What is, in your opinion, the best "supplement" in history?

[NY Muscle]

So....you'd use fenugreek, vanadyl and a glucose drink? I might try this soon.

Yes when I do creatine again I'll be using those.

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[NY Muscle]

Fyi.

http://www.ergo-log.com/fenugreekcreatine.html

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[Knight9]

Yes when I do creatine again I'll be using those.

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You gonna take it all the way back old school and use Grape Juice too?

 

[aphextwin]

Hey Knight,

I will check out your thread on creatine, citrulline, agmatine, and beet root extract. I don't have any first experience, or knowledge pertaining to both citrulline and beet root.

However, I've been using both creatine and agmatine. I'm about to run out for a while, but I will be back soon. I will comment on your thread this afternoon.

 

[NY Muscle]

You gonna take it all the way back old school and use Grape Juice too?

Truth be told I'm tempted! but I now stay very lean alll year round so it would fuck with me mentally to get some bloat in the belly lol but I may do the fenugreek instead.

Last year when I did 5 grams 2 times a day I gained 6lbs and no bloat. I really didn't take it with much carbs just OJ or post workout shake. So i may do something like that. The water is key. I drink so much that loading week.

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[Walking Beast]

Ive found most supplements over the last 20 years to be completely useless, though there is many more good options now then in the 90s.

Protein powders are actually digestible now. Before most of them ran through me.

There is only a very few supplements that I will use, that ive noticed anything from.

Creatine (usually monohydrate)

Beta Alanine (5 grams pre workout is optimum for me)

Protein shakes (Eat mostly whole food and drink milk but these can add some nutrients. Good protein, and its easy to add carbs and calories to them).

Stimulants. Caffiene or ephedrine. Ephedrine I havent used since the ban.


Thats really it for me. I did just start intra workout drinks. So I am taking a few scoops of Pro BCAA during training. It seems it may have helped me increase my muscle endurance.

At this stage any little edge is huge. Especially since my arms are nearing the 20 inch mark and really grow at a crawl around this size. My chest and back will continue growing, legs, but arms are stubborn as fuck. So I decided to throw the aminos in intra workout.

I also take some liquid aminos before sleep usually. Six tablespoons is 30 protein according the the label. Easy to get down without filling me up.

Creatine I gain atleast 5 lbs of new weight usually and my reps increase, especially with pressing movements.

Beta alanine seems to really increase my endurance with sets and reps. And I do a shitload of volume at high intensity usually.

Stimulants , though I have a very high resistance now, give me an energy boost initially.

The only one that I always use is some type of pre workout drink. Right now im running all the ones I mentioned. Only because I wanted to get an edge now that my old size has come back (took a 10 month break)

Ive never taken vitamins consistantly.

Fiber and digestive enzymes can be good too, but those are more indirect. I dont usually take those either.

Anything with a health benefit can aid training.

KILL THAT SHIT

 

[Muay Thai]

I took vanadyl sulfate last summer and gained 10 lbs and felt toxic though it blew me up like anadrol but i was also stacking other aas

question - do you vets recommend creatine monohydrate or ethyl ester, I remember years back reading about ethyl ester being superior in some form?

my mom competed in 90s, she told me about a supplement called "hot rocks" that was powerful

 

[NY Muscle]

I took vanadyl sulfate last summer and gained 10 lbs and felt toxic though it blew me up like anadrol but i was also stacking other aas

question - do you vets recommend creatine monohydrate or ethyl ester, I remember years back reading about ethyl ester being superior in some form?

my mom competed in 90s, she told me about a supplement called "hot rocks" that was powerful

https://supplementscams.wordpress.com/2009/12/29/axis-labs-an-example-of-fraud/

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[Massive G]

https://supplementscams.wordpress.com/2009/12/29/axis-labs-an-example-of-fraud/

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I would take mono, but I will say when CEE first came out it was the most incredible supplement I ever took since I'd been off creatine sooo long, the only down side was the acidity of the product. It did work faster and at a little less dose, had somewhat of a greater absorption in my experience, got really tight strong and felt incredible on it. the stomach acid was a problem along with some issues with some flank pain.

To this day I think mono is about the same effects as CEE without the acid and probably some flank pain, but they did over promote CEE as the article says.
I think the dose was like 3 grams vs 5 for mono and that's when the BS started as really you don't need to load any creatine imo and nothing directly penetrates the cell like they claimed with CEE lol.

 

[Walking Beast]

I took vanadyl sulfate last summer and gained 10 lbs and felt toxic though it blew me up like anadrol but i was also stacking other aas

question - do you vets recommend creatine monohydrate or ethyl ester, I remember years back reading about ethyl ester being superior in some form?

my mom competed in 90s, she told me about a supplement called "hot rocks" that was powerful

I still always stick with mono. I remember through out the years trying other creatine products, micronised, etc and not getting that bodyweight swell and extra reps that I got from the old mono.

I havent used heavy supplementation in a while though, so some of those perceptions may be off.

It gets more complicated when I used creatine later on because there are more factors at play. I mainly noticed the difference back when Id take creatine mono, when I was going for bench press and incline bench press records weekly. Id usually gain like 4 reps. So Id notice it very much. My bodyweight would go up about 5 lbs too.

I still notice the 5 lb weight gain but hard to say with reps now because I train very differently now. I gain reps pretty quickly without supplementation, so its hard to pinpoint where the strength comes from these days.

I feel alot fuller on the mono though, then the others ive tried

KILL THAT SHIT

 

[Mike Arnold]

So....you'd use fenugreek, vanadyl and a glucose drink? I might try this soon.

4-hydroxyisoleucine and bis-maltolato-oxovanadium (not vanadyl sulfate, which is only a fraction as effective and considerably more toxic) is one of the most potent 1-2 insulin mimicker combos you can use. A kick-ass product is being developed that will likely include those 2 compounds, among many others.

 

[NY Muscle]

4-hydroxyisoleucine and bis-maltolato-oxovanadium (not vanadyl sulfate, which is only a fraction as effective and considerably more toxic) is one of the most potent 1-2 insulin mimicker combos you can use. A kick-ass product is being developed that will likely include those 2 compounds, among many others.

I recall Twinlab used BMOV and I think a few other GDA products out there do today as well.

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[Mike Arnold]

I recall Twinlab used BMOV and I think a few other GDA products out there do today as well.

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Yep. I first saw BMOV about 4-5 years ago, but I remember VPX including 4-HI in their products almost 15 years ago.

 

[Knight9]

Yep. I first saw BMOV about 4-5 years ago, but I remember VPX including 4-HI in their products almost 15 years ago.

So, these two compounds taken with some grape juice and creatine(5g) 6x daily for 2-3 weeks would make a huge difference vs. taking 5-10g creatine intra workout with HBCDs?

 

[flexdurden]

Yep. I first saw BMOV about 4-5 years ago, but I remember VPX including 4-HI in their products almost 15 years ago.

Mike, No-Synthesize from VPX has "BIS PICOLINATO OXO VANADIUM (BPOV)"

How different is that from BMOV in terms of efficacy?

Just doing a quick google, it seems to be effective as an insulin mimetic, but I am not seeing much research in humans...

Orally active and long-term acting insulin-mimetic vanadyl complex:bis(picolinato)oxovanadium (IV). - PubMed - NCBI

A new halogenated antidiabetic vanadyl complex, bis(5-iodopicolinato)oxovanadium(IV): in vitro and in vivo insulinomimetic evaluations and metallok... - PubMed - NCBI

 

[HTU]

The Original HOT STUFF (I think around 1990?), before it was banned and they came out with the bogus HOT STUFF II.

 

[NY Muscle]

So, these two compounds taken with some grape juice and creatine(5g) 6x daily for 2-3 weeks would make a huge difference vs. taking 5-10g creatine intra workout with HBCDs?

And LOTS of water. I'm talking 2 gallons a day.

I also never went longer than I think 7 day load period then 5 to 10 grams maintenance.

Additionally I find the best routine in the gym is to focus on more volume the 1st 2 weeks. Really push for that pump. I miss that shit lol. Old school phosphagen style.


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[Axillist]

Protein powder (My personal favorite is hydrolyzed)
Creatine monohydrate (Cheap and effective)
Agmatine/Nitrates (added pump)
DMAA/AMP Citrate and ephedra (stimulant heaven)

 

[johnjuanb1]

The Original HOT STUFF (I think around 1990?), before it was banned and they came out with the bogus HOT STUFF II.

That was the one that had dbol in it, right?

 

[JTB20]

Protein powder, musclepharm