convos with civilians about y’all’s training and why guys have to die in training and often do more so than In combat. Yes technically recon, raiders, scout snipers, swic, rangers etc are all not even tier 1 or 2 “operators” but they “operate” imo but i obviously was not CAG or Delta material so there’s a lot I don’t know though I did date the ex wife of an ODA guy who became Delta and well I’ve seen some cool pics and heard some amazing shit. So I do know I don’t know a lot. Recon has gotten a lot better in the water while I was in a scuba bubble was a bfd especially if u were a jumpmaster too which was common. We didn’t get the school seats back then there are now. I have seen Seals do amazing things in the water and when I was prepping for the INDOC I was aided by an ANGLICO marine when it had been disbanded and a SEAL and I was swimming daily running fuck 7 miles a day min often doing the camp perimeter before morning pT and when we went out in the water they would take turns drowning me, literally a few times, and I was fighting back 1,000%. Now I was 19 and hadn’t gotten to anything beyond USMC WSQ but I have all of my success as a Marine owed to those two NCOs who saw a young Marine fucking off and pushed me towards my eventual path. Though looking at a Trident and gold jump wings was a huge deal to me even though I knew less about SEALS than I knew about rocket science at that point in my life. I’m 44 now and I can’t take tren. I’m running 400 of test to lose weight I just started back running for the first time in over a decade and I’m SLOW I’m talking 3 miles in 45 minutes slow but I place it more on weight than gear. Though the two are synonymous I suppose. That said appreciate the words. Stay hard. I’m happy to know that our young Devil Dogs are being trained by yourself.
 

Cerberus777

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Does it increase RBC as well or just efficiency?
Just efficiency. It was common to use with low dosage EPO or EQ to raise RBC count. But even by itself you could do cardio that would have you normally breathing very hard, feel like you could go all day.
 

Cerberus777

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@marssel you mentioned NFL, this was 12y ago but I knew a few that were pro. They told me most are doing 400-500mg test with shorts or orals here and there because they can pass test that way.
 

marssel

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@marssel you mentioned NFL, this was 12y ago but I knew a few that were pro. They told me most are doing 400-500mg test with shorts or orals here and there because they can pass test that way.
Yea that’s pretty much exactly what I had them doing was suspension with orals, not Anadrol or dball , sometimes inj winny but rarely and we kept clean urine around and epi crème jic and yea my biggest involvement was 2002-1013 so similar era along with MLB guys. 99% of the time we got a big warning about when the “surprise test” was coming. The NFL is smart it knew and was confirmed by MLB what happens when the fans find out that pretty much the whole league is on shit. Mostly bc the fans are stupid enough to believe 380 lb guys can sub sub 5 second 40s when 40 years ago that’s what the fastest guy in the league was running, supplements and training techniques don’t do that much.
 

Sixfoottwo

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Yea totally cool I’ll admit in the 80s I was still in elementary school so don’t know much about cycles then or the Army. I do love Rangers though as they are rockstars at QRF and I think they have a lot of keeping shit the same mentality as the Corps, don’t know his cycle but if he went to Ranger School then losing 40lbs natty or not is actually normal. If you go get tabbed out you’re going to lose a minimum of 20 lbs even if you’re low muscle low bf, you literally end that school with “Ranger gut” which is that African starvation belly. So 180 sounds spot on. I also don’t know how he would take shit in training. It was hard to sneak a page of a Playboy into our training so rigs and pills woukdve been impossible unles they were literally up your ass. There’s a lot of running in the military I can’t remember anyone over 200-210 lbs I knew, I weighed 156lvs at 5’7 and I was a bigger Marine.
Not from the US but former SF sniper and also no clue how one would take gear during training.

We did however have this one freak during training. He actually made it and became a demo expert. Guy was big as fuck. You know how in war movies there's always this big guy? Although in most movies he gets his ass kicked or whatever, not this guy. We called him the Sweed as in the big guy from the Clint Eastwood movie, can't remember the name.

Anyway, later on I heard that for instance some of our Marines and infantry guys where taking gear, some were pretty jacked too. I never took anything during my time in but I think it was one of the first things I did when I got out haha. Always wondered how they'd deal with coming off during deployment. Can only imagine it has to suck big time.
 

marssel

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Not from the US but former SF sniper and also no clue how one would take gear during training.

We did however have this one freak during training. He actually made it and became a demo expert. Guy was big as fuck. You know how in war movies there's always this big guy? Although in most movies he gets his ass kicked or whatever, not this guy. We called him the Sweed as in the big guy from the Clint Eastwood movie, can't remember the name.

Anyway, later on I heard that for instance some of our Marines and infantry guys where taking gear, some were pretty jacked too. I never took anything during my time in but I think it was one of the first things I did when I got out haha. Always wondered how they'd deal with coming off during deployment. Can only imagine it has to suck big time.
I was natty my whole time in too. I think if you did short cycles it might not matter. But once out I got on pretty quick. I had buddy’s on or wanted on once deployed, my biggest fear is bleeding out our blood is thicker on but it’s harder to stop bleeding I assume it’s RB to platelet ratio but I dunno, anyway getting shit over there was easy especially orals in candy and similar stuff. Oil satchets are easy and syringes are an easy get or so I was told. You get guys long acting esters and orals and they’re golden. Honestly knowing what I know now I prolly shoulda gotten on while I was deployed but I’m glad I waited until I was almost 24 to get on shit just for health reasons I think waiting til 21 is best for all dudes.
 

qbkilla

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I was natty my whole time in too. I think if you did short cycles it might not matter. But once out I got on pretty quick. I had buddy’s on or wanted on once deployed, my biggest fear is bleeding out our blood is thicker on but it’s harder to stop bleeding I assume it’s RB to platelet ratio but I dunno, anyway getting shit over there was easy especially orals in candy and similar stuff. Oil satchets are easy and syringes are an easy get or so I was told. You get guys long acting esters and orals and they’re golden. Honestly knowing what I know now I prolly shoulda gotten on while I was deployed but I’m glad I waited until I was almost 24 to get on shit just for health reasons I think waiting til 21 is best for all dudes.
I haven't got to read every post because been very busy but good insight, I plan to. Based on your experience with real athletes would you say that there are any misconception in bbing in how we view training and ped use?

Possibly that short acting drugs should be used more often, maybe eq and the, hard cardio are underrated?
 

Sixfoottwo

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I was natty my whole time in too. I think if you did short cycles it might not matter. But once out I got on pretty quick. I had buddy’s on or wanted on once deployed, my biggest fear is bleeding out our blood is thicker on but it’s harder to stop bleeding I assume it’s RB to platelet ratio but I dunno, anyway getting shit over there was easy especially orals in candy and similar stuff. Oil satchets are easy and syringes are an easy get or so I was told. You get guys long acting esters and orals and they’re golden. Honestly knowing what I know now I prolly shoulda gotten on while I was deployed but I’m glad I waited until I was almost 24 to get on shit just for health reasons I think waiting til 21 is best for all dudes.
I like hearing these stories from the US service members haha. I once spent a couple of days alongside a team of Deltas and even though they treated us as equals I still kinda looked up to them a bit. It was a cool experience.

I wasn't really interested in being big during my time in. I planned on staying way longer and afterwards probably join my countries version of SWAT or Secret Service. Did neither so when I got out I went on the juice. Have to say I wasn't aware it was that easy to get stuff on deployment, but that might partially be due to lack of interest from my side.
 

marssel

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I haven't got to read every post because been very busy but good insight, I plan to. Based on your experience with real athletes would you say that there are any misconception in bbing in how we view training and ped use?

Possibly that short acting drugs should be used more often, maybe eq and the, hard cardio are underrated?
Well I love EQ and hard and fasted cardio (nothing burns fat for me like that cardio). I’ve also had a ton of success personally and with athletes (BBers) running bleachers too especially in groups as competition is good even mixing regular clients with BBers and female bikini chics etc. now I’m not sure exactly what you mean by misconceptions but in our world there are a lot of liars so there’s that but yea in football guys do take decent doses and when I was involved with MLB (not in the last few years so there’s that) but there is a big difference between what hitters and pitchers take for sure and one of my pitchers is one of the greatest and will never get in the HOF for it. Though I doubt he regrets it. McGwires crocodile tears make me sick and I’d buy his remorse if he donated the equivalent of his salary post roids in full to charity, not income total just ALL baseball related income then I’d buy true remorse and say put him in but then again all the defenders he hit against were on shit, except pitchers they were from what I saw taking the least as far as who was and wasn’t but the best all were again I only fucked with 3 teams then so there’s that too. And yes there’s no benefit to a pitcher being bigger but batters getting jacked absolutely sped up reactions contrary to what we’d think. Also look at all the mma guys on shit if it really hurt speed or cardio they wouldn’t get on shit. My two cents all anecdotal my science came from guys like Bill W and Duchaine and after that personal experimentation
 

Orville Shreddenbacher

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Everybody in pro sports and anyone in the spotlight with anything to lose or a certain brand is gonna lie . It's called self preservation. No doubt do mma guys go above the 100 - 150 mg of test that was mentioned . They use multiple drugs and a lot of hgh . I know this from personal experience . Cardio only matters for training camps and fight day . The majority are not in fighting shape year round just as bodybuilders aren't in contest shape year round . In a sport where there's weight cuts and every pound counts there will be drugs involved . Spike Carlisle just got suspended for putting about 30 pounds back on for fight day . Try that with no diuretics and no IV s
 

marssel

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Everybody in pro sports and anyone in the spotlight with anything to lose or a certain brand is gonna lie . It's called self preservation. No doubt do mma guys go above the 100 - 150 mg of test that was mentioned . They use multiple drugs and a lot of hgh . I know this from personal experience . Cardio only matters for training camps and fight day . The majority are not in fighting shape year round just as bodybuilders aren't in contest shape year round . In a sport where there's weight cuts and every pound counts there will be drugs involved . Spike Carlisle just got suspended for putting about 30 pounds back on for fight day . Try that with no diuretics and no IV s
No shit try 12 pounds without it, maybe 10 on some wrestlers but really without drugs 8 lbs is all you can do without severely hampering your ability to utilize the weight advantage. And that’s with a sodium flush, distilled water and a sweat suit in a sauna yes maybe a fat person could do a shift but anybody rocking say 10% or less is gonna struggle. And in BZbing when you’re shredded 3lbs of water coming off alone can be a chore but also amazing as to the results. I’ve always used lasix day before, sparingly, and never had issues beyond some cramping. That point about off season fighters is really under talked about bc a lot must bulk up bc of all the weight they lose in camp. Training literally all fucking day for weeks will pull muscle and fat. And where did the fighters learn all this shit from…….us. So they of course also got our way of drugs and yea I know some very low level professional non UFC guys and they use a good bit of GH, I assume mostly for recovery and joint repair. I haven’t coached them I just bullshit with them on occasion and these are small card fighters fighting in places like Shreveport so I can only imagine what the ballers take. Even boxing, I love Manny P but no blood draw for religious reasons, as the idiot in chief would say “come on man” before he knocked out Cornpop lol
 

marssel

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I like hearing these stories from the US service members haha. I once spent a couple of days alongside a team of Deltas and even though they treated us as equals I still kinda looked up to them a bit. It was a cool experience.

I wasn't really interested in being big during my time in. I planned on staying way longer and afterwards probably join my countries version of SWAT or Secret Service. Did neither so when I got out I went on the juice. Have to say I wasn't aware it was that easy to get stuff on deployment, but that might partially be due to lack of interest from my side.
Yea the few Delta I met were chill you wouldn’t even know they were Delta. I love SEALS but just like Marines you know what they are as soon as they walk in the room and if you don’t no worries they’ll tell you. Shit I still rock a high and tight and though I have not a single tatoo everyone knows I’m a Marine. Though I will admit my truck has a lotta moto shit on it. I’ll tell you SAS dudes can be ducks but they’re cool and all the Aussies we worked with were awesome. I never really enjoyed training ROK Marines and Thai SF do some crazy shit and the jungle was one of my areas of expertise which post 9/11 was a small group, I hate the desert but still spent a lot of time there. Do love me some mountains as long as I’m not getting shot at I can literally be in heaven going up anything anywhere. Never made it to the Army’s Cold Weather Training or Mountain Warfare but REALLY wanted to. I did instruct in Jungle Warfare for a bit. I’m hoping it’s taken more serious now, Africa is a hub of activity and was before 9/11 and will be forever imo. I expect we’ll be fighting China there at some point. People always say fighting for oil is bullshit but oil is national security, period. Lithium and tin are next I think. I mean it’s all speculation but at the end of the day you kill who’s trying to kill you or other Americans. You infantry? Ever think about FFL, I did quite hard for a bit.
 

Cerberus777

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High androgens slow you down. When speed and power are required. Sprinter and race horses the protocol was winny till 3 days prior. You could pass a test and be faster. What makes for the hard grainy look is the muscle never completely relaxes, this slows you down and shortens your stride. But right when you come off your faster from the power built.
 

marssel

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High androgens slow you down. When speed and power are required. Sprinter and race horses the protocol was winny till 3 days prior. You could pass a test and be faster. What makes for the hard grainy look is the muscle never completely relaxes, this slows you down and shortens your stride. But right when you come off your faster from the power built.
I agree for the most part but the whole thread was on athleticism and that can be achieved on moderate androgens as well and winny doesn’t clear in 3 days without help
and a good brain to go with it. Just stop and you’ll be pos over a week even on oral only which a winny only cycle would make you slower anyway you have to have a base androgen equal to try to run a win only cycle effectively
 

Sixfoottwo

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Yea the few Delta I met were chill you wouldn’t even know they were Delta. I love SEALS but just like Marines you know what they are as soon as they walk in the room and if you don’t no worries they’ll tell you. Shit I still rock a high and tight and though I have not a single tatoo everyone knows I’m a Marine. Though I will admit my truck has a lotta moto shit on it. I’ll tell you SAS dudes can be ducks but they’re cool and all the Aussies we worked with were awesome. I never really enjoyed training ROK Marines and Thai SF do some crazy shit and the jungle was one of my areas of expertise which post 9/11 was a small group, I hate the desert but still spent a lot of time there. Do love me some mountains as long as I’m not getting shot at I can literally be in heaven going up anything anywhere. Never made it to the Army’s Cold Weather Training or Mountain Warfare but REALLY wanted to. I did instruct in Jungle Warfare for a bit. I’m hoping it’s taken more serious now, Africa is a hub of activity and was before 9/11 and will be forever imo. I expect we’ll be fighting China there at some point. People always say fighting for oil is bullshit but oil is national security, period. Lithium and tin are next I think. I mean it’s all speculation but at the end of the day you kill who’s trying to kill you or other Americans. You infantry? Ever think about FFL, I did quite hard for a bit.

Haha love the part about the Marines, it's so true even in my country. Even online signing every post with Semper Fi and stuff. I may sound fucked in the head but I kinda enjoyed being in Afghanistan. Not the heat but somehow the tension made me my best me if you know what I mean. I've had training in Norway where our balls pretty much froze off, been in Belize where my balls sweated off which sucked as well, of course desert training and parachuting which was my favorite, wouldn't trade it for the world. I was a green beret in my country by the way, specialized as a sniper.

If by FFL you mean the French then hell yeah I thought about it haha. I just don't speak one word of their shit language which at the time stopped me from applying.
 

Cerberus777

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I agree for the most part but the whole thread was on athleticism and that can be achieved on moderate androgens as well and winny doesn’t clear in 3 days without help
and a good brain to go with it. Just stop and you’ll be pos over a week even on oral only which a winny only cycle would make you slower anyway you have to have a base androgen equal to try to run a win only cycle effectively

Yeah detection time for winny has increased even with clearance aids now. So many are getting popped for it. I wonder if DHT suspension is being used now. I don't know any sprinters.
 

cmryan

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Yeah detection time for winny has increased even with clearance aids now. So many are getting popped for it. I wonder if DHT suspension is being used now. I don't know any sprinters.
I didn’t know such a product existed. Was methyl-DHT ever a product? I think it was. That must have been detectable though.
 

Cerberus777

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I didn’t know such a product existed. Was methyl-DHT ever a product? I think it was. That must have been detectable though.

I don't know, speculation since they still look like they're on DHT drugs but passing test that are harder to beat.
 

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